Help me pick a bird dog breed!

I have a chocolate lab right now and hunt both upland and waterfowl. I as well have been tossing around the idea of a different breed. The best fit I have found is a wirehaired griffen. Only problem is I don't know anybody with one and would like to see their temperament. My dog is a family dog as much as he is a hunter. I would stay away from a vizsla. I had one ( but the ex-wife got him in the divorce) and he was very soft. Benn around many others and only one of the was a good hunter. A bad firework experience turned mine gun shy and ran into two other vizsla that had the same happen to them. Before anyone asks yes I gun broke him properly and was fine for two years.
Now I will most likely stay with a lab as the only flaws in the field he has are from my lack of training experience but he is still the best hunting dog I have ever had and companion.
 
You might want to take a look at an American Water Spaniel, bred to be a waterfowl retriever and great in the uplands. My Callie dog made her last retrieve at 14 1/2 and won the upland hunting competition at the AWS National Specialty.

Somehow I ended up rescueing a GWHP, after a rocky start he has turned into a hunting machine, bird scent is like a drug to him, he'd rather hunt than eat. This is his second year hunting ducks and is turning out to be a great duck dog. We shore hunt out here on the saltwater and he will not give up on a cripple. So far this year he has hunted pheasant and sharptails in SD, woodcock and ruff grouse in WI and ducks out here on the coast. Next week we leave for a month of camping in eastern WA hunting Pheasants, quail, ducks and coyotes.

If your duck hunting is alot of small ponds and creeks and rivers an English Cocker can be a great little hunting machine.

AWS
 
we have a winner in the "idiot dog trainer division"
his name is msinc ding! ding!ding!ding!ding!
now that's the truth!!!!!!!!!
 
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GWHP pointing collard doves in CO. Roosting birds are tough on a pointing dog.

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AWS
 
Originally Posted By: Outwest1we have a winner in the "idiot dog trainer division"
his name is msinc ding! ding!ding!ding!ding!
now that's the truth!!!!!!!!!

We have a winner in the "cant read a post because he's a moron" division too...probably too many big words for ya'...where out of that entire post do you get that I claimed anything at all about being a dog trainer???? The only people calling me a dog trainer is you {and that other idiot above} I am just stating facts that I have experienced, get over it. Since you two are such experts tell us exactly how you train a dog not to have hip problems.
 
Originally Posted By: msincSince you two are such experts tell us exactly how you train a dog not to have hip problems.

Find a breeder that keeps the litter together till 7 weeks of age (been shown to reduce the chance of hip problems by up to 50%) and regular exercise year round. Does that answer your question? Also barking and tearing up the inside of the truck is a training issue. I said you and your buddies. So if you see it enough it must be you or your buddies, right? Or are you one of them guys that hears something and repeats it like it's the gospel?
 
Originally Posted By: Outwest1i would'nt want to try to suggest something to a expert like you BUT it's called BREEDING!!!!!!!!!

To an extent it is. If thats all it is then you would get a lifetime guarantee on hips from breeders. But you don't. Thats the problem, everybody thinks it's just the breeding. Don't have to believe me, but do some research and talk to some vets and find out for yourself.
 
Be careful when looking for a Griffon, be sure that the line is from pure hunting stock and has plenty of drive. My hunting partner has Grifs and his first one was a pretty good dog, upland and waterfowl, one day at about 7 yrs he just up and quit hunting. Number two is great, one of the toughest hardest hunting dogs. Number three stated out good but just didn't have it, hunting was more like a walk for him and if he ran into a bird ok but didn't have the drive of a good bird dog.

He spends alot of time training with proffessionals running NAVHDA trials so it isn't lack of effort.

AWS
 
Good point AWS. Just remember that goes for any breed and it still doesn't guarantee a good dog. What you can do is stack the odds in your favor. Meet the Sire and dam. Check out a litter or two from the breeder. See if you can't meet with other owners from a previous litter. The more research you do into the kennel and litters could be the difference in a good or a great dog. Now I know there are always exceptions and you could get a great dog that is 1/4 this and 1/4 that but to me that is a big chance I'm not willing to take. I couldn't just send my pup back or give him up if he would turn out to be a dud in the field. They are part of the family to me not just a hunting tool.
 
Originally Posted By: cayotehunterWell back to the subject.......Ive got it narrowed down to either a lab or wirehair pointing griffon. Thanks for the input guys.

Get a Shorthaired Pointer. You will not be sorry.
 
msinc said:
This will probably make a few people mad but you know what they say about the truth!!! There are exceptions to every rule and no doubt every dog owner has the exception but here's what I've experienced, FWIW...



