If you could only justify one piece of NV equipment now


Cmatra....

Stick with what you know from day hunting.... You call them in and then shoot with a scope. Apply the same to your NV setup.

You will first need to be able see them by scanning. Decide what type of NV technology you want to use for that purpose.

After that decide how you want to shoot. Use your day scope with a good kill light until you can afford a dedicated NV scope if you need to.

If you think a dual use device like the PVS 14 will work for you then give that a try. You could add a FLIR later for scanning and then leave the PVS 14 mounted as a fixed scope setup.

I think you would be better off to forget about helmets and multiple laser devices to begin with. Why try to learn how to night hunt and also completely change how you shoot at the same time? Keep it simple and you will enjoy hunting and not be overly occupied with gadgets and technology.
 
I have to admit when it takes some getting used to shooting that way-can I? If I get a FLIR 32 (or do I need to consider an LS) and NV scope, what NV scope has decent mag, doesn't weigh 3#, and is durable. Really like the D 730 at 3.8x mag and 20 oz, but worry about the lighted mil dot reticle. Most mil dots are too big for hunting. I have a Leupold CQT Mark 3 1-3 on one of my ar's. At 1x mag, the dot is 9 moa, at 3x 3moa! That would cover the whole coyote (9x). Is there a best place to buy all this stuff or do you just need to shop it around?
 
I will be taking my D740 and Flir PS32 into Nebraska tonight for coyotes, i will let you know exactly how i feel about the set up on Monday or Tuesday of next week.

So far, i feel really good about it!
 
I agree with Gman and the guys here,keep it simple,first off,I would get the Flir for scanning,and game retreaval...use your light for the shot.If you dont like it,you will be able to get close to what you paid.
But you will be hooked like the rest of us,then you can add a NV rifle scope or other...
 
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I have a PS32 and a D 740 and I feel great when I head out at night as nothing is going to get by me without me seeing it. I would get the flir first and a Kill light for shooting because if you can't spot it you can't shoot it. If you can aford it get both and you won't be sorry. The flir also works during the day for spotting bobcats as they are sneaking in and so hard to see. Nothing will get by you.
 
My choice would be the PVS-14 or the MX-160s that we sell in our Signature Series Scope setups (http://www.hightechredneckincorporated.com/Night_Vision_Scopes_s/2.htm). Surprise, Surprise here !!! I just like the versatility of using only one NV unit for doing both scanning and shooting. You can also use the monocular for many other activities (scouting, finding deer stands, duckblinds).....it is not just a device you can attach to your riflescope. I have never looked through a thermal unit so I don't know if it is worth the extra investment to purchase two units to get the same job done. I don't have any problem finding them at great distances (300 to 500 yards) with the PVS-14 or MX-160. I always hunt the open areas at night so being able to see them in tall grass or timber is never a problem. I set up in places where I can call them out of that stuff !! If you don't mind purchasing pre-owned stuff we can get you set up with one of our MX-160s in the low 2k range which is very cheap for a Gen 3 NV device. Kevin
 
Originally Posted By: HTRN57I have never looked through a thermal unit so I don't know if it is worth the extra investment to purchase two units to get the same job done.

Not only do I HIGHLY recommend looking through one, you might want to start looking at selling them...
wink.gif
There is a reason most everyone in this thread said Flir first. Until you have looked through one scouting for critters, it does seem almost unreal how well they work.
 
Originally Posted By: cjdavis618Originally Posted By: HTRN57I have never looked through a thermal unit so I don't know if it is worth the extra investment to purchase two units to get the same job done.

Not only do I HIGHLY recommend looking through one, you might want to start looking at selling them...
wink.gif
There is a reason most everyone in this thread said Flir first. Until you have looked through one scouting for critters, it does seem almost unreal how well they work.



+1
 
if you do some searching on the PS32 you will see that the price seems to be coming down a bit and there are more and more places that advertise them in stock, so they are readily available. I have been wanting to get one too.
 
