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#3286861 - 12/03/21 05:45 PM Super yoter issues
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3161
Loc: south central Illinois
Reticle will not adjust in any smaller increments that around 1.25" at 100 yards despite adjusting at 4x. Coordinates numerically adjust as they should but poi moves from one side of a small handwarmer folded in half to the other in one click at 4x.
My partners was .75" high and maybe a quarter right when we zeroed it in the cold the other night and after my issues I had him shoot it and it was just off the hand warmer low right. His is tracking like mine as well.
I'm very disappointed. Bering told me to tighten the LaRue mount until it was very hard to cam over. The rifles shoot great groups but won't track when zeroing and his for sure shifted. I'd say they will be going back to Bering.
My 2nd Trail xp50 2 lrf will be here Tuesday. The 1st one I received as a replacement for my first version was junk. It had a horrible image, dead pixel, lrf wouldn't work consistently and it had a poi shift. They deamed it irreparable. I'm not thrilled to say the least.
I think between my partner and I we have had 8 or 9 units and not a one has been right.
I gotta ask how often do you guys check your poi or do you zero and worry about other things lol.
Scratch that 9 or 10 units, I forgot about the xd38a it was solid.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/03/21 06:17 PM)

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#3286865 - 12/03/21 06:36 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
204 AR Offline
PM senior

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 5876
Loc: Nebraska
Interesting observations. So you're saying you've only had one thermal scope that's worked right at all?

I'm very new to this so keep that in mind. I've been messing around with my new to me super hogster and finding that the target makes a big difference and I think during the day position of the sun and how it warms the target matters.

As an example today I set up 2 hot water bottles at about 160 yds. One had a label all the way around it and I laid it on its side with the bottom towards me. It appeared as the actual size it was and I center punched this one. The other was a clear peanut butter jar with no label, same distance and also with bottom pointed at me. It appeared in the scope to be about twice as wide as it actually was but I centered the dot on the image and missed 3 times to the left, which is the side the sun was shining on. When I held on the right edge of the image I hit it.

Moral of the story is that the target itself and position of the sun matters a lot it seems.


Edited by 204 AR (12/03/21 06:37 PM)
_________________________
photobucket sucks

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#3286866 - 12/03/21 06:39 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
DoubleUp Online
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 4052
Loc: USA
V3, I can only attest to what happened to me. It may not have anything to do with your issues. Kirsch gave me a lot of help and instructions, and they were very useful, but did not cure my problem. I would sight the scope in, and it would be off the next time I shot it which was about every day. I cleaned the barrel to make sure it wasn't the rifle. I checked the tightness of the LaRue mount several different ways. All of it was pretty much useless as far as correcting the problem.

Right when I was ready to send the SY back, I decided to clean the barrel again just to be sure. Now this barrel has never coppered at all, and it showed no signs of copper on either cleaning. As most AR's that are suppressed it gets nasty even with an adjustable gas block. Anyway this time, I focused on the chamber and carbon. when I put it back into operation it tracked perfectly, shot to the same POI over and over again and it didn't make any difference whether I was on native mag, or zoomed, or using the PIP. It has been over a month now and it has held dead nuts zero with absolutely no corrections needed. I have made shots this week at 218 and 227 yds. with no issues.

Just my experience. I can't say it will make any difference for you.
_________________________
Glow Bull Warming:
He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. Psalm 2:4




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#3286868 - 12/03/21 07:04 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3161
Loc: south central Illinois
204 AR. I shot at both tin foil and hand warmers of varying sizes to test different theories and it doesn't seem to matter.

DU that seems wild that cleaning fixed your issues but I guess anything is possible. I've never experienced any shift like this with day optics though.
Still doesn't explain big poi movements with 4x adjustments.

The other thing is we have of these scopes that are doing the same thing. I assume out of same batch.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/03/21 07:12 PM)

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#3286874 - 12/03/21 09:06 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3161
Loc: south central Illinois
Well I got the mount 8 clicks tighter and backed it of 2 and got it cammed over. Not sure how easy it will come back off though.

Prior to tightening the mount I shot 2 rounds and they were basically 1 inch low and left of my last 4 shots this morning. I then tightened the mount and shot 2 more. They were most touching maybe
.5" right of the ones shot prior to making the mount adjustment. I will test it more tomorrow.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/03/21 09:06 PM)

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#3286875 - 12/03/21 09:34 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Toro Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 02/06/19
Posts: 253
Loc: East
Great. Iíve had mine for a couple months or so but havenít sighted it in yet cause I donít start dog hunting till Jan 1. After everything I went through with the trails, Iím gonna find a new hobby if this yoter doesnít hold zero. Please keep us posted on how it performs

DU I know you know more about guns and shooting than I do but I have never had poi shift or that kind of inconsistency with day scope because the gun needed a little cleaning. Iíve had groups open up but not move all together to that extreme. Iím not doubting what youíre saying at all, Iím just thinking it was probably that scope and not your gun. Especially with varminter having very similar issues. Hope Iím wrong (and very well could be) for all our sakes.


