243 WSSM vs 25 WSSM an apples to apples comparison.

Aw sheesh.

Sir, I'm not arguing against you.
F.w.i.w., I happen to currently have 5 DTECH uppers out of the 8 I've owned. Two of which are WSSMs, so REALLY I'm not arguing against you.

If anything, my rambling & speculative post was something more for the casual reader to digest & deliberate.

Quote:Who say the A-max is going 3000 FPS?
I stated it was a guesstimate. And that is why I asked you to provide your actual data, instead of me guessing.
So then, how fast IS your 105 Amax load running?

Quote:How do you know it is MOA, I hope you are not counting on those numbers as a guarantee at 900?

I think you may have mis-interpreted what I typed.

When I stated "AND they stay within 1 MOA of wind the whole way" I was referring to how much wind drift each bullet had at distance. To elaborate:
The 87gr Vmax will stay within one minute of angle (1 MOA) of the 105gr Amax for windage correction out to 900yds, when launched at those respective velocities.

Example:
87gr Vmax 3250fps 600yds
Elevation UP from 100yd zero: 10.75 MOA Windage (10 mph) 4.75 MOA
105grAmax 3000fps, 600yds
Elevation UP from 100yd zero: 11.75 MOA Windage (10 mph) 4.00 MOA

So, according to my ballistic program, the 87Vmax shoots flatter, but the 105Amax allows 0.75 MOA LESS wind correction. Hence, "staying within 1 MOA of wind"

Hope that clarified what I was trying to illustrate.
And sorry for the confusion...






 
Knockem, Its all good.
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But no statment about my Real Life Target........

I did not use a computer program to shoot it.
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When you can do it with that 87gr V-Max, I will step up! I am the only one showing real world, not some so called numbers with the WSSM's!
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HERE's your official Predator Master's Target to download for free
(The guy who designed that target to share here did so precisely for this type of occasion)

Sorry, I don't own a .243 Wizzer though.
Is it OK if I "step up" & use a .223 Wizzer instead?
I'm about to work a load up for it, so you've got a distinct advantage with your bugholing 105s
Plus, I can't shoot worth a hill o' beans!

Wadda ya say? Could be fun!

Here's my lil' old pea shooter...

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And did you want me to "step up" & start @ 300yds or is that too close for you?

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lemme know
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I know Knockem,

Your that Great Ex-Moderator who everyone has on this pedestal because you’re the great Hunter……waiting like a shark….everyone holds you in high esteem.

I thought the great one used a 25 WSSM…...Now a 223……Your not the only one that make long-distance shoots…...I just do not post them or look for the following from others.

What happened to the Great 87gr V-Max…….

I’m your Huckleberry!
 
Hey Cody, that's a fresh 22" 1:8 twister Shilen Select Mike screwed on for me & trued everything up. I re-destroyed the upper with the rattle can to squeeze all the accuracy out of it. Only messed with some 65gr Gamekings so far, but they made me smile. Krylon works!

I've got a hankering to mess with this bunch of 75gr Amaxs for it. Soon, real soon. If they'll go 3350+, I'll be like a pig wallowing in fresh poop!!! Loaded mag. length, of course...
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mbk, YOU'RE no daisy!
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go easy on me, will ya?
Whomever PM'ed you a 'heads up' about me was being very thoughtful
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I really don't want you to embarrass me on the interweb, but you already did...
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(I like the new spread of smileys too)

Fact remains that I was simply putting up some numbers to back up my preference for recommending running an 87 in the .243Wizzer. Is that still so hard to understand?
After all, it was you who asked ME why, remember???

SO how fast WAS that 105 Amax running again? (3rd time now)
 
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We are past the speed of the A-Max, You made the call out!

I said it was all good…..you made the first embarrassing comment when you said no respect for the target……remember, 5 with 5!

All I did was make a comment about you going first when you made your 5 on 5 comment, now you got the new barreled gun out…well [beeep]! It sounds like a Friday night!

We can keep it in public if you want…...it’s up to you.

No One PM'ed me! Remember NO ONE said anything to me!

I’M done talking…..let me know where to mail/send the target!
 
Relax dude
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It IS all good!
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You were having some fun with back & forth with ricky and I'm having fun with some back & forth with you.
I don't see the difference?

(Short bit of 'history' for you)
These types of exchanges are part & parcel as to why I'm not a moderator here anymore. By the time I decided to step down, it had gotten too stressful 'online' to be much fun at all anymore. So I faded back into obscurity, kinda
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See how my screen name DOES NOT say "retired PM Staff" under it?
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Heck, if we can't play 'point--->counterpoint', then what the heck is an internet forum good for?

And if we all thought alike, we could just set up two email addys for ourselves and send messages back * forth to ourselves...
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All by ourself...
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(these smileys ARE great)

As for your group photo, I'm very sorry but I don't think a single group proves much of anything. Sure, that is a good group, but it doesn't prove anything. That topic gets beaten around like pummeled horse & I'm of the opinion that a single group photo is not providing enough evidence to hold up in court.
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Especially over the internet where 1/4 moa rifles grow on trees!!!

So in that instance, you went 'fishing' for a comment that I rarely, if ever, volunteer, so I responded as such. Ya gotta see the satire there?
Maybe just a little???

Heck, if ya DO shoot that 5 shot target, post it up here
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It's really really good advertising for Dtech, and I'm all about that since I'm a diehard as well
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Take a sec and read through this thread again and you'll see that in my first post, I was actually agreeing with YOU that the comparison was not a fair one, LOL! I never poop'ed on your 105 Amaxs (I've shot them some myself in bolt guns) Just offered another alternate! that's all...

