New .17 winchester super mag RIMFIRE

TripleDeuce660

Active member
Haven't seen this posted on PM but today we learned winchester new rimfire is a .17 and it will be available in 20 and 25 grains. One article says " 500 fps " faster then any current rimfire. I imagine this means the 20 JHP and 20vmax will be 3,000 fps. The 25 grain vmax probably slower.

http://www.varminter.com/forums/topic/15..._30#entry130720

Look for the last posts. The velocity is not being released yet though. Some website say N/A and some say 1095 which is obviously wrong.

This guy claims to have shot it.

http://www.huntingclub.com/blogs/article...ge#.UNEtDG9ZUdp


I was about to plunk down the cash on a new wmr but now thinking I might hold off. A gun for rabbit head removal and possibly enough power for coyote. Price looks to be 15-18 dollars per 50.

If not enough for coyote at close range maybe fox and bobcat?

 
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Well I can already load my 17AH to a higher velocity for about the same amount of money it costs to buy 17HMR. If this is so much better than HMR it's going to cost more to play. Which also means... I'm out. I can't justify a 17 rimfire when I have an AH that kicks its [beeep]. At that price point it's doomed, the 17HH will kill it for sure.

If Winchester wants to do something new, why don't they come out with a nice new rifle with a stout little micro action to shoot the hornet based rounds.
 
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Not all of us reload... The 17 HH cost substantially more to shoot, infact .223 like 50 rounds fiochi or hornaday are both cheaper than 17hh. Show me where I can get 17hh for less than 22.99 or 26 per 50.... and yes both those go submoa in 2 guns for me and many other shooters on this website.

Reloading takes lots of time, space around your house, also need to live close to someplace to test out all that ammo. Someone like me has no time, space, or a close place to ammo test. This makes a round like this attractive. If 17 HH was 15 bucks per 50 I would be all over it!
 
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Originally Posted By: Furhunter

If Winchester wants to do something new, why don't they come out with a nice new rifle with a stout little micro action to shoot the hornet based rounds.

^This^
Lord knows there's already enough chamberings and junk rifles out there to go around.
Everyone likes a new cartrige but between the 17HM2, 17HMR, 17HH, 17FB, and 17Rem, I just don't see where there's a "void" to fill.
I simply don't see the point other than to appease you, who for some reason has had a hard on for the 17HH since it was just a glimmer in Steve Hornady's eye. LOL


 
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My 17 hmr shoots amazing. Ive put countless amounts of critters on the ground with it. Inside and out side of 100yds. Gonna take alot for me to look at a different 17 platform.

Edit: in rimfire. I want a 17hh BAD
 
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I might puck one up because I can't use centerfires for the first 2.5months of coyote season and 1.5 for fox. Im wondering what the parent case is or is it a new case all together and who is gonna make rifles chambered in it. I may pick up a 17HH on top of re 17Rem I'm gonna buy also. I only own one 17 and it's a HMR but I love the caliber and want one of each haha.
 
Originally Posted By: TripleDeuce660Not all of us reload... The 17 HH cost substantially more to shoot, infact .223 like 50 rounds fiochi or hornaday are both cheaper than 17hh. Show me where I can get 17hh for less than 22.99 or 26 per 50.... and yes both those go submoa in 2 guns for me and many other shooters on this website.

Reloading takes lots of time, space around your house, also need to live close to someplace to test out all that ammo. Someone like me has no time, space, or a close place to ammo test. This makes a round like this attractive. If 17 HH was 15 bucks per 50 I would be all over it!

Not all of us reload...... you could have ended it right there. I understand if you don't and can then see your point. I was simply giving input on "my position" with the new cartridge. I never mentioned anything about accuracy either so I dont know where your rant is coming from there.

Regardless of any position heres the obstacle that must be overcome.

Quote:My 17 hmr shoots amazing. Ive put countless amounts of critters on the ground with it. Inside and out side of 100yds. Gonna take alot for me to look at a different 17 platform.

Edit: in rimfire. I want a 17hh BAD


I dont think you will see the masses of 17HMR shooters beating down the doors of the sporting good stores for another rimfire thats even more expensive to shoot than what they already have even if it does go just a little bit faster. Performance gain is minimal for the money its going to cost you to do it.

Lots of people are happy with the HMR. Will the new 17 rimfire purchasers look at the costs of ammo before deciding what to shoot? If they balk at the new magnum ammo cost the salesman's going to say... well you can shoot the HMR for 5 bucks less per box.... and another 17HMR walks out the door!



 
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Originally Posted By: TripleDeuce660Not all of us reload... The 17 HH cost substantially more to shoot, infact .223 like 50 rounds fiochi or hornaday are both cheaper than 17hh. Show me where I can get 17hh for less than 22.99 or 26 per 50....

$19.99 at Sportman's Warehouse per 25 rounds is $.80 per round. If it really is an awesome round (and I'll know later today when I pick up my 25 W.V. and take it to the range) I'm ok with that price. Yes I reload. But quite frankly the Hornady Superformance line of ammo has shot as good as my handloads so it doesn't make sense for me to load ammo right now.
 
