Texas shooter reported to preach atheism on line!
- Thread starter ADK
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no idea, but I think the notion that we're all born instilled with decency & morals is self-evidently false.
what I think is moral & what the guy robbing me thinks is moral are clearly not the same thing.
what I think is moral & what the guy robbing me thinks is moral are clearly not the same thing.
swampwalker
New member
I'm sure this guy's parents were a bunch of losers, that helped foster his insanity. I think that'd be a good place to start looking as to why his brain was so disturbed.
swampwalker
New member
We're not all instilled, but enough of us are. Society wouldn't function at all if most of us didn't do the right thing. Some of us , Small percentage are phycopathic from day one.
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerWe're not all instilled, but enough of us are. Society wouldn't function at all if most of us didn't do the right thing. Some of us , Small percentage are phycopathic from day one.
So much for the silly notion that we are 'born with a sense of knowing right from wrong'.
So much for the silly notion that we are 'born with a sense of knowing right from wrong'.
Originally Posted By: Stu Farishno idea, but I think the notion that we're all born instilled with decency & morals is self-evidently false.
what I think is moral & what the guy robbing me thinks is moral are clearly not the same thing.
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerWe're not all instilled, but enough of us are. Society wouldn't function at all if most of us didn't do the right thing. Some of us , Small percentage are phycopathic from day one.
Short explanation from a book review. I haven't read the book.
http://www.wiringthebrain.com/2011/06/where-do-morals-come-from.html
The thrust of her thesis is as follows:
Moral behaviour arose in humans as an extension of the biological systems involved in recognition and care of mates and offspring. These systems are evolutionarily ancient, encoded in our genome and hard-wired into our brains. In humans, the circuits and processes that encode the urge to care for close relatives can be co-opted and extended to induce an urge to care for others in an extended social group. These systems are coupled with the ability of humans to predict future consequences of our actions and make choices to maximise not just short-term but also long-term gain. Moral decision-making is thus informed by the biology of social attachments but is governed by the principles of decision-making more generally. These entail not so much looking for the right choice but for the optimal choice, based on satisfying a wide range of relevant constraints, and assigning different priorities to them.
This does not imply that morals are innate. It implies that the capacity for moral reasoning and the predisposition to moral behaviour are innate. Just as language has to be learned, so do the codes of moral behaviour, and, also like language, moral codes are culture-specific, but constrained by some general underlying principles. We may, as a species, come pre-wired with certain biological imperatives and systems for incorporating them into decisions in social situations, but we are also pre-wired to learn and incorporate the particular contingencies that pertain to each of us in our individual environments, including social and cultural norms.
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what I think is moral & what the guy robbing me thinks is moral are clearly not the same thing.
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerWe're not all instilled, but enough of us are. Society wouldn't function at all if most of us didn't do the right thing. Some of us , Small percentage are phycopathic from day one.
Short explanation from a book review. I haven't read the book.
http://www.wiringthebrain.com/2011/06/where-do-morals-come-from.html
The thrust of her thesis is as follows:
Moral behaviour arose in humans as an extension of the biological systems involved in recognition and care of mates and offspring. These systems are evolutionarily ancient, encoded in our genome and hard-wired into our brains. In humans, the circuits and processes that encode the urge to care for close relatives can be co-opted and extended to induce an urge to care for others in an extended social group. These systems are coupled with the ability of humans to predict future consequences of our actions and make choices to maximise not just short-term but also long-term gain. Moral decision-making is thus informed by the biology of social attachments but is governed by the principles of decision-making more generally. These entail not so much looking for the right choice but for the optimal choice, based on satisfying a wide range of relevant constraints, and assigning different priorities to them.
This does not imply that morals are innate. It implies that the capacity for moral reasoning and the predisposition to moral behaviour are innate. Just as language has to be learned, so do the codes of moral behaviour, and, also like language, moral codes are culture-specific, but constrained by some general underlying principles. We may, as a species, come pre-wired with certain biological imperatives and systems for incorporating them into decisions in social situations, but we are also pre-wired to learn and incorporate the particular contingencies that pertain to each of us in our individual environments, including social and cultural norms.
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The author of the book is Patricia Churchland (seriously). She is not a scientist or anthropologist or neurologist. She is not a psychologist. She is a writer with a specialty in analytic philosophy. She recognizes the limitations of her work.
"Analyzing a concept can (perhaps) tell you what the concept means(or at least means to some philosophers), but it does not tell you anything about whether the concept is true of anything in this world."
Patricia S. Churchland
http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/q...d-148-47-34.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patricia_Churchland
"Analyzing a concept can (perhaps) tell you what the concept means(or at least means to some philosophers), but it does not tell you anything about whether the concept is true of anything in this world."
Patricia S. Churchland
http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/q...d-148-47-34.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patricia_Churchland
swampwalker
New member
Thanks for clarifying that fw. Seems simple enough.
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerThanks for clarifying that fw. Seems simple enough.
Yeah it seems pretty simple to us.
Evolution has us hard wired for the concept, and our cultures fill in the details.
It all comes back to the same basic issue....
The burden of proof to provide evidence for their outlandish claims falls right back into the laps of the theists, and they fall flat on their faces on the morality issue too.
They revert back to their big book of slavery, incest, beastiality, murder, human sacrifice, genocide, infanticide, sexual perversions, and prostitution to prove their exclusive claims to morality.
And they fail to see the irony!!
No thanks.
I’ll stick with evolution and cultural influences.
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Yeah it seems pretty simple to us.
Evolution has us hard wired for the concept, and our cultures fill in the details.
It all comes back to the same basic issue....
The burden of proof to provide evidence for their outlandish claims falls right back into the laps of the theists, and they fall flat on their faces on the morality issue too.
