Epic day with my daughter!
- Thread starter JTPinTX
- Start date
JTPinTX
Custom Call Maker
Lefty she is 9 now. I was having a PM conversation with zr600 on this very subject of recoil sensitivity. It is my considered opinion that noise, has just as much to do with perceived recoil, as recoil itself. So along those lines I am going to copy and paste a littel bit of the conversation I have been having with zr600.
She started shooting a 10/22 in a special little purple cut down stock when she was 5. Her hearing is sensitive so I really had to be diligent with ear pro. But she loved that little 10/22 and got good with it pretty quick.
I had a little CZ-527, and that was her next step up. At 6 years old she would still say it kicked her, and was loud, even with good muffs on. I loaded special practice loads for her, 40 VMAX and 11 grains of Blue Dot. Shot about like a 22 Hornet. When it was time to shoot her first deer (she was 6) I just put a regular load in, and she never knew the difference with the adrenaline dump that was going on. At that point I adapted an adjustable buttplate onto the CZ (it made it ugly, but so what). I also chopped the barrel down to 18" because by that time I was shooting with suppressors.
Suppressors were the best thing I ever did. She tells everyone she won't shoot without a can ever again, lol. As soon as we put the can on she started shooting full power loads and never looked back. Since she really enjoys that little rifle she shoots it a lot. Since she shoots it a lot, she is good with it. Since she is good with it, she has success. And with success, she wants to go more.
She started shooting a 10/22 in a special little purple cut down stock when she was 5. Her hearing is sensitive so I really had to be diligent with ear pro. But she loved that little 10/22 and got good with it pretty quick.
I had a little CZ-527, and that was her next step up. At 6 years old she would still say it kicked her, and was loud, even with good muffs on. I loaded special practice loads for her, 40 VMAX and 11 grains of Blue Dot. Shot about like a 22 Hornet. When it was time to shoot her first deer (she was 6) I just put a regular load in, and she never knew the difference with the adrenaline dump that was going on. At that point I adapted an adjustable buttplate onto the CZ (it made it ugly, but so what). I also chopped the barrel down to 18" because by that time I was shooting with suppressors.
Suppressors were the best thing I ever did. She tells everyone she won't shoot without a can ever again, lol. As soon as we put the can on she started shooting full power loads and never looked back. Since she really enjoys that little rifle she shoots it a lot. Since she shoots it a lot, she is good with it. Since she is good with it, she has success. And with success, she wants to go more.
Last edited:
I agree 100% JTP, noise does go with or adds to percieved recoil. I also have a 527 and I really enjoy that little rifle. I had an adjustable cheek piece installed in my 527. The day my daughter shot it the sharp edge of the cheek piece, evn though it was lowered all the way, bit thta tender skin under her arm.
I think I have her convinced to try it again. We stood out back the other day and I shot 2rds loaded with Trail Boss to show her how it can be. I think she will try it again soon, just have to get her to the range.
I think I have her convinced to try it again. We stood out back the other day and I shot 2rds loaded with Trail Boss to show her how it can be. I think she will try it again soon, just have to get her to the range.
JTPinTX
Custom Call Maker
Lefty,
LOP on the stock is probably working against her too. There really isn't a cheap or easy way around that. You could buy a second stock and chop it, and swap back and forth for you. That is a PITA if you like to shoot that rifle very much though. I went the adjustable route and did the work myself, but it was a huge amount of work getting it all fitted right on that little stock. Even then there is the issue of getting eye relief set properly for two shooters while changing the LOP. Now that she is serious about it I pretty much just set the rifle up for her, and if I shoot it then I deal with an eye relief that is kind of wacky for me. She struggled in the beginning because she was pretty much shooting a rifle that was set up for an adult, that didn't fit her right, yet she was trying to learn on it. It is a bad combination yet it is what most kids have to deal with because most parents that are teaching them don't have either the knowledge or resources to really make it right for them. As expensive as good rifles are you don't want to be hacking one up unless you think your kids are going to be serious about shooting it. In hindsight, if were I to have to do it over again, I would just buy something cheap like the RAR (with a 9 or faster twist to shoot some heavier deer bullets), chop the heck out of it, and never look back.
Brecklyn still can't shoot that CZ offhand. Especially with a can it is too heavy for her. She is pretty big and strong for her age too. But she does really good with field positions now.
I started her out sitting, off a bipod, very early on. I did that for multiple reasons. First off, it was an easy way to support the rifle and a position that was fairly comfortable to her, and easy to adjust. Secondly it was pretty safe, since a bipod from the sitting position doesn't let you have an overly free range of motion to sweep somebody with the muzzle. Third, it played into the ultimate goal of being how she was more than likely going to have to shoot game out in the field once she got good enough to hunt with it. I just started her close and gradually kept moving the targets further out.
She was a tiny little thing when we first started.
Brecklyn 22 by https://www.flickr.com/photos/156517515@N04/, on Flickr
LOP on the stock is probably working against her too. There really isn't a cheap or easy way around that. You could buy a second stock and chop it, and swap back and forth for you. That is a PITA if you like to shoot that rifle very much though. I went the adjustable route and did the work myself, but it was a huge amount of work getting it all fitted right on that little stock. Even then there is the issue of getting eye relief set properly for two shooters while changing the LOP. Now that she is serious about it I pretty much just set the rifle up for her, and if I shoot it then I deal with an eye relief that is kind of wacky for me. She struggled in the beginning because she was pretty much shooting a rifle that was set up for an adult, that didn't fit her right, yet she was trying to learn on it. It is a bad combination yet it is what most kids have to deal with because most parents that are teaching them don't have either the knowledge or resources to really make it right for them. As expensive as good rifles are you don't want to be hacking one up unless you think your kids are going to be serious about shooting it. In hindsight, if were I to have to do it over again, I would just buy something cheap like the RAR (with a 9 or faster twist to shoot some heavier deer bullets), chop the heck out of it, and never look back.