My focus has been on introducing hunters to the wonderful world of night hunting using NV at the lowest possible but effective price. That is why I have introduced and patented a process which allows the purchase of only one NV unit for both scanning and shooting. No doubt the Flir would be a good scanning monocular for 2,600 or so but now you have to purchase another NV unit for shooting, or try to shoot with conventional lights. I think you kind of defeat your purpose of stealth by using a Flir or NV with conventional kill lights. Teaming up the Flir with a dedicated NV riflescope is a great option, however, it is going to cost you around 5 to 6K to get it done. I can get the job done very well with a Gen 3 device (PVS-14 or MX-160 monocular with attachments and High Power IR) starting at 2300. If you are looking for a single piece of equipment that will get the job done this is a very cost effective avenue to consider. Kevin
 
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Originally Posted By: HTRN57My focus has been on introducing hunters to the wonderful world of night hunting using NV at the lowest possible but effective price. That is why I have introduced and patented a process which allows the purchase of only one NV unit for both scanning and shooting. No doubt the Flir would be a good scanning monocular for 2,600 or so but now you have to purchase another NV unit for shooting, or try to shoot with conventional lights. I think you kind of defeat your purpose of stealth by using a Flir or NV with conventional kill lights. Teaming up the Flir with a dedicated NV riflescope is a great option, however, it is going to cost you around 5 to 6K to get it done. I can get the job done very well with a Gen 3 device (PVS-14 or MX-160 monocular with attachments and High Power IR) starting at 2300. If you are looking for a single piece of equipment that will get the job done this is a very cost effective avenue to consider. Kevin

thanks Kevin, but I already have a pvs14 pinnacle with 3x and a helmet and mount. I added an DBAL I2 and a Torch IR to the mix also. now I just want to complete it all with a PS32. I think that will make a big difference. I won't have to use the helmet then if I don't want to. it will allow me a break from the helmet on a long night.

then I will be looking at a D740 or D760 for a .243... there is always a next thing you want... lol
 
Pvs 14 and IR laser for me. Guys talking about hip shooting and such is rediculous. Just because you have a laser on doesn't mean you throw out the fundamentals of marksmanship and spray lead. You adapt and apply them the best you can. You shoulder the rifle and apply good trigger press and follow through. I have no issues with 100+yd shots with a laser at night.

This set up affords the most versatility and usefulness from the system imho.
 
Originally Posted By: Viper6actualPvs 14 and IR laser for me. Guys talking about hip shooting and such is rediculous. Just because you have a laser on doesn't mean you throw out the fundamentals of marksmanship and spray lead. You adapt and apply them the best you can. You shoulder the rifle and apply good trigger press and follow through. I have no issues with 100+yd shots with a laser at night.

This set up affords the most versatility and usefulness from the system imho.

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Sorry, I should have explained better. When I say hip shooting I mean off a 3 point sling (magpul) and when walking in area where something will jump from the brush/tree and I have no time to shoulder, control the breathing and slowly squeeze the trigger.

When using the laser, most of the time I don't shoulder the weapon because i have better stability with the sling then just holding the AR up, into the shoulder and away from the face and pvs14. Plus I get a better field of view.

If I was attempting over 100 yards with the laser I would most likely be on some type of shooting sticks/rest, but I know other members have kills over 100 yards off hand. Me personally, if I had a coyote over 100 yards and I had the time for scoping, I would suggest using the pvs 14/scope instead of the laser. The reason, IR lasers don't have the exact poi as your scope and they are designed for human size targets and not coyotes and I don’t like to miss. Plus some coyotes only give you a head shot and 100 plus yards at night in the woods or field would be really tough, but not impossible.

I don't shoulder the AR with my nose on the charging handle because the helmet and PVS 14 gets in the way. So the gun will need to be lower than your head or maybe more. Sometimes you need to be able to see over the gun/scope for the target. And it also depends on what eye you put the pvs14 over. Also, you could get IR bloom/reflection from the helmet IR illuminator if your too close to the gun with your head. All depends on your setup and what’s in the way.

