AR's and lost coyotes

This thread has become way to complex, is has obiously struck a nerve with the AR fans. I am one myself, but the question was are you losing more coyotes since switching to an AR?. So in a nutshell your asking is the 22-250 more suited to killing coyotes than a AR in 5.56 or 223. Kinda turns the question into a dumb question. The answer has to be at least from a scientific comparison of energy transfer a yes. Thanks for asking though, I have learned a lot from the first hand experiences of those who respond.
 
Ya I'm just gonna stop with the thread. It will continue on with others trying to understand where it went. The middle to bottom of page 4 has me so confused and worked up with how many pricks are out there. I've personally only lost 4 coyotes in my life and all were within the last year due to shooting an AR. I killed probably 10 coyotes n lost 4 more with AR. I don't take my AR every stand because I love the 22-250 round. This thread was started cuz I know a few people and me included that have also had bad luck with them. Guess we all just havt to face the fact that we are poopy shots!! Haha.
 
I had to move to a bigger round,(243) because I'am not a perfect shot.
I also do all my hunting at night. Tough for me to judge distance.
But I'am still using a AR platform, DPMS LR 243. I'am not saving hides, give them to a trapper friend.
Don't give up, just keep looking for what works for you and your area.
 
Ghost
Your question is good one,a lot of people on here have been shooting coyotes since they were old enough to walk,and they are amazing shots,I am not one of them.. Coyotes were not here in Western Mass. 30 years ago,so I am by no means a Les Johnson.....My sniping rifle is my heavy barrel 22-250,my callin rifle is my AR-15.
I have severe arthritis,and my hands are deformed,so the AR is the ticket for calling.
That said I grew up shooting chucks with rifles that had nice crisp breaking triggers,when I went to the AR I had to get used to the single and double stage triggers with their creep before they break,I found that follow through,similar to archery shooting was important,that and it took me a bit to find a load that would expand well on impact instead of going trough.... That was my experience with the AR...
P.S. I have lost at lot more than four dogs in the last eight years but I have found a bunch the next day piled up in cover
a little ways from where I shot,and they were hit right in the boiler room,so I must be a crappy shot also...
 
Hey Ghost go buy an Olympic arms umar and don't look back. Best of both worlds
thumbup.gif
That way you can have the best of both worlds
 
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Originally Posted By: crittr gittrHey Ghost go buy an Olympic arms umar and don't look back. Best of both worlds
thumbup.gif
That way you can have the best of both worlds

I wanted one but read a few mixed reviews. I decided to get a Rock River. Love the gun. It is very accurate. Someday when money isn't a problem I may just get one.
 
Originally Posted By: takI had to move to a bigger round,(243) because I'am not a perfect shot.
I also do all my hunting at night. Tough for me to judge distance.
But I'am still using a AR platform, DPMS LR 243. I'am not saving hides, give them to a trapper friend.
Don't give up, just keep looking for what works for you and your area.


Best advice I've heard ^^^^^
 
is it possible that you're just a better shot with the 22-250 than the AR? For whatever reason? Years of familiarity with the rifle, better trigger, or maybe not as precise with a 2 stage on the AR for example?

I dunno, just tossing out an idea.
 
Originally Posted By: Stu Farishis it possible that you're just a better shot with the 22-250 than the AR? For whatever reason? Years of familiarity with the rifle, better trigger, or maybe not as precise with a 2 stage on the AR for example?

I dunno, just tossing out an idea.

I like to think that!!
 


If I get a coyote presenting me with a shot in this position, I like to aim straight up the back of the front leg, about 1/3rd the way up. Basically above what some might call the elbow.
 
Not an AR but a CZ550 in 243 using Sierra 85 gr HPBT's. I think I shot this coyote about 15 years ago. Believe it or not this coyote ran about 75 yards. They can be tough rascals. I thought I placed an excellent shot on him too.


 
I've been following this post since the beginning, I'm not sure I have anything of value to add but here goes.

I've killed (brought home) 34 coyotes in the past eight months. I have killed 16 with a shotgun 18 with an AR. 3 of those with 55 gr v-max and 16 with 60 gr v-max. In addition to those 34 I have knocked down about 7 more coyotes with my shotgun that just flat out ran away after I knocked them down. I determined I was just using my shotgun at to great a distance. With that experience I try and not shoot them with a shotgun (#4 buck is what I use) past 50 ish yards. Unless it's a follow up shot.

