Down side to .223 AI

H

hate2work

New member
Going back and forth on going to ackley on my .223 build I am doing. Is there a down side? Gun will have an 8 twist, looking at shooting 65-70 gr bullets. Will be using Accuracy International mags, others have said the ackley feeds great with this set up, so that should not be an issue.
Hoping for 150 fps gain, is this realistic? thanks, John
 
I dont mean to laugh or not take you question serious but you just hit my funny bone.

Answer
Any case that can hold more powder does not have a down side if it fuctions and feeds well at least to me because I like to chase FPS
 
I am in the process of gathering parts for my 223 AI build. Another good thing is not having to trim brass near as much. Mine is a 1:8 also and i am going to be using AI mags. I am having my barrel throated for the 75 grain Amaxes. I think 100-150 fps gains is about what you are going to see. My barrel will be 24", how about yours?
 
One thing great about .223AI, is that you can shoot reg factory ammo and shoot it well. I have a bunch of 52gr MHPs in Black Hills ammo,shoots well in my 8 twist.
 
Yes there IS a downside to the .223 AI. There certainly is without a doubt. Just ask the praire dog that is in my avatar!


Oop! Wait a minute....you cant! He's dead!
grin.gif
 
Bobtails,I am going with a 21" #4 contour brux barrel. Wanted an accurate rifle thats not going to be so heavy I wont take in the field.


What is the brass trim length after fire forming? Same as .223?
 
The only down side to AI is forming the brass, and the barrel life you use up forming brass.

That said you can form brass with very functional rounds you can use for practice or whatever you want to shoot at, it will just be a 223 load.

Or you can use the Cream of Wheat with pistol powder method of forming brass, I have never tried that method but I isnt soposed to effect your barrels life at all.

I have noticed though If you are pushing hot loads out of the AI you are going to wear out the primer pockets just as fast as a hot standard round.

I love my ackley and am considering rechambering my AR to 223AI.
 
Originally Posted By: GrizleyHunterI dont mean to laugh or not take you question serious but you just hit my funny bone.

Answer
Any case that can hold more powder does not have a down side if it fuctions and feeds well at least to me because I like to chase FPS

lol.gif
hey that reminds me.. you gonna post them slower velocity results? just for me?

I have to try and put aside some time to shoot several try-outs..but, spring has sprung and so much to do!
PS- sorry for hi-jack- but I figured grizz might get a laugh!
 
Along with what rock knocker said I agree with, but from my experience if you AI with accurate loads that aren't hot, not much barrel life will.be lost, especially if molyed. Just go hunting with it!
 
Originally Posted By: Rock KnockerThe only down side to AI is forming the brass, and the barrel life you use up forming brass.

That said you can form brass with very functional rounds you can use for practice or whatever you want to shoot at, it will just be a 223 load.



Ok yes you can make "functional" rounds for fireforming, in fact I use the exact same load. And, it shoots just as well as fireformed loads. I used up no barrel life I wouldn't have used up otherwise.

But, I could be wrong, in that case I made about 500 pieces of brass wrong, haha.

There is no down side to the AI that I can see. Never had one in a bolt action, though.
 
Originally Posted By: Hunt
Cons:
Working up two loads (fire formed and non fire formed)

Or you could just do what I did: I bought about 10 boxes of Fiocchi .223 when it was on sale and used that to make fireformed brass while I was shooting ground squirrels with it.

I am still using that same brass too. Keep it a grain or two under max and get really long case life. I like that.
 
Originally Posted By: hate2workBobtails,I am going with a 21" #4 contour brux barrel. Wanted an accurate rifle thats not going to be so heavy I wont take in the field.


What is the brass trim length after fire forming? Same as .223?



They are virtually the same before and after. Here's some info for you;

http://www.6mmbr.com/223rem.html
 
Originally Posted By: GrizleyHunterI dont mean to laugh or not take you question serious but you just hit my funny bone.

Answer
Any case that can hold more powder does not have a down side if it fuctions and feeds well at least to me because I like to chase FPS

That post made me laugh... I think everyone goes through that stage. Some are way past it.

The 223AI aint bad.
 


What I would like to know is what is the ogive of your .223 AI chamber.

We all know the ogive on a .223rem is .082-.084.
The hotter 5.56x45 ogive is .162-.164.
The wylde is some where in between.

You want to run 150fps over so where is the pressure???

I wanted something more than a .223rem so I bought a 6.8mm specII to deer hunt with. It is 1-10 and loves 115gr bullets.

Best of luck.
 
There's really no downside to 223AI except that a Remington might need a couple little tweeks to make it feed properly. But your magazine setup apparently has no problems, so that's not a factor.

There's a lot of crap being thrown around on AI threads. First, with AI's there's no "fireforming" loads per se. There's NO working up 2 loads. Don't listen to that stuff. Start a little below what your manual says is max for the std. case and work up from there just like any other cartridge. When you reach most accuracy, that's your fireform load. It'll be more powder than max for the std. case and it'll be faster.....between a max .223 load and a 223AI load. Accuracy will be just as good. Realize that it's a hunting/ field load, not a "fireform" load. I shoot 50's in that case and can't tell you about 65/70's...... fireforming with 50's is about 75-100fps more than a std. 223, and formed cases are about 175-200 fps more than std .223.....this is depending on which bullet/weight/powder.

You've found a best/most accurate load while fireforming, with formed cases it'll be the same only just a little more. Very easy.

Then about loss of barrel life while "fireforming." Well, fireform loads are field loads. The "fireform" load will be maybe 1 -1.5gr more than a std. 223.......talk about using up the barrel is pure nonsense. The formed AI case will use about 2gr more than std. 223 - depending on bullet/powder......again, difference in barrel life is negligible.

 
want more speed, go AI, then shorten the barrel to 21" to loose speed, now that is funny!

I don't think that 4 more inches of barrel ever made me miss a critter.

I have spent a lot of time in the field hunting everything that walks, flies, or crawls. The guns used usually had barrels from 26"-32" long.

My 223 AI's have barrels 23" and 27" long with the 27" getting exactly 100 fps more than the 23".

A wild guess would be that the speed on a 21" 223 AI would equal the speed on a 26" 223, maybe 25" depending on the barrel.

My 23" shoots the 55's at 3500-3550 with N135, 7 1/2's, in IMI brass, add another 100 fps for the 50's. Other powders gave 100 fps less than N135.
 
My best ackley load wouldnt fit into a standard 260 case, Ive tried. But Im using a 30" barrel H4831sc and 140gr bullets. So using a big barrel, slow powder and heavy bullets. Im sure its different with fast powders and light bullets.

But to take advantage of my AI chambering I need two different loads.
 
If there's a down side to the 223 AI I sure haven't found it.

I was concerned about barrel life when fire forming cases but it turned out to be a non issue. In actuality the 223 load I use to fire form is even more accurate than the finished AI load I use in the field. If you're concerned just shoot 223 loads until you get the amount of brass you want in AI.

It's a sweet little cartridge.
 
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