A Question for Atheists

And I would like to say my last peace on this topic, as I have watched it go on now for over a week with the insults, flaming, trolling, whatever you choose to label it.

I know some of you find humor in this, gigging each other, or just arguing over who’s belief, religion is right or wrong, but at the end of the day, the ones of you that keep going back and forth with each other, is not going to change no ones mind on how they believe, simple as that.

I know for some of you from reading your post, you have to have the last word, and it’s not going to get you any further on this topic but cause more rebuttal and go on and on.

I would like to see this topic dropped and squashed, and we all move on, and talk about things productive like coyote hunting, callers, guns, or whatever it needs to be

And I also know, that talking about callers, guns, will also bring difference in oppion, but not to this degree as these last few days have been on religion

I would still go hunting with all of you guys regardless of what I read or how you feel, I’m not going to judge you for that

But on a closing note, I don’t think a lot of you would hunt with me cause I use a wildlife technology caller, and still think there the best caller on the market, but again, that’s my opinion, so now I’m sure I just opened up a new can of worms by saying that, and that’s good, hopefully we can get off this religion topic for now

Safe hunting this year
 
Originally Posted By: fw707Originally Posted By: MerditYes, I appreciate MCary's answer, also.

Let it rip. Open forum.

Great!
First question....
and none will be "smart aleck".

Originally Posted By: MerditWhy would an atheist try to convince someone else that God doesn't exist?


Your first post seems like you start from a position that atheists try to convince others to denounce their faith.

I'm pretty much the only A/A anywhere near where I live, and I only "know" a very few online because I don't need to go looking for any support.

I have never seen even one A/A make any attempt to "convert" a believer away from their beliefs system.

Have you seen otherwise?

*

What I have seen personally occurred almost entirely in highschool and college. Mostly two to a few young people going back and forth. Doubt any of either side really cared to convert the other, preferring, rather, to win the argument, and thus look more intelligent. Speculation on my part.

My professor was a different story. He was a very intelligent and intentional adult. He knew what he was doing. My problem is that I don't know why he was doing it. Could have been a lonely old man who just needed interaction. Maybe he just liked to see the gears grind in intelligent college kids. Possibly he truly wanted to dissolve someone's belief in God or by questioning, even strengthen their faith. However, I am speculating. Rather than speculate, I asked the original question.

I wish now I could recall exact quotes or points that he made. One thing I do remember was the heart of his reply when asked about the crucifix on the wall behind him. He said he didn't believe in Jesus or God. The crucifix was there to remind him of what could happen to someone....(and then I don't remember the last bit). Kicking myself, now, for not caring at the time. Anyway, can't say exactly what his beliefs, or lack thereof, were.
 
Originally Posted By: IAyoteHNTR
The lively discussions I talked about earlier usually get started by someone asking me why I don't believe in any gods or Jesus and when I tell them why I don't, their arguments of why I should believe usually get thrashed by facts about history, science, etc. and they don't seem to like it much. Ignorance is bliss as they say.
wink.gif



Do these ignorant people you set straight with facts about history, science and etc. belong to one particular denomination? 95% of the arguing I hear from atheists is based on finding faults within quotes of scripture. I read every post in these threads and the ones I remember are when a member opens up about hitting bottom somewhere in life, finding and then being restored by God. Telling someone who has had a spiritual awakening from a hopeless state of mind and body, that their faith is stupid, is stupid. When I hear talk that there is no evidence, I get a relaxing feeling because I know that unless you have been there, you could never understand. Not to mention God does not need me to stand up for him. So why would I try to force that belief onto someone else? The faith of another has never done me much good and as for indoctrination, I rebelled against that crap.

MCary, I would like to hear what has drawn you to disbelieve. As long as it is not something you read in scripture you don't believe.
 
You’re not drawn to disbelief. Everyone is born an atheist. You are drawn to belief. And what god you believe in is mostly due to geography. If you were born in the Middle East you would most likely be a Muslim.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: MCaryYou’re not drawn to disbelief. Everyone is born an atheist. You are drawn to belief. And what god you believe in is mostly due to geography. If you were born in the Middle East you would most likely be a Muslim.

We are not born atheist. At birth we do not have the mental power to even conceive the concept of God. We are born oblivious and take baby steps to self awareness before we could even contemplate our existence in the grand scheme of things.
 
Originally Posted By: MerditOriginally Posted By: fw707Originally Posted By: MerditYes, I appreciate MCary's answer, also.

Let it rip. Open forum.

Great!
First question....
and none will be "smart aleck".

