to those who load 308 & 22/250

C

Chapped Lips

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saw where lapua will make available next year 22/250 brass (LR pocket) and 308 brass with Small Rifle pocket...supposed to enhance ballistics...all 308 family shud benefit - cept 358 (grin)...old news to some;new to others....
 
where's an x-spurt when ya need one! (grin)...only in certain case sizes...med size?...better stable(?)burn...go to 6mmBR.com-they can explain it way better...PPC & BR chamberings are an example...even a 30BR.
i asked this same ques years ago at BR matches in phx and the current belief then was that it wudn't work/matter...plus we hav new&better powder formulas...
i never took physics in hi school - if i did i wudn't hav volunteered for helicopters...magic...physics...more magic...and ya gotta believe!....6mmBR.com
 
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Thanx! i'll check it out. y wouldn't they make the 22-250 n a small pocket as well? simalar case. i've been reloading for 5 yrs. now, and after the 1st year i thought i had it down 2 a science! man was i wrong! its an ongoing learning process and a money pit. constantly buying new gizmos and gadgets. but i have worked up some hair slitting loads, and get a sence of satifaction harvesting an animal with a round that i hand crafted!
 
part of being a human critter...we constantly strive...some of this stuff works....for awhile at least...some fails quickly...folks hav been play'n with SR in 308 cases for yrs...it just catches fire & spreads............
 
The smaller 308 primer pocket will handle greater pressures and give smaller extreme spreads. What it will NOT do is be more reliable in cold weather. For anyone who hunts/shoots in the cold much, I'd not consider it. Not the first time this has been tried, nor close.........
 
Remember the 22 cheeta, 308 necked down, small rifle primer, I believe the SRP will be ok with the newer powders. ED
 
To test the cold weather handling of the new Lapua .308Palma brass, the guy who was doing the testing Jerry Tierney froze his loads in his freezer before he shot them. The old timers remembered back when Remington made small primer .308 brass, they didn't work well in the cold, but now we have better choices in primers as well as powders, so the cold may not be a problem anymore with this setup.

I understand that these also have a small flashole, like the ppc and BR cases. I believe its actually the smaller flashole that helps out with pressure because there is a smaller hole for pressure to escape back into the primer.
 
ooops...forgor to mention the smaller flash hole...if ya try these,make sure you purchase a thinner decap'n pin (.055-.057) or you'll get ur standard pin (.080) stuck...one of the few times that smaller is better....
 
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I can tell you for a fact that small rifle primers do not work well with all powders in cold weather...my experience was with IMR 4064 which is not hard to ignite...hang fires really upset my one nerve.
 
I'd be interested in his findings. I've never read anything about today's primers burning hotter, but they very well could. A smaller flash hole is just that. For a hunting rifle, the larger hole is the easy choice, IMO.......
 
A discussion on another board they were talking about this subject. (LR Forum). A Canadian guy I know lives up in Ontario which gets pretty darn cold, like -30 or -40. He said he's ran into problems with the small primers/flasholes in the .308 in the past during winter. To cure it they opened up the flasholes. Not sure which is the hottest SRP, I heard it was the Remington 7-1/2, but a thicker harder cup is preferred when running high pressures which is what this case is designed to do.
Quote:eek:ops...forgor to mention the smaller flash hole...if ya try these,make sure you purchase a thinner decap'n pin (.055-.057) or you'll get ur standard pin (.060) stuck...one of the few times that smaller is better....
Don't worry 6br.com updated their daily bulletin after you started this thread, I brought up the question about the flasholes in the comments on daily bulletin so they edited the post.
cool.gif


I've read that the small rifle magnum primers have the same amount of compound as the standard small rifle primer. So they are not hotter but the difference is actually a thicker cup. I use the CCI 450 Small Mag primer in 6BR-IMP cases because of the high pressures I'm running, the 450 is supposed to be one of the toughest along side the Wolf SR Magnum.


I do think this has some merit, but maybe not for hunting rifles. I will test them out myself when I get my Palma rifle built. Tierney won a 1000 yard Benchrest match in California with a .308 Palma rifle while testing this new Lapua brass. Once again humiliating benchrest shooters with his highpower prone equipment lol. Showing good chrono numbers and accuracy for American shooters, Lapua wouldn't have gone this far if there wasn't something to it, based on their own testing. That's pretty much a summary of what I've read on this stuff.
 
if i had a rifle of this type &chambered in 260 or any 6.5 wildcat variant,i sure wud be anxious to get some of this brass in my reloading blocks....my excitement/anticipation level wud be sky high...
any articles written or posted re: tiernay's win?....in depth info on rifle and loads?
 
