AR-15 vs bolt

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DRHIDE

New member
I know many of you have seen this before but really would like your input on this.
I have a Rem. 700 ADL .223 with 4x12x40 scope on it and I have a itchin to get a AR-15 to do my coyote,bobcat,fox hunting with. Will the AR shoot just as good as the Rem. bolt? What dist. is the killing range on the .223? Is the dist. any diff. on the AR than the Rem. bolt.
The reason for asking on the kill dist. is I have all so been thinking on going up to a 22-250 when I hunt open range but still want to save the fur. Kind of new at this AR stuff and would like any input you guy could give me. Thanks
 
I have a 700 BDL SPS Tactical and a couple of ARs...IMHO, from an accuracy standpoint, they are about equal...within limitations..

My SPS is equipped with a HS stock and is weighing in at about 11.5# with the scope (8-32x) and my ARs are a little lighter (both have bull barrels)...but the ARs are more portable for carrying any distance...

If you reload, depending on the bullet weight and style, they can be 'fur friendly' or devastating if you want to use them for Prairie Dogs...but that comes more down to the load you are using...

One AR has a 16" 1/9 barrel and I can count on accuracy out to about 250 yards, shooting heavier bullets, the other has a 20" 1/14 twist barrel for shooting the lighter bullets at higher speeds and it's good out to 400 yards.

The 700 has a 1/12 barrel and will handle the 60gr bullets pretty accurately at 300+ yards and maybe farther, but I haven't taken the time to go much past that with it..
 
A couple weeks ago a guy at work is telling me his son went calling and immediately 4 or 5 coyotes bust out..he shoots once..with his bolt gun..I said, "he went calling and took his single shot?" Just to give him a hard time because I know he has an AR as well.
I havn`t had a lot of success so far so I`m no expert..but I`ll stick with my AR for calling and take the model 70 deer hunting.
 
i think it takes alittle more work to make an ar shoot groups that most bolt guns are capable of.(just my .2cents) when i got my r-15 i was skeptical as to whether it would group very well. i have been more then impressed with my ar...... do i think it will ever shoot as good as some of my bolt actions.. no, but im definitely pleased with the performance of it.(dime size groups at 100yds)
i think if your considering bumping up from a .223 and your still wanting an ar platform id consider bumping up to a .243 in an ar.... you can still be fur friendly and it will shoot just as flat as the 22-250 if loaded right...
 
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ars are very nice for a quick follow up shot if needed and most of them will shoot with factoy rifles to boot, i think they are handier to carry around as well Ron
 
So far you guys do make some good points but I dont know if any of them are good enough to spend the cash for a AR. but I think I want one because they look fun to shoot and I am sure they will do just as good as my bolt dose. So maybe I should trade in my bolt for a AR. I do like the idea I can sent out a lot more lead at a running coyote.
Oh the TOYS!!
I want to think you guys for your input and will take more from you and anybody else. What I need to think of is can a AR do the same as my bolt on range dist. and being dead on?
 
I am going to be honest, I myself am not all that impressed with the AR! Done had the dang thing go CLICK on me once with a big o yote in the cross hairs, was trying to be quite while loading, you know the story! Ever since then I have been paranoid about the bolt not fully engaged! Reloads have been giving me problems because I didnt use the small base dies! Now I got a big batch of reloads that wont properly load half the time! Its always something with the ARs! But I will confess, they do shoot nice groups! Forgot to mention, I have more doubles under my belt with the bolt than I do with the AR!
 
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Rubenator, I understand what your saying..there has definately been a learning curve associated with my ARs but now I feel prety confident with them..but to be sure they arent for everyone. In no way is that meant to be belittleing or derogatory, just something I have seen or experienced from friends.
Since I didn`t mention earlier, like nightwatchman said if drhide is lookikng for a little more range the AR10 in
in .243Win.is an option I have the R25..to do over again I would get the DPMS chambered for it. BTW R25 loves a 58gr V-max with IMR 4064
 
OK with all this been said and I am a bit new to the AR game I was looking and could you guys tell me about the 6.8spc cal. where dose that cal. fall into on something I would know like .223 22-250 .243 sp where dose this 6.8 fall in those cal. Are the 6.8 easy and cheap to buy. Are they fur friendly as maybe on a bobcat or fox. If is a good round then I may keep my Rem. bolt and pass that on to my son and I would get me a AR-15 that is cal. for a 6.8. I am just afraid that the .243 would blow a hole in a coyote more times than not and always in a fox or bobcat. Right now my avg. shot has been 100 to 150 yards. Thanks guys for your input
 
Originally Posted By: kunasars are very nice for a quick follow up shot if needed and most of them will shoot with factoy rifles to boot, i think they are handier to carry around as well Ron

yes. some just don't know how the platform works. It'll smoke a bolt gun!
 