Originally Posted By: MerditWhy would an atheist try to convince someone else that God doesn't exist?


Your first post seems like you start from a position that atheists try to convince others to denounce their faith.

I'm pretty much the only A/A anywhere near where I live, and I only "know" a very few online because I don't need to go looking for any support.

I have never seen even one A/A make any attempt to "convert" a believer away from their beliefs system.

Have you seen otherwise?

*

What I have seen personally occurred almost entirely in highschool and college. Mostly two to a few young people going back and forth. Doubt any of either side really cared to convert the other, preferring, rather, to win the argument, and thus look more intelligent. Speculation on my part.

My professor was a different story. He was a very intelligent and intentional adult. He knew what he was doing. My problem is that I don't know why he was doing it. Could have been a lonely old man who just needed interaction. Maybe he just liked to see the gears grind in intelligent college kids. Possibly he truly wanted to dissolve someone's belief in God or by questioning, even strengthen their faith. However, I am speculating. Rather than speculate, I asked the original question.

I wish now I could recall exact quotes or points that he made. One thing I do remember was the heart of his reply when asked about the crucifix on the wall behind him. He said he didn't believe in Jesus or God. The crucifix was there to remind him of what could happen to someone....(and then I don't remember the last bit). Kicking myself, now, for not caring at the time. Anyway, can't say exactly what his beliefs, or lack thereof, were.

Sounds like your professor was an unusual situation. I’ve never seen anything like that.

Most of my experiences have been more like MCary’s...

Originally Posted By: MCaryIAyoteHunter, in many cases a religious person once they learn you do not believe see an opportunity to bring you into the fold. The are very kind, engaging and act as if they truly want to have an enlightened conversation. Once they realize that is simply not going to happen and that your arguments from evidence and reason cannot be successfully argued with faith and scripture their demeanor changes. The kindness and pretend curiosity is replaced by frustration and anger.


Then after the frustration and anger stage things go down the tubes really fast!

Believers make assertions, and then attempt to use scripture to support the assertions.
Then the scripture falls short of the standard expected by the A/A, and the only thing left is a few pages of insults and beat downs.

Some of the assertions are easily ignored or accepted. But claims of “THE ONE” exclusive faith that guarantees them paradise and sends everybody else to eternal punishment, and their claims to the exclusive ownership of morals they received from a god are not usually accepted as facts.



*
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: fw707
Believers make assertions, and then attempt to use scripture to support the assertions. Then the scripture falls short of the standard expected by the A/A, and the only thing left is a few pages of insults and beat downs.

The same thing can be said about you "boisterous" atheists. I say "boisterous" for I do not want to lump all non-believers into one group like you do with believers. You can post line after line of red highlighted, scripture quotes for reason of disproving organized religion. And with the volume and size of the Bible, you can copy and paste it all day long for years, but religion is not God. And as such I could never see how discrepancies in scripture that as written by the hand of man, erases the existence of God. Some of your get into a repetitious circle jerk that just goes on and on..
 
Atheism is not a religion, it is merely the abscence of a belief in a deity, so by that definition we are born atheist. Belief in a religion is instilled not naturally occurring. Like I said earlier, belief is an action. You actively believe. You can’t ask an atheist why he does not believe because he isn’t doing anything. There is no why? Without the question why, no consideration of the premise would even be given. It is only after the question is posed by a religion that answers are sought. These answers are more justifications than reasons. These justifications can be very disturbing to the faithful. Most faithful people believe that their time on this earth is a test. The more enlightened think that wrestling with doubt is one of these tests. Unfortunately some don’t and can be very offended. So, for that reason I avoid listing the justifications and just say the reason I don’t believe is because I never have.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Infidel 762Originally Posted By: fw707
Believers make assertions, and then attempt to use scripture to support the assertions. Then the scripture falls short of the standard expected by the A/A, and the only thing left is a few pages of insults and beat downs.

The same thing can be said about you "boisterous" atheists. I say "boisterous" for I do not want to lump all non-believers into one group like you do with believers. You can post line after line of red highlighted, scripture quotes for reason of disproving organized religion. And with the volume and size of the Bible, you can copy and paste it all day long for years, but religion is not God. And as such I could never see how discrepancies in scripture that as written by the hand of man, erases the existence of God. Some of your get into a repetitious circle jerk that just goes on and on..

Jeremy, we may not agree on everything, but we do agree on some of the important things...

there ARE discrepancies in scripture, and the bible was NOT written by a god.

*
 
I’ve realized today at work all of the time I’ve wasted, debating something that will make no difference whatsoever! Like is mentioned in Ecclesiastics, “It’s all meaningless”.

