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#3287234 - 12/07/21 05:52 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Toro Online
Seasoned Member

Registered: 02/06/19
Posts: 258
Loc: East
Please keep us informed on what they say.

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#3287776 - 12/12/21 05:33 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3175
Loc: south central Illinois
Bering is sending a return label to me via snail mail. Friday night I cleaned the rifle and it was still the same poi as the previous test after 1 fouling shot. Shot it a bit ago and poi is 1.5" right. Looseed the mount and reattached the scope, shot 1 and it stacked right with the first 2. Gonna be very interesting to see what Bering says. Right now this thing is no better than my Pulsar Trail XP 5O's.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/12/21 05:45 PM)

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#3287883 - 12/13/21 08:57 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
P&Y Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 02/04/19
Posts: 686
Loc: ND
Man I'm sorry to hear your troubles continue. I'm confident it'll serve you well in the long run and the Pulsar's won't even be comparable. Everytime I had to send a Pulsar in it ended my season and usually cost me $100 to ship. I bet you will be hammering coyotes with it in short order!

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#3287889 - 12/13/21 10:27 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3175
Loc: south central Illinois
New Pulsar came today. I had it zeroed in 3 shots. It seemed to track and group well. Shot the yoter again and it is now 1.5" low and an inch left vs an inch right like last night. I hope my return label gets here soon and they do find issues and turn it around quick.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/13/21 10:32 PM)

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#3287890 - 12/13/21 10:29 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
WestTX 25/06 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/09/20
Posts: 32
Loc: TX
So I got the Super Yoter this year and have been killing a bunch with it, but the longer shots havenít been falling for me like they have in the past with my old PTS536.. Finally got some time to do some serious testing yesterday shooting at a hand warmer at 300 yards on a calm night. I wanted to see how it grouped, verify it shot same POI at all zoom levels, and verify it held POI when reattaching the scope. Here is what I learned about my particular scope.

The Good

1). The scope can shoot amazing groups at distance. 1.5Ē group at 300 yards with a thermal beyond what I could ask for. Thatís every bit as good as the gun shoots with daytime optics.

The Bad

1). The crosshairs visibly move when zooming from 3x to 4x. Sandbagged up you can watch them jump approximately 4Ē at 300 yards as you toggle back and forth. Thankfully it doesnít seem to do this jumping between the other zoom levels.

2). I shot a three shot group removing and reattaching the scope between shots. My scope is mounted far enough forward that the whole thing is contacting the rail. First shot was a couple inches high of the previous group. Second shot was ten inches right. Third shot was back ten inches left with the first shot. This leads me to believe the mount wants to return to zero, but it is possible to be wildly off and canít really be trusted.

3). Zeroing doesnít track true. First group was several inches right. By only adjusting windage, my next group was not only left but also higher.


My conclusions:

I think the scope will work great as long as I leave it mounted all season, donít shoot at high zoom, and waste a few more shells than should be needed sighting in. I like shooting and testing, but I think itís a little disappointing that you have to go to this amount of time and effort to find out which features of your scope you need to avoid. With that said, I would be generally happy with the scope if I could solve the qd mount issue. Does anyone know if there are other options?

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#3287892 - 12/13/21 10:41 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3175
Loc: south central Illinois
Sounds like plenty of people are having problems but haven't posted like they did with the Trail issues.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/13/21 10:41 PM)

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#3287905 - 12/14/21 12:18 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Kirsch Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 10/13/09
Posts: 3342
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: varminter .223
Sounds like plenty of people are having problems but haven't posted like they did with the Trail issues.
The Hogsters, Super Hogsters, and Super Yoters are not only the best sellers at Night Goggles, but Bering Optics continues to be the lowest RMA and failure rates of any of the brands we carry. Along with all the thermals we sell, I monitor several other sites including the Bering Optics facebook group with thousands of Bering Optics users. There are not widespread issues that anyone is reporting. This does not mean you aren't experiencing an issue but overall, most users are extremely satisfied with their Super Yoters.
_________________________
Korey Kirschenmann
Night Goggles Product Specialist

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#3287908 - 12/14/21 01:03 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: WestTX 25/06]
Kirsch Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 10/13/09
Posts: 3342
Loc: USA
WestTx,

My comments are going to sound like I have tons of excuses or things to check. However, in the years I have been part of the thermal world including going through the Pulsar Trail issues, I have realized there are some scope issues and lots of other potential issues that can cause POI issues. I was one of the people who experienced the POI shift in the original Trails. I did not like it when I called Pulsar, and they went through a laundry list of reasons why my POI shift could be happening. I spent a ton of time and bullets proving the issue was not gun, ammo, rest, etc. However, there really are a lot of reasons this can happen.

One happened to me just today. I put my SY back on a gun I had previously used it on. I did some work on the gun, so I just wanted to see if my zero was still on. I was about .5" left. I adjusted it one click and took another shot, and holy crap I was 8" right just like you mentioned happened to you. First thought that goes through my mind is did I hold the adjustment button down too long and the value jumped too far. I checked my zero settings that I had written down and it hadn't. I went through and checked everything and realized my suppressor wasn't snug. Tightened it up, and my group shot exactly where it was supposed to be. It was just a little loose but little things like this can and do make a big difference. This has happened with my glass scope with the same result. In my situation, it wasn't a scope issue at all as it was a gun issue that caused that errant shot, but it would have been so easy to say it was the scope.

Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
So 1). The scope can shoot amazing groups at distance. 1.5Ē group at 300 yards with a thermal beyond what I could ask for. Thatís every bit as good as the gun shoots with daytime optics.
This is amazing accuracy at that distance.

Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
1). The crosshairs visibly move when zooming from 3x to 4x. Sandbagged up you can watch them jump approximately 4Ē at 300 yards as you toggle back and forth. Thankfully it doesnít seem to do this jumping between the other zoom levels.
Did you shoot at 4x to see if it still had the same POI? Many thermals have to jump between zoom levels depending on their X,Y coordinate adjustments.

Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
I shot a three shot group removing and reattaching the scope between shots. My scope is mounted far enough forward that the whole thing is contacting the rail. First shot was a couple inches high of the previous group. Second shot was ten inches right. Third shot was back ten inches left with the first shot. This leads me to believe the mount wants to return to zero, but it is possible to be wildly off and canít really be trusted.
Like any QD mount, make sure that you are always mounting it the same. The general consensus on shooting forums is to push the scope and mount as far forward on the rail slot as possible before closing the locking lever. Many people (including myself) use LaRue clips to make 100% sure they are back on the correct rail slot. Also, make sure you get a good tension level on the rail lever to not be too tight or too loose. I have removed my Super Yoter maybe 100 times. Has it always been absolutely perfect, no I can't claim that but I don't think I have ever been off by more than 1" when doing what I am saying.

Having something slightly touch your barrel or sitting on bags a little differently can all cause things like this happen. Because it came back on the 3rd shot makes me believe something happened between shot 1 and 3. If all three were wildly different, I would be more worried. The fact it came back leads me to believe something impacted the gun on the 2nd shot. Because 2 of 3 shots were the same, I would recommend trying it a few more times and see if you can see a pattern as to something you may be doing slightly different when it shifts. I know ammo isn't cheap or easy to come by, but try it a few more times. If a LaRue mount won't return to zero, there aren't many more reputable options.

Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
3). Zeroing doesnít track true. First group was several inches right. By only adjusting windage, my next group was not only left but also higher.
I am not saying there couldn't be an issue, but make sure your mount is tight. Write down your horizontal and vertical numbers to make sure an adjustment hasn't happened by accident that was unintentional as it happens to all of us. Also, guns shoot different as they heat up. If it sounds like I am making excuses there are so many reasons guns can change POI, it isn't always the scope, but it could be. I use 1x zoom to make my adjustments as .54" should get everyone within at least .27" of where they want to be and usually closer. When I hear of people's zero not tracking with adjustments, it seems like they are usually changing the values at 2x, 3x or 4x. I have seen more consistent results when changing the values at 1x. Should this be the case, no, but just trying to narrow down what might be occurring for you. This is the first time Bering has ever allowed a scope adjustment at anything but 1x.

Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
I like shooting and testing, but I think itís a little disappointing that you have to go to this amount of time and effort to find out which features of your scope you need to avoid. With that said, I would be generally happy with the scope if I could solve the qd mount issue. Does anyone know if there are other options?
I've already mentioned what I would recommend. I would make sure the handle is tight enough but not too tight. I would also make 100% sure you are following the exact same procedure every time you mount and don't change the pressure/tightness of the handle when doing this.

LaRue is known for their precision and honestly this mount is about as good as any I have personally ever tested including Bobro, ZroDelta, and more. However, if you truly do not like the LaRue, you could buy a Bobro mount and have Bering install it for you. They typically do not charge to put a new mount on. Bobro's self adjust as far as tension. I hate the way their handles snap a person's fingers if you are not careful but lots of people like Bobro mounts. I personally have had better luck with LaRue and ADM but that is me. Remember Bering is so committed to accuracy, they align every mount to their scopes using an optical bench, and then reset it to 0,0 so they are as close to centered as possible. They secure it and epoxy it to make sure they don't move.

I ran the same test multiple times when I first received the Super Yoter prototype this fall. My tests were only 100 yards, but after doing the same test, my best group of the day was when I removed and remounted the SY three shots in a row. I virtually shot the same hole three times in a row. That test convinced me then and still to this day, I have seen nothing from my guns that suggests the LaRue mount won't return to zero.

I also recommend people shoot off the tripod they plan to use when hunting for final zero because many guns shoot slightly different off a tripod than off bags (even if free-floated).


_________________________
Korey Kirschenmann
Night Goggles Product Specialist

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#3287913 - 12/14/21 06:07 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
P&Y Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 02/04/19
Posts: 686
Loc: ND
Good advice Kirsch. Funny you mentioned the snapping of the Bobro mounts. Just last night I seriously pinched my finger! I didn't cry but my allergies acted up lol

Overall I've had really good rtz with Bobro and like how it uses two attachment points and can set my particular scope further rearward.