This is what sold me on the AR platform for predator hunting.
About five years ago I was shooting a Remington 700 BDL in the 17 Rem. I love the 17. It is a hammer for hunting Red fox and does a really good job on coyotes if your able to place the shot where it belongs.
Anyway, one day a friend of mine and I were out calling and we had five hard charging coyotes hit our stand. We had the old standing rule. You shoot left, I'll shoot right. I took the first coyote at around 70 yards. He was the last of the bunch. By the time I had the bolt cycled and was on target for my second, my buddy rolled the coyote that I was about to shoot. I saw the bullet hit and exit that coyote as I was about to squeeze my trigger. At first I was dumb struck at seeing that coyote fold. I actually thought that I had shot it, but just didn't realize that my rifle had fired. By the way, this is easy to think when your shooting the 17. As I soon realized that I did not shoot. I sat there trying to understand exactly what had just happened. My buddy ask why I wasn't shooting. You can probably tell where this story is headed.
When I broke my check weld to cycle my bolt. My bud had shot three of those five coyotes, and was just finishing the last one, #4, when I was about to shot. To this day I swear that I only heard two shots. Mine and his. Yet all five coyotes were DRT and I only shot one. He was shooting, and still shoots, a RRA coyote in their 16" barrel. Now granted, these coyotes were all taken within 100 yards. But there is no way I would have managed more than a double with my 17. That is just me. I have seen a few fellows that can cycle a bolt like a house on fire. I can't do it with my bolt rifles, but I sure can with my AR's.
 
it would take a handy fella with a bolt gun to beat a handy fella with an AR.

Both being equall the hand goes to the AR, SIMPLY not loosing eye of sight!
 
If you have a properly sorted out AR-15, both ammo and functionally, it can be [beeep] on wheels for multiple targets. This is particularly true in P-Dog towns where I can sometimes shoot 5 before my partner gets 2 dogs with his bolt rifle. I shot over 1200 P-dogs last year, without a single hangup in my RRA, using ammo that was neck sized only with a bushing bump die. In the vast majority of cases, correctly FL sized ammo should work flawlessly if you have no other contributing problems. ARs are not as forgiving with ammo as a bolt rifle, and some reloaders are not paying attention to the finer details.
 
Originally Posted By: DRHIDEWhat I need to think of is can a AR do the same as my bolt on range dist. and being dead on?

Short answer...yes...depending how good you are with your bolt gun. Here is a guy shooting an 11"x17" target at 860 yds. While this result may not be typical, it is very do-able with practice and reloads/match grade hunting ammo.


Originally Posted By: DRHIDEOK with all this been said and I am a bit new to the AR game I was looking and could you guys tell me about the 6.8spc cal. where dose that cal. fall into on something I would know like .223 22-250 .243 sp where dose this 6.8 fall in those cal. Are the 6.8 easy and cheap to buy. Are they fur friendly as maybe on a bobcat or fox. If is a good round then I may keep my Rem. bolt and pass that on to my son and I would get me a AR-15 that is cal. for a 6.8. I am just afraid that the .243 would blow a hole in a coyote more times than not and always in a fox or bobcat. Right now my avg. shot has been 100 to 150 yards. Thanks guys for your input

6.8spc is a HUGE hunk of lead comparatively speaking. If you consider the .223 is essentially 5.56mm, .243 is a 6mm, and the 6.8spc is obviously 6.8mm. If you are worried about pelt damage, you can always switch to full metal jackets or solid Berger bullets. 6.8 wont be as easy or cheap to buy now that Knights Armament wont be making it for the military, but regardless, for a predator/varmint gun, you'd be better off with the 6.5 Grendel if you want a bigger cal AR15.

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there is a better possibility of building a more accurate bolt gun (sub .5moa, sub.25moa but really...why), however, with AR's capable of shooting sub .5moa with quality ammo and components these days its still a toss up and personal preference.
The reduced recoil of an AR keeps your eye on target shot after shot. the semi auto and HUGE mag capacity (5-150rounds) make the AR very hard to beat. the ability to have dedicated uppers for your AR is golden as well. if you want the 6.5 Grendel, .223, .204, Mach17, and even a .223/.243/.25WSSM they would all be achieved with a simple upper swap. meaning one gun (the lower) and MULTIPLE set ups with a dedicated upper.
 
oh, and I shoot a .243WSSM AR15 with 75gr Vmax at 3200fps...and rarely have catastrophic pelt damage, although it does happen. you can keep pelt damage to a minimum just by switching bullets.
 
I've got a couple of 16 inch rifles in 5.56 and one in 6.8 SPC. I've been pretty impressed with the 6.8 so far, seems accurate but as was said the ammo is a little higher priced. I'll know more after I use it awhile.
 
Dr hide,
Bolts are typically more accurate then AR's. Certainly some folks make shooter AR but youll pay for that performance and remember your shooting at varmits not a hunt of a life time animal.

With that said I use to use a 40x 22-250 single shot for critters and have killed chucks beyond 850 but basically it's a bench gun. Sure it's accurate but a pain to hunt with. Only problem is I only killed one pair in 10 years with it. Gun is to heavy and slow for a second shot. Becides a weapon is only good as the person behind It!

This year I purchased a R-15 in .204 and love it! Already have killed two pairs and a triple. I could never have done that with my bolt. Granted it's not as accurate or as long as my bolt but a hellava lot more fun! The only thing is I'm pretty much limited to 450 with the .204. At 500 it really starts to get whippy where the 22-250 is still very stable. I do not own a semi .223 but do have a bolt one and mine is stable to 400 all with factory amo.

Only benifit in .223 is the wide varity of amo available. Ballistically the .204 is better and IMO a perfect varmit calliber. If my range to target was beyound 500 I wouldn't use either of them anyways, and remember it's only a coyote!
 
Just my two cents but my comfort level is a lot higher with a bolt gun, no matter what I'm hunting. Don't get me wrong I love the AR and it's a shooter but what I think makes me feel better using a bolt gun is the fact that I DON'T have a really quick follow up shot. That I think makes me pick and choose my shots so I know that it will be an instant kill. I absolutly hate wounding an animal. Call me strange but thats how I think.
 
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