They revert back to their big book of slavery, incest, beastiality, murder, human sacrifice, genocide, infanticide, sexual perversions, and prostitution to prove their exclusive claims to morality.
And they fail to see the irony!!
No thanks.
I’ll stick with evolution and cultural influences.
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tnshootist
New member
I once worked in a penitentiary for a short time. Didn't like it much .
I can tell you without a doubt that some of the inmates missed evolving any morals of any type what so ever.
I can tell you without a doubt that some of the inmates missed evolving any morals of any type what so ever.
tnshootist
New member
FW I can understand your thinking as far as it goes.
It just don't go very far.
If morals are an evolved thing why don't everyone have the same morals.
Oh. It a cultural thing. So that means the parents didn't evolve morals to teach the kids.
I think this is the leakiest bucket you have tried to fill yet.
It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I guess not all atheists are upstanding moral people.
It just don't go very far.
If morals are an evolved thing why don't everyone have the same morals.
Oh. It a cultural thing. So that means the parents didn't evolve morals to teach the kids.
I think this is the leakiest bucket you have tried to fill yet.
It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I guess not all atheists are upstanding moral people.
Originally Posted By: tnshootistI once worked in a penitentiary for a short time. Didn't like it much .
I can tell you without a doubt that some of the inmates missed evolving any morals of any type what so ever.
That's interesting......
considering this:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/234653/religious-affiliation-of-us-prisoners/
Additional information on religion in United States prisons
The religious affiliation of inmates in the United States, the country with most prisoners per head globally, is reasonably similar to the religious affiliations of the society overall.
Seems like religious morality doesn't keep more religious folks out of prison for some reason.
That's just weird.
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I can tell you without a doubt that some of the inmates missed evolving any morals of any type what so ever.
That's interesting......
considering this:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/234653/religious-affiliation-of-us-prisoners/
Additional information on religion in United States prisons
The religious affiliation of inmates in the United States, the country with most prisoners per head globally, is reasonably similar to the religious affiliations of the society overall.
Seems like religious morality doesn't keep more religious folks out of prison for some reason.
That's just weird.
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do you think that you have the same morals that hillary or bill clinton do? obama?
harvey weinstien?
the jihadi that ran over all those people in NYC on halloween & wished he'd done it a litle later so he could have gotten more kids?
clearly there are differences. why?
harvey weinstien?
the jihadi that ran over all those people in NYC on halloween & wished he'd done it a litle later so he could have gotten more kids?
clearly there are differences. why?
SlickerThanSnot
New member
Originally Posted By: tnshootistI can tell you without a doubt that some of the inmates missed evolving any morals of any type what so ever.
lot of democrats in there eh?
lot of democrats in there eh?
Originally Posted By: tnshootist
It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I guess not all atheists are upstanding moral people.
All atheists are not upstanding moral people, but I'd bet that most have a better sense of morality than most christians.
Actually it doesn't bother me in the least that he claimed atheism...
any more than the fact he was a military veteran, or the fact that he was a vacation bible school teacher bothers me..
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/nov/6/devin-patrick-kelley-anti-christian-atheist-outcas/
At one point, Kelley reportedly served as a Bible studies teacher at a different Baptist church — an obvious conflict with what classmates described as his recent anti-Christian postings.
I guess not all veterans and bible school teachers are upstanding
moral people.
Originally Posted By: tnshootist
It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I'm just wondering if it's bothering you?
Are you just cherry picking again?
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It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I guess not all atheists are upstanding moral people.
All atheists are not upstanding moral people, but I'd bet that most have a better sense of morality than most christians.
Actually it doesn't bother me in the least that he claimed atheism...
any more than the fact he was a military veteran, or the fact that he was a vacation bible school teacher bothers me..
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/nov/6/devin-patrick-kelley-anti-christian-atheist-outcas/
At one point, Kelley reportedly served as a Bible studies teacher at a different Baptist church — an obvious conflict with what classmates described as his recent anti-Christian postings.
I guess not all veterans and bible school teachers are upstanding
moral people.
Originally Posted By: tnshootist
It must be bothering you that the shooter claimed atheism.
I'm just wondering if it's bothering you?
Are you just cherry picking again?
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tnshootist
New member
Nope. And it does bother me.
And no I don't always get things done right. And that bothers me.
And no I don't always get things done right. And that bothers me.
Originally Posted By: tnshootistNope. And it does bother me.
Why does it bother you?
Does it bother you that he was mentally ill, and the system failed?
Does it bother you that domestic violence kills thousands of people every year?
Does it bother you that the gun laws failed miserably, in so many different ways?
Does it bother you that our military dropped the ball and contributed to the deaths of so many of our fellow citizens?
Or are you just cherry picking atheism as the reason so many people are dead to promote your religious garbage like you always do every time you see an opening?
You have never provided a single shred of proof or evidence to support even one of your religious claims, and this time is no different.
You are putting yourself in the same category as ADK and Fursniper now.
They threw the atheist garbage on here before all of the bodies were even removed from the church where they died-just to further their personal issues.
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Why does it bother you?
Does it bother you that he was mentally ill, and the system failed?
Does it bother you that domestic violence kills thousands of people every year?
Does it bother you that the gun laws failed miserably, in so many different ways?
Does it bother you that our military dropped the ball and contributed to the deaths of so many of our fellow citizens?
Or are you just cherry picking atheism as the reason so many people are dead to promote your religious garbage like you always do every time you see an opening?
You have never provided a single shred of proof or evidence to support even one of your religious claims, and this time is no different.
You are putting yourself in the same category as ADK and Fursniper now.
They threw the atheist garbage on here before all of the bodies were even removed from the church where they died-just to further their personal issues.
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