60gr V-Max performance on coyotes in the .223 Rem only [Oh no, not AGAIN!]

Hellgate

Hellgate

Member
I've been reading a lot of discussions past and present on Hornaday's V-max bullet. Most complaints are about it "splashing" (blowing up on the surface with minimal penetration). What is confusing to me is the opinions often do not state what grain of bullet fails or in which cartridge it is used. I get it that a high speed lightly constructed 40 grainer from a Swift or .22-250 may well splash but I haven't seen a lot said specifically of the 60 gr V-max in the .223. I'd like to hear from those who actually have used them in the .223 and how did/do they work to anchor the coyotes. I'd like to know why you abandoned the 60gr V-max and what bullet you went to & why.

I suspect the slower speed of the heavier bullet from a .223 will punch deeper but still open up enough to do the job on the insides. I am not concerned whether it is fur friendly. I know there is no true "magic bullet". I am suspicious there is a significant difference in performance between the 60 grainer and the 55 and below V-maxs.
How do they do with less than ideal presentations like running away shots?

I've only killed 3 coyotes with it so far. Two were DRT a 3rd was hit at 300yds and crawled into a ravine full of tumbleweeds & brush where I could not find it.
 
I load my 60 Vmax with Benchmark and the first dog with this combo was a 70 yd broad side shot. Turned the vitals into a sloppy mess and exited with about a 1" hole. He weighed about 35 lbs, heavy coat in great shape. I had to crawl under a 4 wire fence in a foot of snow to get to him. He had tried to run but only made it 10 ft or so, snow plowing with his head. The shot from a suppressed RARR.
 
I haven't seen anything from him in a while, but Byron South loved that 60 grain Vmax in a 223. My buddy shot them last year and had LOTS of runners and some that were never recovered. He switched to the 22 Nosler with 50 grain NBT hand loads and has been anchoring them since. For coyotes, I like a 50 grain Nbt moving somewhere between 3500 and 3600 fps.
 
60grain vmax is all I shoot in 223. I don’t reload 223, I purchased a few thousand rounds from Freedom Munitions and they have been great. Later I bought a couple thousand rounds more and they didn’t quite match the first lot I bought. They were a couple hundred FPS slower. Grouped 3”lower at 300 yards. I was disappointed so I called the company Got in touch with their quality control person there.
She told me to send them back (they paid the freight) and she called me about three months later and said the lot they were currently producing would match my first purchase exactly. She sent me the replacement rounds, “ prefect match” I purchased about 8000 more rounds. I don’t imagine I’ll ever have to buy any again. I shoot coyotes, prairie dogs, rabbits and plink as well I’m so used to how they shoot it is easier to hit targets at any distance within reason for a 223. Same bullet for everything.

I’ve had a few spinners but all the good hits go down. Never had one splash that I know of. But maybe some of the spinners had a splash?
Don’t know if this helps but there are allot of comments about the 60 grain vmax.
 
I have every weight vmax spash the 60 are not as bad the 40s are really bad to splash with a shoulder hit I shot Winchester varmint x now splash now exit a few spinersbut they don't go far most are DRT if it isn't fur friendly I won't shot it plus my gun likes it since I send no splashes better check and see if I have the stuff to sow one up tomorrow
 
Originally Posted By: DiRTY DOGSome people have lots of splashes. Some have none or very few. I don't get it. Must be shot placement or lack of.

Must be something to it for the perennial discussion regarding those bullets.

I quickly acquired a poor taste for them in one winter on big MN coyotes shot on the run. Standing broadside right behind the shoulder, all bullets will turn in a blue-ribbon performance.

We never seem to discuss the performance of say...52 gr. BTHP .22s. Maybe cuz they never splash?
 
I may reconsider using them because a fair number of my shots are running away. Scouting for deer we often jump them on rangeland while driving and they have the afterburners on. I may go to the Hornady 60gr SP, 60gr B-Tip, or 53gr SMK (which is very accurate in my rifles).
 
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I just reloaded some up for my 223 IMP using IMR 8208 and shot a few groups today. I have only shot a couple dozen with the 60's and had good luck. Even shot a bobcat with them and didn't have any fur damage which surprised me. I just picked up a bunch of them for a good price so I thought I would give them a try again.