Screw this stuff, I’m going hunting!

I’ll check back every so often just to get a laugh, after seeing ya all are right where you started and got nowhere.


Hahaha!

Peace!
 
That may stem from evangelical religions that believe the Bible is the inerrant word of god. That every bit of it happened exactly as written and is to be taken literally.
 
Not that I want to change my name to Dick, but those that find futility or frustration in this topic and even think it should have been quashed as one poster stated, I must ask a question, if it is so upsetting, why come all the way down here to the cellar, click on the thread and then read 7 pages of posts? There’s a really great thread on thermal scopes up above.
 
Originally Posted By: MCary I must ask a question, if it is so upsetting, why come all the way down here to the cellar, click on the thread and then read 7 pages of posts?

like a bad wreck on the interstate. at the risk of not liking what you see, still got to look.
w00t.gif
 
Originally Posted By: MCaryAtheism is not a religion, it is merely the abscence of a belief in a deity, so by that definition we are born atheist. Belief in a religion is instilled not naturally occurring. Like I said earlier, belief is an action. You actively believe. You can’t ask an atheist why he does not believe because he isn’t doing anything. There is no why? Without the question why, no consideration of the premise would even be given. It is only after the question is posed by a religion that answers are sought. These answers are more justifications than reasons. These justifications can be very disturbing to the faithful. Most faithful people believe that their time on this earth is a test. The more enlightened think that wrestling with doubt is one of these tests. Unfortunately some don’t and can be very offended. So, for that reason I avoid listing the justifications and just say the reason I don’t believe is because I never have.

Then by that definition my dog is an atheist and I love that little bastard...he seems pretty content with his place in life and I have never known him to try and make me feel stupid for my beliefs...

He is also much smarter than me...
 
I read the biggest part of this thread......8 pages worth. And like a few have said, it is fruitless. One thinks this way and one thinks that way and 8 pages later, nothing is solved and never will be. Thats why I don't argue religion and politics. Its my business and mine alone. I've said it before and I'll say it again, religion and politics should be banned from this forum. It does nothing but cause hard feelings between people that used to be friends. This is a hunting forum. If you feel the need to argue religion and politics, go to Facebook. There are plenty of people there to argue with.
 
Originally Posted By: pyscodogI read the biggest part of this thread......8 pages worth. And like a few have said, it is fruitless. One thinks this way and one thinks that way and 8 pages later, nothing is solved and never will be. Thats why I don't argue religion and politics. Its my business and mine alone. I've said it before and I'll say it again, religion and politics should be banned from this forum. It does nothing but cause hard feelings between people that used to be friends. This is a hunting forum. If you feel the need to argue religion and politics, go to Facebook. There are plenty of people there to argue with.


No one is making you read this thread. Just saying...



 
Originally Posted By: pyscodogI read the biggest part of this thread......8 pages worth. And like a few have said, it is fruitless. One thinks this way and one thinks that way and 8 pages later, nothing is solved and never will be. Thats why I don't argue religion and politics. Its my business and mine alone. I've said it before and I'll say it again, religion and politics should be banned from this forum. It does nothing but cause hard feelings between people that used to be friends. This is a hunting forum. If you feel the need to argue religion and politics, go to Facebook. There are plenty of people there to argue with.


If you click on “edit preferences” under “My Stuff”, you can change the posts per page to 20 and the thread will only be 4 pages.....
Kinda like the folks that have their pizzas cut into 6 slices because they can’t eat 8.

grin.gif


*
 
Originally Posted By: Infidel 762Originally Posted By: MCaryAtheism is not a religion, it is merely the abscence of a belief in a deity, so by that definition we are born atheist. Belief in a religion is instilled not naturally occurring. Like I said earlier, belief is an action. You actively believe. You can’t ask an atheist why he does not believe because he isn’t doing anything. There is no why? Without the question why, no consideration of the premise would even be given. It is only after the question is posed by a religion that answers are sought. These answers are more justifications than reasons. These justifications can be very disturbing to the faithful. Most faithful people believe that their time on this earth is a test. The more enlightened think that wrestling with doubt is one of these tests. Unfortunately some don’t and can be very offended. So, for that reason I avoid listing the justifications and just say the reason I don’t believe is because I never have.

Then by that definition my dog is an atheist and I love that little bastard...he seems pretty content with his place in life and I have never known him to try and make me feel stupid for my beliefs...

He is also much smarter than me...

Jeremy, our dogs will always make us feel good about our beliefs because they depend on us to make their living.
They are a lot like members of the clergy.

*
 
Back
Top