Brecklyn still can't shoot that CZ offhand. Especially with a can it is too heavy for her. She is pretty big and strong for her age too. But she does really good with field positions now.
I started her out sitting, off a bipod, very early on. I did that for multiple reasons. First off, it was an easy way to support the rifle and a position that was fairly comfortable to her, and easy to adjust. Secondly it was pretty safe, since a bipod from the sitting position doesn't let you have an overly free range of motion to sweep somebody with the muzzle. Third, it played into the ultimate goal of being how she was more than likely going to have to shoot game out in the field once she got good enough to hunt with it. I just started her close and gradually kept moving the targets further out.
She was a tiny little thing when we first started.
Brecklyn 22 by https://www.flickr.com/photos/156517515@N04/, on Flickr
Last edited:
Quote:I would just buy something cheap like the RAR (with a 9 or faster twist to shoot some heavier deer bullets), chop the heck out of it, and never look back.
^^^^^^^^^^+1
Many folks make the mistake of providing hand-me-down equipment to young or new shooters when introducing them to the sport. Proper fitting equipment is very advantageous, tends to shorten the learning curve, making it much more enjoyable for the newbie and increases the likelihood of a successful outcome.
Another factor often overlooked when teaching youngsters to shoot center fire rifles is that recoil affect is much greater to a 60-70# youngster than it is to an adult of > 150#. A 7# 243 will push 70# shooter back as much or more than an 8# 300 Magnum and we all know a proper fitted stock helps mitigate recoil!
Regards,
hm
^^^^^^^^^^+1
Many folks make the mistake of providing hand-me-down equipment to young or new shooters when introducing them to the sport. Proper fitting equipment is very advantageous, tends to shorten the learning curve, making it much more enjoyable for the newbie and increases the likelihood of a successful outcome.
Another factor often overlooked when teaching youngsters to shoot center fire rifles is that recoil affect is much greater to a 60-70# youngster than it is to an adult of > 150#. A 7# 243 will push 70# shooter back as much or more than an 8# 300 Magnum and we all know a proper fitted stock helps mitigate recoil!
Regards,
hm
JTPinTX
Custom Call Maker
^^^^^^^^^
Exactly!
A 223 with decent deer bullet (Barnes, 64 Win PP, Trophy Bonded, Partition, or any number of others), will do anything a young kid needs to be doing on deer or coyotes. Something they like to shoot and are not scared of lets them focus on shooting, and shooting well. Since they like shooting it they will get good with it, and since they are good they will be deadly.
Getting them to really enjoy it, and not just tolerate it is the key. The better fit, the more comfortable you can make it for them, the more you set them up for success, will pay huge dividends.
A rifle that fits and doesn't beat them up. "Fun" targets to shoot. Distances they can hit and be successful. These make it fun and make them want to go. The rest can come later after they are hooked.
Exactly!
A 223 with decent deer bullet (Barnes, 64 Win PP, Trophy Bonded, Partition, or any number of others), will do anything a young kid needs to be doing on deer or coyotes. Something they like to shoot and are not scared of lets them focus on shooting, and shooting well. Since they like shooting it they will get good with it, and since they are good they will be deadly.
Getting them to really enjoy it, and not just tolerate it is the key. The better fit, the more comfortable you can make it for them, the more you set them up for success, will pay huge dividends.
A rifle that fits and doesn't beat them up. "Fun" targets to shoot. Distances they can hit and be successful. These make it fun and make them want to go. The rest can come later after they are hooked.
Originally Posted By: JTPinTXOriginally Posted By: Infidel 762Very nice Jeff, knew you been trying to get her one for awhile. Bet she is hooked now. My daughter turned 16 and has other priorities that take place over hunting with dad. Enjoy it they are not young forever. I watched that fox video.. swap that scope for a smaller caliber with suppressor... enuff said
Swapped the NV over to the Encore 223 last night and got a rough zero on it. Will fine tune the zero today when I get the time. Then I will start making a plan for Mr Red Fox.
My oldest son shot his first deer with a bow last night, a really nice meat doe. He used my dad's bow to take it with. He started shooting Dad's bow after Dad passed away 4 years ago. It has been a goal for him for the last 3 years.
Anyways, we drove out to work to field dress it, and a beautiful bobcat was sitting right on my 200 yard rifle range. She took a ride home in the truck with us. Wish I had the 223 in the truck for that, only thing I had was the 257 Roberts.
It has been a really good couple of weeks for us on hunting success.
Did that cat look sumthin like this?
Swapped the NV over to the Encore 223 last night and got a rough zero on it. Will fine tune the zero today when I get the time. Then I will start making a plan for Mr Red Fox.
My oldest son shot his first deer with a bow last night, a really nice meat doe. He used my dad's bow to take it with. He started shooting Dad's bow after Dad passed away 4 years ago. It has been a goal for him for the last 3 years.
Anyways, we drove out to work to field dress it, and a beautiful bobcat was sitting right on my 200 yard rifle range. She took a ride home in the truck with us. Wish I had the 223 in the truck for that, only thing I had was the 257 Roberts.
It has been a really good couple of weeks for us on hunting success.
Did that cat look sumthin like this?