In addition to the 18 I've killed with and AR I've only knocked down (to my knowledge) one I didn't recover. I'm not particularly a good shot cause I've probably missed over 10 I plain should have killed. I still get coyote fever and get the shakes. I'm not sure this adds any light on the subject but the only other weapon I've killed a lot of coyotes with is a bow. I've hit several over the years with a bow and never saw them again but had a great blood trail for a distance then had it dry up. They are a tough tough little dog and do have a strong will to live. I sometimes think I my mind after I've downed one with a shotgun what the coyote was thinking. He gets rolled with the initial shot and after he lays there for a few seconds thinks, "hey I feel like I can still escape, so he does".

It's been good reading thanks to you all
 
The only AR15 .223 shot coyotes that made it away from me are the ones I didn't hit correctly or moved at the same time I shot thus causes for a bad placement.
 
Wow he still ran 75 yards with what looks like perfect shot placement, with a 243 none the less. I begin to wonder if a barnes tsx isn't the best round for these tough little dogs? The bullet won't splash, and won't leave huge holes. Pretty much in and out with the diameter of the bullet plus the expansion that barnes are known for. It's like looking at people in car wrecks that you swear should be dead. But dam if they don't survive. I think the will to live across the board is stronger than we sometimes give credit to.
 
I know this one is beat to death but I just can't help from throwing my hat in the ring so here goes....
I see a few plausible explanations based upon what others have suggested.
Theory #1- Shot placement: you described the lost coyotes after you hit them on running shots. This means that the shot placement was most likely a little far back given an insufficient lead which caused the spinning and shortly thereafter lost coyote. You said that with your 250 you were not losing these coyotes which given the extra ft/lbs if energy transfer from the larger caliber, a marginal shot would have more of a chance at keeping the coyote down.

Theory #2- Bullet: Choosing the wrong bullet for your intended application is where I am placing my bet. The lighter vmaxes are not good coyote bullets IMO based on my own experiences. Lots of guys have luck worth the 55 vmax in 223. And thats great. But look at a 50, 53, and a 55gr vmax side by side and you will see three very different bullets. The 53s are more akin to an A max based on their ogive, and the 55 is a flat based bullet! The 50s will splash and that's all there is to that! I am not putting any emphasis on weight, solely construction. The 52gr Sierra match is one of the best fur bullets for the 22-250 again only IMHO. Choose a better bullet like the Sierra 1365 and it may help lessen the frequency of your problem.

The heart of the discussion seemed to boil down to the ford chevy debate between the 223 and the 250 and not actually about the platform from which the bullet is launched. That one could go on forever, but suffice to say I love the 250 and now only shoot 17 rem because I love it more than the other two calibers.
It's all about shot placement no matter what you shoot them with. You can hit them with a Ford or Chevy but if you ain't driving fast enough they're gonna run off in the ditch anyway.
 
Whatever platform your choose to run will work. I have seen people take coyotes to deer with a 22 LR and not have any issues. If you are taking running shots at 150 yards then you either missed closer, or while standing still. IMO all your doing is educating them and hoping for a hit. As hunters we should all take care in making the best shot possible on any animal to minimize suffering. My .2 cents.
 
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Somebody has already suggested maybe you are just a better shot with the 250 because you are more familiar with it. I would add that it sounds like you have complete confidence in that rifle which at least with me personally plays a big part. It's hard to do everything you're supposed to do if you don't trust your equipment.

Something else to consider is your 250 is pushing bullets probably somewhere between 700-1000 fps faster than your 223, and on running shots that is huge. Your hold points should be nowhere close to the same with both guns and in the moment it can be very hard to process all that before you take the shot. It could easily be the difference between a lung shot and a a shot way back in the guts.
 
BUT, he lost them "due to the AR".

what more fact do you guys need? an AR-15 is not a suitable rifle for killing coyotes!
 
WOWOriginally Posted By: 6724BUT, he lost them "due to the AR".

what more fact do you guys need? an AR-15 is not a suitable rifle for killing coyotes!
 
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