I'm wondering if they took one of the old .44 caliber rimfires and necked it down to .17cal.

Something like these.

44rf.jpg
 
Originally Posted By: FurhunterI dont think you will see the masses of 17HMR shooters beating down the doors of the sporting good stores for another rimfire thats even more expensive to shoot than what they already have even if it does go just a little bit faster. Performance gain is minimal for the money its going to cost you to do it.

While I generally agree, I'll pose this question:

What did the .17HMR really do that the .22WMR wasn't already doing?

I bought a .17HMR just for kicks and grins, frankly, haven't seen anything out of it that I really think makes it superior in any way to the .22WMR, and in my experience, it's severely lacking in downrange killing performance compared to it's "old man". I like the round, absolutely LOVE it in my 6" Taurus Tracker (have it in a Savage 93 and a Marlin 17 as well), but is it really better than the .22WMR? Not in my book.

So, you're asking the question, "why would guys jump on a new round that doesn't really do anything different than an old round except fly a little faster?"... My answer is, "because they have done so in the past"...

Beyond that, I don't think it's fair to assume that they're only targeting the .17HMR shooters. For what it's worth, if it's a 17 pushing 500fps faster with a 17 or 20grn bullet, you're looking at 20% more energy. What that means to someone that doesn't use a rimfire AT ALL is that here's something significantly more powerful than any of the other rimfires out there, so if I'm a guy that was hesitating to "stoop down to a rimfire", now I don't have to bend quite so low. So now I'm comparing my ammo cost (considering these guys probably AREN'T reloading anyway) to my current centerfire costs, I'd be saving money on ammo, the price point of the .17HMR being totally irrelevant, since I'm not buying HMR ammo.

I'm not saying I care at all about this new round, and I'll say this, I won't be jumping on it. But, that's my 2cents on the matter. Speed and power will always be king with consumers, and rimfires are favored by a lot of guys right now for various reasons.

We can all agree, it'll very likely become popular in rimfire only zones, regardless of how substantial the difference is, or isn't.

Consumers are exceedingly predictable. It doesn't have to REALLY be better, it just has to sound better. "New and Improved" doesn't have to necessarily be true to get sales. The .17HMR didn't change anything, but I'd personally say it's more popular than the .22WMR, and undeservingly so. All the new round needs is enough traction to get into the market, and it'll earn a spot. Frankly, there's a lot of room in the rimfire market. How many 30caliber rounds are there out there that honestly aren't any different than one another? From .308, .30-06, .300WM, .300WSM, RSAUM, RUM, 30-378, .308ME, etc etc etc... Any perceived difference in effective range is unsubstantial, yet they're all there, and they all have their own followings. With only 4 different rimfires in the game, there's a lot of room for new players, even if they don't do anything different than the same old same.
 
Originally Posted By: Varminterror
While I generally agree, I'll pose this question:

What did the .17HMR really do that the .22WMR wasn't already doing?



That's an easy one... Not much but it was a completely new and exciting 17 in a world washed with 22's

Hahahahaha
The bright side to a new faster 17 rimfire would be that it just might be a viable 100 yard prairie dog gun.....
whistle.gif
 
Originally Posted By: pahntr760I can see it as a nice alternative in rimfire only zones. That's about it...

Yep
And even then I think I'd rather have a 5MM.
Course, that choice doesn't take into accord a couple bux a box price point which shouldn't be as important as a clean kill.
JMO
 
I agree the hummer had nothing on the wmr and that is why I was going to get another 22mag.

With the 25 gr bullet it MIGHT actually give some decent performance.

For you 17hh guys I noticed the CZ website says it will be in the 527 in 2013, that is exciting.
 
id be all over it...here in mass we are limited to rimfire after dark, 22 mag not permitted, yet .17 are ok...imo .17hmr is a little lacking for yotes on anything but a perfect shot.......
 
I was ready to get an HMR or Mag or similar Then I really thought about it
I would be using it at night time hunting and here in NY it is mostly limited to 100 yards and less
I decided to go with a .308 AIR RIFLE
I just tuned mine to shoot 96 grain hollowpoints at 230 FPE
at 100 yards I am hitting at 170 FPE and 7 inches of drop
This thing hammers when it hits
I tested it out on a turkey the other day (freezer burned one)
It passed completely through at 75 yards with a .309 hole going in and a 2 in hole going out
I cast my own slugs for it which is very cheap and easy
and all it takes is some effort to pump it up with the hand pump or use my portable SCBA tank
 
Originally Posted By: deerslyr1.here in mass we are limited to rimfire after dark, 22 mag not permitted, yet .17 are ok

What in the world is their reasoning behind that?
 
Originally Posted By: RePeteOriginally Posted By: pahntr760I can see it as a nice alternative in rimfire only zones. That's about it...

Yep
And even then I think I'd rather have a 5MM.
Course, that choice doesn't take into accord a couple bux a box price point which shouldn't be as important as a clean kill.
JMO

Agree 100% especially on the 5mm aspect...
lol.gif
 
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