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We used 7 1/2's with large flash holes, still got hang fires.

This brass will be for the guys that live and shoot in warm weather.

I have shot tens of thousands of 22 and 6 PPC using large rifle primers made from PMC 7.62x39 Brass.

In full blown benchrest rifles set up for registered matches, the difference between the groups shot with 7.62x39 brass with the large primers and large flash holes and the Sako 220 Russain brass made into 6 and 22 PPC is very little(.035 at the very most).

Many folks that just like to hunt will get suckered into this mess.
 
Originally Posted By: Chapped Lipsif i had a rifle of this type &chambered in 260 or any 6.5 wildcat variant,i sure wud be anxious to get some of this brass in my reloading blocks....my excitement/anticipation level wud be sky high...
any articles written or posted re: tiernay's win?....in depth info on rifle and loads?

Posted on Long Range Target shooting.

Quote: Posted 05 December 2009 - 07:08 PM
Shooting the new Palma brass from Lapua in a 308 at the 1000 yard bench rest match with my Palma test rifle.

July 27, 2009 --- Sacramento NBRSA 1000-yard Bench Rest Match

The match is three five shot targets using a “light gun” under 17#s, and three 10 shot targets shot with a “heavy gun” no weight limit. The maximum is a 35 caliber. NO feedback on the shots fired.
I used my Palma test rifle which weights under 16# for both light and heavy guns.

Match Results: LG = light gun, HG = heavy gun. 1000 yard Bench rest very small targets.

Normal Sacramento winds.........

1st place in LG three target group aggregate = 8.084”
3rd place in LG single target score = 47-01X
1st place in HG three target groups aggregate = 10.455”
1st place in HG three target score = 273-03X
1st place in six target group aggregate = 9.269” --- 45 rounds.
1st place in six target score = 404-04X

It is fun to beat 6.5-284 and 338 Lapua mags with a palma rifle

Jerry

Quote:They sent us 1000 cases for evaluation in the field. All the testing we did confirmed what I experienced with the Rem BR case. Much better ES, SD numbers and no primer senitivity. That is that all primers gave good numbers I tested 4 different brands of SRP's bought off the shelf and a local store and all gave significantly better chrono numbers than any of my "select" LRP's (SD + 4-5, ES 12 -18). SAMMI specs do not specify primer size for 308 Win. As a final note I shot the first Palma match at Phx. this weekend using these cases. First time across the Palma course in COLD weather my score was 450X30. Lapua is releasing these cases at the Shot Show and they WILL be available world-wide.

Tom Whitaker
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanWe used 7 1/2's with large flash holes, still got hang fires.
This brass will be for the guys that live and shoot in warm weather.
Many folks that just like to hunt will get suckered into this mess.

As I stated earlier, until I see evidence to the contrary with my own 2 eyes, I agree 100% with Ackleyman.......
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanI can tell you for a fact that small rifle primers do not work well with all powders in cold weather

Agreed......
 
Originally Posted By: Flybuster I've read that the small rifle magnum primers have the same amount of compound as the standard small rifle primer. So they are not hotter but the difference is actually a thicker cup. I use the CCI 450 Small Mag primer in 6BR-IMP cases because of the high pressures I'm running, the 450 is supposed to be one of the toughest along side the Wolf SR Magnum.

I am far from an expert on SRPs. I have learned some though. What I can tell you is that CCI 450s share the same cup thickness as CCI BR-4s. The BR-4s having a larger cup diameter and lower cup height. Rem 7 1/2s fall squarely between the 2 in both categories, respectively.

I've no "facts" to back it up, but I believe the 450s do burn hotter.

My old pal BCB knows more of this subject than I do, and has ignited far more SRPs than I have.........
 
Always a good idea to consider magnum primers in very cold weather for the BIG cartridges e.g. 338 WM . 30/06, etc. Perhaps a good idea for 308 (I don't load for 308)?

Perhaps not needed for 22/250 in very cold weather...
 
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