Edited by Toro (12/03/21 09:45 PM)

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#3286884 - 12/03/21 10:23 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Heymartay Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 426
Loc: N Illinois
I was 1-6 tonight with my Hogster 35 and the hit wasnít good. Back to the range tomorrow. Coyotes acted like I wasnít close.
_________________________
If Democrats didnít have double standards theyíd have no standards at all.

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#3286885 - 12/03/21 10:27 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Heymartay Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 426
Loc: N Illinois
2-3 last night and nothing was drt. Shooting 204 Winchesters think 32ís
_________________________
If Democrats didnít have double standards theyíd have no standards at all.

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#3286886 - 12/03/21 10:35 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Catdog1 Online
Die Hard Member

Registered: 02/17/16
Posts: 606
Loc: Prarie ghost
I know this sounds crazy but try sighting in using a incense stick. It gives you a really really small aim point and gives of enough heat to be seen really well.

I have had similar experiences as you when using handwarmers. Too big and it causes the heat signature to balloon too much.


Edited by Catdog1 (12/03/21 10:35 PM)

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#3286891 - 12/03/21 11:28 PM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
DoubleUp Online
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 4052
Loc: USA
I'm just telling you my experience with this scope. Plus, I'm a stickler for accuracy. I use HVAC tape cut in 4 equal ribbons to make the crosshairs. My POI shifts were not monumental, but I don't like to hit on one side of the crosshairs one day and the other side the next day, or high one day and low the next. This rifle is pretty consistently a .5 to .75 shooter and sometimes better. The only other thing I did besides the second cleaning (which was thorough) was to back off a little on how tight I was trying to get the LaRue mount. I don't know that forcing it closed would or could have any effect on accuracy, but I just went to moderate pressure to make it cam over and lock.

Anyway I wish I could be more help to you guys. Kirsch can verify that I told him exactly the same thing when he was trying to help me with this problem in the first couple of weeks of having the scope. I love the SY and the Phenom. They both have such wonderfully clear and sharp images.
_________________________
Glow Bull Warming:
He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. Psalm 2:4




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#3286898 - 12/04/21 01:46 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
204 AR Offline
PM senior

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 5876
Loc: Nebraska
Originally Posted By: varminter .223
Well I got the mount 8 clicks tighter and backed it of 2 and got it cammed over. Not sure how easy it will come back off though.

Prior to tightening the mount I shot 2 rounds and they were basically 1 inch low and left of my last 4 shots this morning. I then tightened the mount and shot 2 more. They were most touching maybe
.5" right of the ones shot prior to making the mount adjustment. I will test it more tomorrow.


I will be interested in if that makes a difference. I thought I had mine plenty tight but this is my first experience with a qd mount so I'm not sure how tight they should be, but you have me wondering now. I thought I had mine zeroed well but I get weird fliers that this rifle never used to throw, but usually just at the targets that appear larger than they are.

I shot it a lot today, and was satisfied but tonight made 2 quick sets and missed one and made a bad shot on another that I got, in fact my first called and killed thermal coyote. When I got home I shot it and I was a little higher than I thought I should be so brought it down 2 clicks and it's right on at 100. Now I wonder if the mounts moving dang it lol.
_________________________
photobucket sucks

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#3286904 - 12/04/21 07:18 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
P&Y Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 02/04/19
Posts: 661
Loc: ND
So many variables, thermals can be beyond frustrating. Hope these get ironed out. Kitsch will be helpful I'm sure.

I've got a new Hogster sitting on my bench my friend just got. He wants me to mount and zero it for him. I'll be watching it closely.

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#3286910 - 12/04/21 08:55 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
Kirsch Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 10/13/09
Posts: 3284
Loc: USA
I will try to offer some suggestions. However, I just pulled an all nighter hunting and knocked down 17 coyotes with the SY. Itís too hard to type on my phone. Iíve got a couple hour drive to get home and I need to get a couple hours of sleep and then Iíll make some suggestions.
_________________________
Korey Kirschenmann
Night Goggles Product Specialist

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#3286911 - 12/04/21 09:01 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3161
Loc: south central Illinois
I'm all ears lol

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#3286919 - 12/04/21 11:18 AM Re: Super yoter issues [Re: varminter .223]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 3161
Loc: south central Illinois
Shot two rounds this morning. It has now shifted 1.25" to 1.5" under the handwarmer.
To sum it up it started high right in handwarmer yesterday morning, low left on edge to just outside handwarmer yesterday evening and now slight right and low by close to 1.5". Two shot groups are always tight and sub moa just like with good day optics. This thing is starting to make pulsar stuff look good.

Over all test to test group center to center is 1.75" horizontal spread and 2.5" vertical spread. That means if I zero to never be lower than dead on at 100 I could potentially be as high as 4" or more at 150 and 175 and have about a 315 yards zero or I could be 6 inches low at 300 and dead on at 100....what a mess.
Tightening mount to holy crap thats tight level had no affect as far as I can tell at this point.


Edited by varminter .223 (12/04/21 12:03 PM)

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