talking group size at PM

I sent a TC predator Venture back to the factory for inspection when it went from .33 MOA handloads on the 22-250. They looked it over and scrapped it and sent me a new one. It went from .33 to 3.5
I replaced it with an AR 16" chome lined 1:9 and I guess i got lucky..

After break-in. I fired one fouling and then shot the first 5 shot group with factory 223 53gr super performance Hornady and Stopped. I doubt i could shot that good again, but hey.. I was happy.
I have filled some test loads for a ladder work-up with XBR to see what i get, but not in any kind of a hurry based on the results from the factory loads.

 
A gun may shoot MOA, every single time it's shot. Odds are the person holding the gun is going to shoot 3moa. My advice.

1. Do a thorough cleaning of the gun.
2. Sell the gun.
3. Go to your bathroom mirror, look yourself in the eyes, and repeat "I am the problem." over and over again.

smile.gif


Personally I found my group size shrank dramatically as soon as I started shooting 1 shot groups. I is now an expurt and a geenyus!
 
I find talking about group sizes on the internet fairly pointless.

Everyone has different ways of measuring, for one thing. Different enough to change the definition of ".5 MOA".

A lot of guys only shoot three shot groups. I shoot five or ten or twenty shot groups. Can't even begin to compare group size.

I generally speak of aggregates, as in, the actual measured average of at least five groups. Maybe a lot more than five groups. When someone else is talking about the best groups, and especially the one time, three shot group on stretchy paper with full bullet diameter subtracted from outside edges, it makes meaningful communication of the subject between the two of us over the internet just about impossible.

- DAA
 
good points.

I personally like to do 3 shot group shots for starters for load development.

When i see something that is grouping nice, i will then load a 5 shot group in small load change increments to see where the groups are really showing up.

Sure, most do it differently, but as long as the individual does it the same every time, that will help to figure out what will make a load the most accurate you can for your rifle.

Maybe mine are or are not measured right. But, what i do know is the load i have has 5 shots that touch. Good enough for my hunting purposes. I would suck and loose everyday at bench shooting, but I am not doing that.

Just some thoughts. IMO
 
Yup DAA.... Always chaps me when people post 1 group and that's how their gun shoots.... Especially some rifle builders. It's a dead giveaway that they're all too proud of that 1/4" group when the same target shows up on their website and every online forum. Id like to see them post a 3 target string or something, just for confirmation that their rifles really do shoot well.


I will say that I've never seen the need to shoot a 20 shot group, lol. Kinda hard on barrels.
 
I can't believe "all day long" has not been mentioned yet!

I have had quite a few 223 Rem rifles that would shoot FMJ rounds between 1.5" to 5.0" all day long and that is the truth!
 
If it is a hunting rifle,1 shot a week for a month same target. If the shots stay within 1/2 inch of expected point of impact,that dog will hunt. (@100 yards).
 
Originally Posted By: derbyacresbobI can't believe "all day long" has not been mentioned yet!

I have had quite a few 223 Rem rifles that would shoot FMJ rounds between 1.5" to 5.0" all day long and that is the truth!


Can't use that unless you include the "if I do my part" disclaimer...any shot that falls outside of the .5 group was a flier that got pulled
crazy.gif
 
Originally Posted By: CZ527
I will say that I've never seen the need to shoot a 20 shot group, lol. Kinda hard on barrels.

Back when I was doing a lot of colony varmint shooting (20K rounds a year) I'd always pound out a 20 shot group with the working load to see how it would hold up for a real string in a dog town. Some very high dollar rifle builds and good load tuning, in good conditions, went all to crap right about then. Others, shined.

- DAA
 
Originally Posted By: DAAOriginally Posted By: CZ527
I will say that I've never seen the need to shoot a 20 shot group, lol. Kinda hard on barrels.

Back when I was doing a lot of colony varmint shooting (20K rounds a year) I'd always pound out a 20 shot group with the working load to see how it would hold up for a real string in a dog town. Some very high dollar rifle builds and good load tuning, in good conditions, went all to crap right about then. Others, shined.

- DAA

Yep 20 shot groups,will tell you more than any 3 shot group and most 5 shot groups. I've never done a 20 shot group but I follow ya
 
Originally Posted By: spotstalkshootIf it is a hunting rifle,1 shot a week for a month same target. If the shots stay within 1/2 inch of expected point of impact,that dog will hunt. (@100 yards).

I would be willing to bet 95% of benchrest, hunting, tactical, range & play rifles would NOT pass this test. That's asking a LOT in much change of condition.
 
I can honestly say I have never measured a group. I work up load, find one I like and go hunting. I don't have the patience for shooting paper.
 
Is the posted group measured right? A group more than two bullet widths wide can't be a .176 inch group.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: ninehorsesIs the posted group measured right? A group more than two bullet widths wide can't be a .176 inch group.

If I subtract my 204 from that group will my group be -0.028
unsure.gif
 
Originally Posted By: AzDiamondHeatI can honestly say I have never measured a group. I work up load, find one I like and go hunting. I don't have the patience for shooting paper.

I save water and soda bottles. Roughly prairie dog sized and explode quite nicely when full of water. Fun at the range and they don't kick you out for exploding targets.
 
Back
Top