With the shotgun and at ranges of 50 yards and less (number 7's, 8's or 9's) I do not have any problems with not shouldering the weapon and hitting the target with the large pattern of the shotgun. If I use buckshot or tshot then I shoulder the weapon completely because of the recoil with 3 1/2 loads. But my helmet/head is away from the gun and not near the stock.

I would suggest before getting a IR/visible laser, Mount the PVS 14 to either a day scope (my preference and more accurate) or eotech & pvs 14 3xmagnifier and then decide if you think you will be hunting with it and at what ranges. Its a great tool to have in the arsenal. I think Lasers are a must for the shotgun but I think most coyote hunters can live without the laser on the AR. Also, after 125 yards or so and looking at the edge of the woods with pvs14 on helmet, I like to have the pvs14 with the 3x magnifier on the helmet. Recently, i have gone to the flir on the helmet and pvs 14 on the gun.


Viper can you tell us what range you sight your ir laser in at? I am trying to get an idea what other members are doing with lasers. thanks.
 
Originally Posted By: Mr BenelliOriginally Posted By: Viper6actualPvs 14 and IR laser for me. Guys talking about hip shooting and such is rediculous. Just because you have a laser on doesn't mean you throw out the fundamentals of marksmanship and spray lead. You adapt and apply them the best you can. You shoulder the rifle and apply good trigger press and follow through. I have no issues with 100+yd shots with a laser at night.

This set up affords the most versatility and usefulness from the system imho.

7976506894_1d2031600b_m.jpg


7976518243_cfe47ce521_m.jpg


Sorry, I should have explained better. When I say hip shooting I mean off a 3 point sling (magpul) and when walking in area where something will jump from the brush/tree and I have no time to shoulder, control the breathing and slowly squeeze the trigger.

When using the laser, most of the time I don't shoulder the weapon because i have better stability with the sling then just holding the AR up, into the shoulder and away from the face and pvs14. Plus I get a better field of view.

If I was attempting over 100 yards with the laser I would most likely be on some type of shooting sticks/rest, but I know other members have kills over 100 yards off hand. Me personally, if I had a coyote over 100 yards and I had the time for scoping, I would suggest using the pvs 14/scope instead of the laser. The reason, IR lasers don't have the exact poi as your scope and they are designed for human size targets and not coyotes and I don’t like to miss. Plus some coyotes only give you a head shot and 100 plus yards at night in the woods or field would be really tough, but not impossible.

I don't shoulder the AR with my nose on the charging handle because the helmet and PVS 14 gets in the way. So the gun will need to be lower than your head or maybe more. Sometimes you need to be able to see over the gun/scope for the target. And it also depends on what eye you put the pvs14 over. Also, you could get IR bloom/reflection from the helmet IR illuminator if your too close to the gun with your head. All depends on your setup and what’s in the way.

With the shotgun and at ranges of 50 yards and less (number 7's, 8's or 9's) I do not have any problems with not shouldering the weapon and hitting the target with the large pattern of the shotgun. If I use buckshot or tshot then I shoulder the weapon completely because of the recoil with 3 1/2 loads. But my helmet/head is away from the gun and not near the stock.

I would suggest before getting a IR/visible laser, Mount the PVS 14 to either a day scope (my preference and more accurate) or eotech & pvs 14 3xmagnifier and then decide if you think you will be hunting with it and at what ranges. Its a great tool to have in the arsenal. I think Lasers are a must for the shotgun but I think most coyote hunters can live without the laser on the AR. Also, after 125 yards or so and looking at the edge of the woods with pvs14 on helmet, I like to have the pvs14 with the 3x magnifier on the helmet. Recently, i have gone to the flir on the helmet and pvs 14 on the gun.


