South Dakota Indian Reservation Hunting

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kentdorfman

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I took a road trip through the Rosebud Reservation, the Standing Rock Reservation, the Lower Brule Reservation and other parts of South Dakota last week. The state is beautiful! We saw loads of antelope, huge whitetail bucks, at least 500 mule deer with some really awesome bucks in the herds, 1000's and 1000's of pheasants, hundreds of grouse, and loads of prairie dogs of coarse. I have heard that South Dakota has some of the best whitetail and mule deer hunting on the continent and from what I have seen, it is true. As we drove along we saw big buck after big buck. I am certain that some of the whitetail bucks were well over 300 pounds and had headgear that was awesome. Like any other state, the public land had little game but the private land was unbelievable!

One thing that I noticed was that, although the state of South Dakota is very clean along the roads and on private land, the Reservations are FILTHY. I have never seen so much garbage in the towns/villages, along the roads, and in on the prairies as what I saw on the Indian Reservations. The last thing I want to see when I go hunting is truck loads of plastic bags, candy wrappers, pop bottles, burned up cars, and other trash all over the hunting area. Has anyone else noticed this or did we travel through the 'bad' part of the reservations?
 
I have been going to SD all my life and still do every year because I have family that live there. I couldn't agree with you more. Many don't respect their own property. They destroy the houses that the government builds them. And it looks like most are starting their own junk yards. It is really shameful. Lake cabins long abandoned look like dumping grounds, stuff around the building as well as in the water. From what I have seen most reservations are like what you saw.
 
We have went to South Dakota for the past two years and hunted on the reservation. It is a sad sight. People live in houses that look like they need dozed over. We picked up our guide at his house and it had waist deep grass in the front yard and a water heater on the front porch. If you think you have it bad at home.....just go to a res.....you don't!
 
With the Obama plan we will all be living in those conditions. You can't give anything to people because they will not respect it unless they earn it!
 
The Reservations here are not quite that bad. But just like anywhere, 6th, 7th, 8th generation living on welfare , will create those conditions.
 
But the welfare for the Indians was decided on by the Government that actually Stole the land from the Indians and then calling it America home of the Free! Sounds a little different in that light doesent it?
 
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I didn't mean for this thread to get political. Nor did I intend to start a "who gets wellfare" sniveling post. I don't think it is the government's fault that their is trash all over the roads, fences, towns, prairie lands, and crop lands on the Reservations. I was just wondering if anyone else noticed how filthy the Reservations are? And, at the same time, I was wondering if anyone else noticed how the amount of game on the Reservations is not nearly as thick as the game off of the Reservations on the private land?

The hunters I have talked to were excited to book a hunt because "the price was right" but then got there and were disappointed in the overall experience due to lack of game/guide issues. It seems that the Reservations offer hunting base more on their reputation than on their production. I am really concerned about booking a hunt where I hope to get an excellent outdoor experience and so many people experience theft, filth, and guides with low motivation. Am I worrying too much or should I just go with a reputable outfitter off of the reservation and know I won't worry about theft and filth issues and figure that if the outfit's reputation is excellent, the guide are too?

That is the big question.
 
kentdorfman,

First of all I mean this with all do respect, and I'm not trying to get in a fight here. But it sounds to me like you've already got your mind made up that unless your going with a "professional" guide service you won't be happy. I responded to your other thread about PD shooting in SD and your did not reply. I am a Native American and a rancher on the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation and sir it seems to me that I'm glad that you didn't reply. It seems that no matter what kind of experience you have, you will not be happy. I have lived here my whole life and am the fourth generation to work our ranch and we take great pride in keeping it very clean and neat. We have a very good amount of dogs aswell. But like I said before, I'm not a professional, just a part time guy that knows where there's lots of dogs. The reservation areas of South Dakota are some of the most impoverished in the USA and any time you have that much poverty the filth just comes along with it.

Cedarbutte
 
Good post cedarbutte.There are plenty who take pride in what they do and how they conduct themselves sadly most don't get to see that though!
 
Cedarbutte,

I am glad that you take such pride in your ranch! I thought I must have missed something on they way through. I have not made my mind up. I have come here hoping to get some insight as to what to expect if I go with a reservation hunt or one on private land. I have been on many hunts some successful and some not and been happy with most. I stand by my statement that I would not want to hunt in an area where there is trash within eyesight of all of my hunting area. THAT would disappoint me. I am certain I never drove past it because there was nothing neat and clean on the road I was on.

While the animals that tm17rem took pictures of are nice for a meat hunt, they are what I would expect to see if I were to do a 'do-it-myself' or public land hunt. While I would not be extremely disappointed if those were the best bucks I saw on a guided hunt, I would certainly bring my tag home unfilled. The bison with the tags in their ears really doesn't do it for me, however. As a hunter I understand that a part time guide should not be expected to find his clients top notch trophies very often. So I think if a guy was to hire a part-time guide, that person should be satisfied with ANY of the animals in the pictures.

In all of my years of hunting I have found that full time guides are great at their jobs. They are not perfect, but great, and that is good enough for me. I have also found that part-time guides and 'do-it-yourself' hunters think they are as good of hunters as the full-time guides. They are not, but they think they are. They blame their lack of success/consistancy on luck, weather, hunting area, etc. "EXCUSES BUT NO MOOSES" is how we put it up here.

