Ruger 17 Hornet

Originally Posted By: B23Originally Posted By: parsonCleaned it super clean as it seems to foul prematurely, put on a different scope, a vx3 - 4.5x14. Shot five 5 shot groups on a beautiful still day. I give up, it’s going back to Ruger. Averaged about 3 in. with Hornady factory loaded 20 gr. with and without the can, makes little or no difference

Does it just kind of throw them all over the target or is there any kind of pattern to it?

Unfortunately, Ruger isn't particularly well known for having great barrels so hopefully they replace the barrel at the least, if not the whole gun, and whatever you get back shoots much better for you.

Today they were consistently well spread out. I have had other days where maybe 2 would be close and the others spread out, gave me hope that maybe I could eventually get them all together but no such luck. I’m not fighting it anymore, not worth it to me, got better things to do.
 
Originally Posted By: SlickerThanSnotparson, maybe the bullets are doing that distancing thing like we are supposed to be doing.

Sounds reasonable to me
 
Another apples and oranges post, but....I have a T/C venture Predator in 223. I was in the same situation as you. My groups were terrible, usually about 1 1//4- 1 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards. I had somewhere in the neighborhood of 225 rounds threw it using several combinations of powder, bullets and primers. My last trip out was a make it or break it trip. I loaded maybe 25 rounds of Benchmark and a 50 grain Nosler starting at minimum load to 2 grains over book max. Groups were terrible until I got over max loads then they started really tightening up. When I got to 28 grains, the bullets started stacking on top of each other. I'm still not showing any major pressure signs and the accuracy is great. I guess what I'm saying is the rifle may not like what your feeding it. Just because its what you want to shoot out of it doesn't mean its going to like it. My 77/22 Hornet was similar. Some bullets shoot really well and some don't shoot good at all. Once again, it may be apples and oranges.
 
Consistant 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 isnt so terrible. My AR loaded with CFE223 and 53 vmax will shoot groups over a foot at 100 yards, it's amazing, side by side with a few other different powder and bullet combos holding an inch or better.
 
Originally Posted By: Rock KnockerConsistant 1 1/4 to 1 1/2 isn't so terrible. My AR loaded with CFE223 and 53 vmax will shoot groups over a foot at 100 yards, it's amazing, side by side with a few other different powder and bullet combos holding an inch or better.

1 1/4- 1 1/2 isn't to bad for some people but it drives me crazy. If it don't do better than that it goes down the road. I couldn't get the 53 grain V-Max to work for me either.
 
I just watched a Youtube video on the 77/17 Hornet from Gunblast. He was shooting 20 grain bullets and got exception accuracy. 22 Plinkster does one on the Savage 25 as well. He was also shooting 20 grain pills. Split a playing card at 100yds. Maybe parson just hasn't found the right bullet.
 
Well gentlemen, sent to Ruger, got it back today, haven’t had a chance to go to range, too windy. Ruger free floated the barrel, installed a new extractor and retorqued to factory specs. They sent a picture of two targets fired at 50 yards with Winchester 20gr. They say they are 3/8in at 50. Anybody know what factory torque specs are for action screws? Did a little on line search. Seems most saying about 90 inch pounds for front, 30 for rear. At least one claimed he had real accuracy issues with Ruger not torqued correctly.
 
The torque spec for the front angles screw on the M77 is 95 inch pounds.

90 doesn't sound unreasonable, but I'd call Ruger. And Ruger rifles do respond to stock screw differences in torque. Many a Ruger with a "bad barrel" has been cured with a screw driver....
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Originally Posted By: pyscodog90 inch pounds sounds really tight to me.

90 inch pounds equals 7.5 foot pounds, a lot compared to some others, I think most are closer 40
 
When this cartridge came out years ago I bought the savage walking rifle. It shot so so. I decided to buy a pack nor barrel and my own reamer from Dave Kiff. Took one of my old 7722 hornets and had it re-barrel down to the 17 hornady hornet. What a waste of money that was. It’s fun reading about guys who like theirs. Someday I might dig it out of the closet and see what I can do to make it shoot.
 