Chessies.........forget it, never seen one that was'nt mean and a biter. Problem is they get this way after you have had them for a while and invested alot of time and money. Definately a one man dog and that's OK as long as you hunt by yourself. Hip problems not so much reported as owners dont tend to keep one long enough to find out.



German Shorthairs....Pretty decent all around nice dog. Never seen a mean one. Can be a ratchet mouth but never as ridiculous as a Visla. Generally fairly well mannered if you demand it. No where near as hardheaded as an english pointer.



I have to elaborate on the Chessies. I have owned 4 of them over the last 40 years. Yes, they are a one man dog however ALL of mine loved our kids and tolerated my wife. You will never have to worry about anybody doing a B & E on your home or vehicle if there is a Chessy around. You will never have to worry about a Chessy becoming a victim of wildlife predation. These dogs take hunting very seriously, they put 100% heart and soul into it. They have unbelieveable stamina, both on the water and in the field. They swim like otters, Have noses second only to hounds and sometimes I question that. Yes, it does take a special type of owner to handle a Chessy, they are NOT for your, take him to the field a few times a year person. If hunting is your passion and addiction this breed excels. Yes, they smell but you get used to it. They will let your hunting buddy in the truck (make sure buddy gets in first and he should keep a good supply of lil Debbie nutty bars in his pocket)-(Chessies favorite snack)They say if a man has one great dog in his lifetime he is blessed. I would classify two of mine that fell in that category. I was truly blessed to have the devotion and companionship these dogs gave me for so many years. Again, these dogs are not for everybody. There is a good reason the breed still exists. I could go on and on telling tales of unbelievable retrieves these dogs have done for me. Being a two fingered typer I have already overtaxed myself.

German Shorthairs: I have limited experience only having one and still do. She is now 11 and still acts like a 2 year old. She listens well, doesn't like cold weather and is extremely self centered. High strung to an extent, especially if I pick up a gun she is bouncing off the walls. She is a very devoted hunter and still pushes herself to the point of exhaustion. I am certain for every mile I walk she covers 10. I only take her out for a couple hours at a time anymore. I don't believe I would ever get another as they are specialized more to warm climates and upland hunting. Mine is one of the few shorthairs I have seen that will retrieve from water. Really surprised me in SD a few years ago by breaking skim ice for 50 yards to pick up a pheasant. (had to get her back to a warm truck right after). These are my experiences with two of the breeds listed previously and not sales pitches or condemnations. Best of luck with your new hunting partner..........
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Originally Posted By: Ugly Dogdrahthaar

That's a great recommendation!

They hunt and train very different than a lab! I also love my lab who is trained to the Senior Hunter level!
If you hunt more waterfowl than upland by a large margin then stick with a well trained lab. If you really hunt upland and waterfowl all the time give the Drahthaar a try, you will not be disappointed!

Regards,
 
For waterfowl and bigger upland game like pheasants I would stick to labs myself. However I haven't hunted much behind anything else up here in Nodak
 
+ 1 for labs.

My brother in law has a 2 year old lab that got his upland title at a year old. This dog can do it all. By far the best waterfowling dog around. He brought back two geese on one retrieve once. The dog can do blind retrieves out to 100 yards. If you tell him to do something he does it. Has never been agressive towards andthing. But on the other hand my friends have a 1 year old lab that cant do a [beeep] thing to save his own life.

What im saying is that its all about the training. The more time and effort you pit into the dog the better hunter it will be. So it doesnt matter what kind of dog you get just make sure to train him right.
 
I grew up with and still have Elhew english pointers. Love the dogs, hard hunters and easy to handle. I've seen and have had experience with other strains of english pointers and you might as well try to bird hunt with a half broke racehorse...lol I don't use them in the water though. Had a German Shorthair that worked well in the water but it will come down to personal preference.
 
Another + on the GWP/Drathaar. Love 'em. I was raised with labs all my life, so I wanted something different and ended up getting a shorthair. He was a great dog and pointed a lot of birds and could track like no other. He hated the water though and would only go in if there was a bird in it. Three years ago I got a GWP female and it is night and day difference. I bought her brother also and gave him to my dad. Both dogs will hunt from the time you get out of the truck to the time you get back and that is covering ten times the ground that you do. Water is no problem. Flying leaps like dock dog champions. Heck they go in the water just for fun and they have outlasted my arm from an hour straight of throwing a dummy in the lake. Even temperament and a great around the house dog. Sophie would be a lap dog if I let her. The only drawbacks that I can see is they are true athletes and need exercise all the time (which is not really a drawback as it gets you out of the house to) and they are wired to hunt fur and game and that never shuts off. Even though Sophie knows the cat is off limits she still tries to take a bite out of him every know and then.

Here is a pic of my dad's dog Sage a few years back with my sons first blue grouse:

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Here is Sophie at 9 months after running over a covey of blue grouse on a hike.

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