You sure as 'chit don't need an endorsement from anyone to run a certain bullet.
Shoot what ya like and have fun with it!

I know I'm gonna have fun wringing out my new Wizzer...

(And I really was curious as to how fast your Wizzer pushed the 105s, since I have some experience with them)
No matter now...

And I was just 'razzing' ya about the PMs! (if you noticed I edited that in, for effect)
I'd sure hope that nobody sees me as a 'threat' enough to do that kinda thing
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Anyhoo, please don't take ME seriously! I'm sure these guys here who've met me in person will tell you I'm a complete joke. Right guys???
 
Gentlemen, Have we reached an agreeable point for disagreement??
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Before this starts getting to personality involved???
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I love discussions based on facts...They are enlightening and interesting... When we start getting into personalities and negative comments on a personal level, then it gets really boring...
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Relax……I am relaxed…..I am as relaxed as I was yesterday after my massage from the Vietnamese woman without the happy ending.

It Is all good!....This is what I have been saying!

Back and forth? I thought we moved to a friendly competition already.

I did have fun with Ricky and he had fun too! He had something to get off his chest and he now he feels better.

The difference? You have been slighting the larger bullets for a while in the 243 WSSM with your great wisdom in other topics. I pointed out your flaws then.

I do not care about your history, I just see a guy with a whole lot of posts and that must make him an expert.

We do play point--->counterpoint but the internet forum should include the truth, you have an opinion on almost everything, I see and it conflicted with my fact i.e using 105’s successfully in the WSSM.

I thought we were done talking and were putting up or shutting up. Therefore, I did not have any smiley’s for you last post. Nor this one.

I see your Fans cheering on the posts above me and a few more up above. Yea knockem!

I do not give a Dam about the photo of my group. However before the real life photo all there was, was opinions based on some program Ricky or you were using with numbers you plugged in and convinced yourselves of those numbers. It was very different then what I was doing i.e. 105-108 bullets out of a magazine without any problems.

I do not fish it is boring! I really was not lookin for anything from you it was just a question.

Satire? All I see is satire and false statements not based on the real world.

So asking me to post a 5 on 5 target now for D-Tech, does this mean no competition……ok but I was finally seeing a good time with this topic! Plus, Mike don’t need me, he makes wonderful product and know this because he is very busy.

Anyone can see that the topic comparison is not a fair one. My 3 year old can see this, but you also have taken stances against the WSSM and the 105’s……yes I can show you the statements if you forgot. You poop'ed but will not admit it now.

I have fun everyday I go to the range shooting my mangled magazines and bullets shoved so far in the case I can barely get then to go 2000 FPS!

You wanting to see about my 105’s speed was not in curiosity but an opportunity to make some comment like you have so far…..but it is all good, that’s what you do.

“PMs!” no idea what you mean here.

“threat” I thought it was a competition? You are on the east coast……unless you invented away to come through my computer screen, I am could care less, although a face to face may put things in more of a perspective for both!
The only thing I took seriously was this 5 on 5 thing. However, mailing it to you so you could look at it and feel it, like I, yours would be great. Trust me I am not a good shot, but by my post count, you can see I do not do a lot of talking on the computer and far more time with my A-Max’s, but I am taken a strong liking to the Berger 105 VDL and 108’s now.
 
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I am going to do this though.....but this is just going to be between you and I. I am going to send you some pics of the rounds in the mangled magazines so you will not keep saying that there are no sides to them because seeing is believing and it again will not be based on untruths.

You may say that my magazines grow on trees or that I photo shopped them. Oh well, you can't help if you do not try. LOL!
 
No worries Old T, I was trying to 'lighten the mood' with my last post.
mbk & myself are obviously not seeing eye to eye, so there's no need to pursue this any further.

He can have the last word to make sure he feels I've been sufficiently keyboard whipped...

have a nice day!
 
Wow, I guess it pays to be known on the Board......They all ignore the negative comments you made and snide remarked about shooting the 105’s and how bad it is and not for the WSSM or the AR.

I actually stand my ground and not allow you to make negative comments about what I enjoy doing, WOW!…….and then you challenge me with the 5 on 5, I agree, and now I am accused of doing some keyboard whipping. Wow, I thought it was all in fun.

Many apologies to all that were upset….I will play somewhere else where I do not take offence and offend.
God Bless!
 
Originally Posted By: mbkmkkWow, I guess it pays to be known on the Board......They all ignore the negative comments you made and snide remarked about shooting the 105’s and how bad it is and not for the WSSM or the AR.

I actually stand my ground and not allow you to make negative comments about what I enjoy doing, WOW!…….and then you challenge me with the 5 on 5, I agree, and now I am accused of doing some keyboard whipping. Wow, I thought it was all in fun.

Many apologies to all that were upset….I will play somewhere else where I do not take offence and offend.
God Bless!

From where I sit, the only one taking offense is you sir. No apologies are neccessary, as I really don't think anyone is upset except you.

Fred is regarded for his knowledge and experience on this forum, and him being a former moderator has absolutely zero to do with it.

If you feel it neccessary to "play elsewhere", then you do so of your own accord. Your posts, thus far, seem to be a bit confrontational and "in your face".

If you expect to be treated with a little more respect, I'd suggest you start by reviewing the tenor of your posts and tone it down just a bit.

If you wish to discuss this further, you are welcome to send me a private message.

Jeff
 
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