Viper can you tell us what range you sight your ir laser in at? I am trying to get an idea what other members are doing with lasers. thanks.


i am with you on most all of this. i do however run my 14 on my left eye and shoulder to the right. i do not ntch the weapon as that obviously don't work but i do try to be square with it so as to mitigate recoil jump and stay on target. i do couple mine to day optics frequently and have had terrific results doing so. recently i was out on some yotes and had 5 on me in a matter of 20 min with only my lr bolt gun and 14 coupled up. i couldnt get it into action fast enough. only one kia... that is why i like the ir laser and ar set up for times like that.

i have never used the onboard ir light on the 14 outdoors as it is basically worthless outside of a dark room. i run a super tac ir and it is simply amazing in performance. my ir laser is a israeli MARS sight which looks somewhat like an eotech with a built in ir laser. they are slaved together so when you zero one you have zeroed them both. i keep them with a point blank zero of just over 200yd. it has served me well so far.
 
I saw the mars and with it mounted that far forward I see other options now. mars


Also, like you said the bunch of coyotes screaming in at once would be a perfect example on when to use the ir laser or visible laser.

I dont use the ir from the pvs 14. Only when i need to view something close in the blind. I mean the luna, torch, eagletac ir's. I have these mounted over the scope on accessory rail (luna), front rail, top or side on the helmet. Putting the ir on the helmet lets you put the gun at rest until your ready to shoot. otherwise you would have to scan with the ir illuminaor on the gun which gets tough after a long walk. Plus the illuminator on the dbal d2 will drain the batteries quickly and you would need to keep it in the ir and ir illuminator mode. I turn that on with the pressure switch and ir laser just before i shoot.

 
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Now I don’t shoot with a laser but have played with a few on a range out to 200 yards and thought ok these are kind of cool and yes I can see an application for distance under 50 yards, in buildings and other urban environment. But I couldn’t see any real benefits for hunting predators, the boogie man yes or in some combat situations where awareness of your environment is needed while engaging targets I can see where having one would be a big plus
Predators, such as hogs and cats and coyotes, I think a M845 on a rifle that fits properly will be much faster for target acquisition and target to target transitions than a laser will any day, just for the simple fact that the platform of firing from a mounted position will give greater recoil & shot to shot recovery, target acquisition will be faster as your gun will point where you look from a mounted position. And you will have less tendency to track the sights whereas with a laser your will tend to track the laser to the target which will be slower than shifting your eyes then shifting your sights.

25 odd years ago a guy entered the World Speed Shooting Championship with a Laser mounted on a pistol and a special pair of glasses and some big azz battery pack on his back, he didn’t do very well at all.

That said I would still like to have one on a shotgun
 
Have you actually put down any critters with a weapon mounted IR laser and helmet mounted NOD? I have and it works quite well. Scanning with a weapon mounted sight really stinks. Now if you are fortunate enough to be able to afford both a sight and observation device then good on you. Most cannot....and to get the most performance out of it you need to adapt your kit accordingly.

It takes practice to be proficient at using.this type of set up just like any shooting but I assure you it is deadly.
 
I guess I am fortunate enough I use a FLIR PS32 on a head mount over the left eye and can mount and shoot with it in place with both my D760 or M845.

And I have shot lasers out to 200 yards with ease, and watch guys run them in defensive scenarios lots

I just found them to be a limited application tool for most Predator hunting, I can see having one set up on a Ruger 10/22 or a shot gun busting up rabbits or dillos in the brush would be a hoot where you might need NV to navigate as well as shoot at the same time at a moment’s notice,

or like out of an armored car window or portal, LOL but I don’t drive a armored car anymore and scout my predator stands ahead of time as much as I can so navagation is not a big concern

I’m sure they are deadly many have proven it (skypup for one) but as (if I could justify ony one NV set up) its not versatile enough for me. A PVS 14 and Laser would not be my first choice, I think you can get into a M845 with IR for less and I run mine all the time from 25 to 300 yards if I thought I could pick up another then it would be FLIR first then a dedicated scope or one of HTRN clip on if I need to navigate as well,
Just saying
 
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