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#3287920 - 12/14/21 08:33 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: P&Y]
old cat Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 03/16/14
Posts: 1199
Loc: wv
Not a yoter fan boy, do not own one. My buddy does & I thought I would share his issue with you. He mounted it on his rifle, shot a 3 shot group at 100 yards 1" high dead center. Never made any adjustments. How about that issue? Just as it came out of the box.


Edited by old cat (12/14/21 08:35 AM)

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#3287921 - 12/14/21 08:33 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3175
Loc: south central Illinois
I feel my issues are not mount related. I like the LaRue mount. My poi issues occur in similar temps and my G1 profile takes different coordinates to zero than G2.
I hope our issues are not the norm and Bering gets them lined out quickly because I really want to like these yoters.
My only complaint or suggestion is that the pip could be set to more mag with the main screen at 1x. If the unit is bumped up to 2x for the intial shot it takes too long to find the front button and get fov back. Without suppressors sometimes shooting at runners is the only way to get a second shot.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/14/21 08:53 AM)

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#3287978 - 12/14/21 07:26 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: Kirsch]
WestTX 25/06 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/09/20
Posts: 32
Loc: TX
Thanks Korey for taking so much time to respond. I donít want it to seem like Iím bashing the scope. Image is great, grouping is phenomenal, and I like the button and function layout. I think it will kill truckloads.

Iíll try my best to respond to your questions/comments.

Yes Sir, phenomenal accuracy. The gun shoots great and I hand load for it. Iíve never had a thermal that grouped as well as my daytime scopes. Super impressed with this.

Yes, the POI shifted exactly the same distance as I observed the crosshairs jumping when going to 4x. I almost never really shoot at coyotes at 4x (jackrabbits might be a different story). Not really a concern other than I canít use the smaller increments offered at 4x zoom to zero.

It was a cold night when I tested and I would go check the target after each shot to allow the barrel to stay cool.

Pretty sure I was consistent on the sandbags, but you never know.

I will take some time to shoot more taking off the scope in between shots to verify. Hopefully I prove myself wrong, but Iím thinking my failure to hit many dogs past 200 yards this season might be that Iíve been taking the scope off to replace with daytime optics for my kids to use the gun deer hunting in between coyote hunts and just trusting that it would hold zero. It shifted every time I re mounted it, granted two of them were close to each other, but it never stayed in the same place two re-mounts in a row. Easily fixed by just leaving the scope mounted.

I realize this isnít a concern for most users, but I hunt in a wide open low humidity environment and longer shots are important to me. Last year I was pretty automatic out to 300 yards with my FLIR and made many longer shots too, but I realize there is also a human variable to it. Entirely possible I just decided to forget how to shoot this year and am inventing excuses for my performance.

Also, Iíve been down the same pulsar trail xp50 rabbit hole as you (it is now serving as my scanner) and hate having to verify zero before every hunt.

If you are interested I can send you a picture of the target, I donít know how to post them here. Thanks again!

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#3288687 - 12/22/21 05:46 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Toro Online
Seasoned Member

Registered: 02/06/19
Posts: 258
Loc: East
I sighted my yoter in the other day at 100 yards. Everything went smooth. My cousin still has to sight in his thermion so if I get a chance,Iíll meet him at the range and shoot the yoter again to confirm no poi shift.

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#3288692 - 12/22/21 06:20 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: WestTX 25/06]
Kirsch Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 10/13/09
Posts: 3342
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: WestTX 25/06
Yes, the POI shifted exactly the same distance as I observed the crosshairs jumping when going to 4x. I almost never really shoot at coyotes at 4x (jackrabbits might be a different story). Not really a concern other than I canít use the smaller increments offered at 4x zoom to zero.
You don't have to shoot at 4x to change the zero settings at 4x. However, it is .18" at 3x and .14" at 4x, not a huge difference. Honestly, I tested the 2-4x zero increments earlier on my prototype and things seemed to always work for me. However, I have helped numerous people with the Super Yoter and zeroing, and when I hear comments like, "I made a .14" adjustment and it jumped like 2"+, it always seems like they are using 2,3, or 4x zoom. Should it work, yes, but I can tell you for the majority of people, I tell them to go to 1x before going into the zero menu. For virtually every person who told me the zero wasn't tracking correctly on adjustments, when they went to 1x, everything is good. The most the scope could be off if using 1x (.54") adjustments is .27" and that is worst case scenario. I just use 1x on all my adjustments now. I actually set the scope to 2x when zeroing, but 1x to adjust.

As for remounting, the LaRue mount has been the best RTZ I have ever used including Bobro, and ZroDlta. Make sure you are pushing the mount as far forward as it will go before locking it down.

Let me know how it goes.
_________________________
Korey Kirschenmann
Night Goggles Product Specialist

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#3288777 - 12/23/21 01:56 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3175
Loc: south central Illinois
Bering finally got a label to me on Tuesday. Fed ex 2 day must really be three day so they will have it on Friday. I will keep those interested posted.

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