Finally got to the range this morning, about as ideal as it can be. Ruger did improve it but my groups were no where near as tight as they claim they got but about half or better than before I sent it in. They said they used Winchester ammo, which judging by description on box is Hornady, everything is identical. Going to try a different scope. Presently have a VX 3, 4.5x14 that I just got back from Leupold. They replace erector and tweaked a couple other things. Would not hold zero before, now does not track accurately. You can adjust it 4 clicks and get nothing one time and next time move an inch and a half. Time will tell
 
Put a VX 3, 2.5x8 on it, back to the range, no significant difference. Ruger said they got 3/8 in. groups at fifty. Thinking it might be a stability problem I put up a fifty target, one group three shots almost touching, other opened some. Back to town, bought a box of Winchester 20gr. and a box of Horandy 15.5 gr. No significant difference, the 15.5’s might have a slight edge but not much. Not sure where I go from here but done with Ruger so not worried about warranty, can’t make it any worse. Was hoping it would be at least a 150 yard prarie dog gun but now maybe no more than a 100 yard coon and skunk gun. I’ve had guns disappoint me before but not when they cost just short of a grand
 
I sure hope that you can get that Ruger to shoot like you want it to. Sure is frustrating trying to get something to shoot and it just gives you the finger all the time. I was just at the range yesterday with my CZ 527 Varmint .17 HH and three shot groups with both the factory 20 grain Vmax and my handloads with the same bullet were right at 1/2" for 100 yards. Our ground squirrels are pretty small and if you want to hit one at outchonder distances you need an accurate setup. I would be out there today but I have a crew here at the house replacing my heat and air unit. Hopefully tomorrow will smile at me.
 
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Things are getting weird. Ruger says their 17 Hornets have a 1 in 9 twist. I did it three times this morning. I get right at 7 1/2. Couldn’t believe it at first so was doubly careful next two times, same measurement. Makes me think I should try the 25 gr again.
 
Originally Posted By: parsonThings are getting weird. Ruger says their 17 Hornets have a 1 in 9 twist. I did it three times this morning. I get right at 7 1/2. Couldn’t believe it at first so was doubly careful next two times, same measurement. Makes me think I should try the 25 gr again.

YUpper.... something is weird.

I just checked mine and I got 1-9" on the nose five different times. I still haven't shot my rifle yet as we've had rain along with the Covid Crud this past few weeks.

Based on the rod threads, make sure that you push or pull it so that the rod and the jag don't separate.

No idea why yours came up short.
 
Hold all comments, I have obviously made a mistake here but haven’t got it nailed down. I put the jag in from rear and get one reading, Go from front and get another. It’s easy to get a false slow twist but not easy to get false fast twist. When I was gunsmithing and had a difficult time determining twist I would pour a lead or cerosafe slug onto the end of a cleaning rod while in bore, then pull it through, impossible to get a false reading then but when I retired I got rid of all my tools, have nothing but basic hand tools. If I still had my lathe I would put a new barrel on in a heart beat, but for now ???
 
Originally Posted By: parsonHold all comments, I have obviously made a mistake here but haven’t got it nailed down. I put the jag in from rear and get one reading, Go from front and get another. It’s easy to get a false slow twist but not easy to get false fast twist. When I was gunsmithing and had a difficult time determining twist I would pour a lead or cerosafe slug onto the end of a cleaning rod while in bore, then pull it through, impossible to get a false reading then but when I retired I got rid of all my tools, have nothing but basic hand tools. If I still had my lathe I would put a new barrel on in a heart beat, but for now ???

Since there has been no follow-up by the OP, I'll comment anyway even though he wants no comments on a public internet forum.

Hint............
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To accurately measure a barrel twist rate with a rod and a tight fitting patch or brush, you have to push or pull the rod in a direction which will keep the rod and jag firmly seated together based on the rod and jag thread match-up.

If you move them in the wrong direction and cause them to part to some degree, all you are measuring is how much distance in a gun barrel, with an already undetermined twist rate, that it takes for a freely rotating rod to rotate one revolution away from the jag which is following the lands and grooves of the rifle barrel. That measurement might be consistent or it might be radically inconsistent, and it will probably not be close to the actual twist rate of the barrel being checked.

Push or pull the rod in the wrong direction and you'll get typically inaccurate results per revolution of the rod. Push or pull the rod in the correct direction to keep them firmly seated together and the measured length on the rod moved for one full twist of the rod to occur will equate very closely to the rifle barrel twist rate.
 
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