 
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I have lived in South Dakota most of my life. I say most of my life cause I worked and lived in the Twin Cities of Minnesota (Minneapolis / ST Paul). I am hear to tell you that yes I have seen what you describe on some of the Reservations in South Dakota, BUT I also saw the same types of things in Minneapolis / ST Paul Minnesota, and not far from the State Capitol in ST Paul.

I also worked as a Security Officer at a Tribal Casino for a few months. While some of the people I worked with (both Natives and Whites) I would trust with my life there are others that I wouldn't turn my back on.

I guess the point I am trying to make is this, there are good and bad people in any race, period. There are people in ever race that take pride in their property, homes and surrounding areas, and those that don't for one reason or another.

I remember a particular trip to the Cheyenne River Reservation on a Prairie Dog Hunt one year. We drove through a tribal housing project called White Horse and noticed several new homes being built at the time. The following year we drove through White Horse and actually saw a hole cut in the side of one of those homes that were being built the previous year and there was a horse drinking water out of the bath tub.

On the other hand I have been to ranches on the Cheyenne River Reservation that when I drove into the yard it was as nice and neat as any I had seen anywhere.

As per the Part Time Guide vs a Full Time Guide and Outfitter, I am not qualified to comment on that situation as I have never been on a fully guided hunt and probably never will. I guess to me it would all boil down to my first impression with my first conversation with the guide in question, as I tend to believe my first impressions in regards to people. If the guide answered all of my questions in a manner that lead me to believe he could provide me what I was after, that would go a long way in helping me make my decision.

However as I stated I have never been on a guided hunt so will not comment any further on the subject.

Thanks for the nice things you have had to say about South Dakota. As I have stated I have lived in South Dakota almost my entire life and am very proud of South Dakota. No it may not be the most perfect place to live, but it is close in my opinion.

Larry
 
Originally Posted By: TA17remIf a tribal member leaves the reservation and tries to work somewhere else he can or will loose his benifits and then he is screwed. he can always go look for a job but who is going to hire a Indian. Its a tuff job market in some places of the U.S...

No they don't loose their benefits, but they do have to get to one of the off Reservation hospitals to get the medical. They can still get on commodities even off reservation.

"he can always go look for a job but who is going to hire a Indian."
Lots of companies hire Indians, you can start the list with just about any national company. And by the way, you look like a bigot and racist with that statement.
 
Quote:No they don't loose their benefits, but they do have to get to one of the off Reservation hospitals to get the medical. They can still get on commodities even off reservation.

"he can always go look for a job but who is going to hire a Indian."
Lots of companies hire Indians, you can start the list with just about any national company. And by the way, you look like a bigot and racist with that statement.

Not sure how its run on all Res. but the one near by me openned up a casino years ago and members that moved off the Res. wanted back in so they could get in on the money..
They where allowed to move back to the Res. but they could not get any of the money comeing from the cassino..
Some companys are required to hire so many minorities but once the quota is filled they have a very slim chance of being hired.. I'm not a bigot or racist, just telling it like it is, its a tuff world out there...
If they have a colledge education then they have a good chance getting on with a national company...
 
Isn't that what I said. I just didn't comment on the government. Everyone knows the government is at fault when it comes to handouts.
 
kentdorfman,

Who do you think owns the private land where the trophy class animals are taken? RANCHERS. And I guess I spend a [beeep] of a lot more time out on the land riding and moving cattle, where theres a pretty good chance your gonna see some big deer, and know whats going on. I agree with what you said about most of the deer on TA17's pics but trust me there are more deer on the reservation than that. So what makes a professional guide better? He has trail cams out so he can show you a picture of a good deer? He comes down from town once a week to get up on the hill and scope around? Or is it he knows how to coddle your butt and make you feel like the great white hunter? Because most of them had to be hauled around by the rancher who knows where everything is to begin with. If thats what your lookin for go somewhere else. If you wanna hike up your boot straps and come shoot a 28-30 muley or a 20 white tail I'm your man. Like I said I might not be a "professional" guide but that sure don't make them any better. And by the way don't kid yourself, most full time guides have another full time job that pays the bills. They just lease the hunting rights in the fall from the ranchers, and then charge the heck out of you to come hunt. By the way for the extent of your hunt I am a full time guide, I'm just not afraid to admit that I have another full time job aswell. I guess what really makes me mad is that just because you made a little trip down here one time and drove around a little bit it makes you feel as if your some kind of an authority on the subject, and now you can make broad statements. Made you should educate yourself before you go running other people down.

Cedarbutte
 
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Cedarbutte pointed out that I was running people down. I did not mean to be. If I was, I appologize. I had made a point that part-time guides are not as good of hunters as full time guides even though they think they are. I think that point is proven with Cedarbuttes reply...he clearly thinks he is as good a of a hunter/guide as the full-time guides. He does make a good point about most guides being part-timers and true full time guide is hard to find. There are true full time guides out there. Willie Dvorak of Jim River Guide Service is a full-time guide/outfitter. His satisfied clients are constantly making comments about the quality of his service on this forum and other forums. I am sure there are some others out there, but he is the only one I am aware of.
 
So then I guess the only point to your post is that the Reservations are all filthy and Willie Dvorak is the only true guide that you are aware of in South Dakota. Then you had probably better book a hunt with him then. And make sure he doesn't take you hunting anywhere you might drive by some trash along the way. And another thing as far as the part time guide being "not as good" well that's just dumb! I can show you alot of part time guides who have plenty of satified customers.
 
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