I usually use Sierras 55 SBT's in my 22-250 and 223's. That is my favorite bullet. But I also want to try the Sierra TMK 69 gr'rs.
 
I'm guessing the reports of poor performance has more to do with the increased popularity of shorter barreled ARs (lower velocity) and fast twist 1:7 barrels combined with semi-auto over-confidence (less emphasis on marksmanship).

But it could be a change in bullet construction is to blame... Seems that would be easy to prove by cutting a few old/new Vmaxs open and doing some science. Compare jacket thickness, hollow cavity, lead, expansion and penetration in gel, etc. But nobody has done that. Just repeated internet claims that the Vmax has changed somehow for the worse.
 
I suspect that a part of it is that everyone thinks their bullets need to be loaded to max and have to go as fast as possible. If the velocities people claim are true, I am running mine a little slower. The ONLY splash I ever had was a nosler tipped bullet out of a 243.
 
Interesting for discussion for me, but since I'm relative new to this forum, what is a "splash"? I think I know, but want to be sure. Thanks.
 
Redhaze,
A term for the bullets terminal ballistics. The projectile fails to penetrate adequately to reach the vital organs, instead fragmenting closer to the skin, leaving an ugly surface wound, which results in your intended quarry running off to die a lot farther away than you would like. Simply a nasty hole and the coyote runs off to bleed out in another zip code.
 
I discovered what I would have to call the closest to a magic bullet years ago. Its the speer 52 GR.# 1035 Hollow point.Has a huge hole in the hollow point and is not only very accurate, Its down right bad news on a coyote. I am running mine at 3050 and am zeroed for MPBR.With this load its is sometimes hard to find a entry, And hardly ever a exit wound if found.I have to agree with several posters,Slow them down and you will get better performance.Do a search and you will find a lot of good info on this bullet.
 
Originally Posted By: DiRTY DOGI'm guessing the reports of poor performance has more to do with the increased popularity of shorter barreled ARs (lower velocity) and fast twist 1:7 barrels combined with semi-auto over-confidence (less emphasis on marksmanship).

But it could be a change in bullet construction is to blame... Seems that would be easy to prove by cutting a few old/new Vmaxs open and doing some science. Compare jacket thickness, hollow cavity, lead, expansion and penetration in gel, etc. But nobody has done that. Just repeated internet claims that the Vmax has changed somehow for the worse.

I agree. We noted a difference in the weights of the vmax from bullet to bullet, whereas the sp's and bullets from other manufacturers such as Nosler and Berger did not have the same bullet to bullet variance. It would be interesting to see if there is a difference from old to new. I may have to poke around and see if I can find some of the ones that I used to run.

We did have some good results with the 60gr Hornady HP's this weekend on coyotes. Good knock down, but it left a pretty good size hole coming out.

If anyone wants to see the pics, drop me a PM.
 
Never had a splash yet. I believe the posters that had splashes probably ran them at too fast of a velocity...probably using a 22-250 or swift loaded to the Gil's. I run them in my 1/9 twist LTR at 2975 fps and you normally can't see the in or or out holes when they end up exiting once in a great while. I also run them at 2850 fps in my POF P415 with a 1/8 twist. The will put a bullet sized hole in and a quarter to fifty cent sized exit hole. I believe the bigger exit hole is due to the faster twist. I remember years ago when yellow hammer was hot to trot using this bullet he said the KEY to this bullet to be fur friendly was to run them at 2950 fps Muzzel velocity. So maybe my POF load was slowing down enough to stay together giving it better penatration and exiting vs my LTR load that's a hair faster so i would assume the faster velocity helps shatter the bullet completely staying inside the animal with no exit? Either way both loads slams yotes to the ground like the hammer of Thor.
 
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I've had one splash with 50 grain V-Max. Coyote was 10 yards away quartering toward me and hit it right on the shoulder bone, spun around a few times dropped. Had a baseball size hole where the bullet blew up.
 
50gr vmax were designed to do exactly that and hitting the shoulder made it even worse. he 60's are designed to stay together and expand once inside the animal. Bet you were probably about 3350 fps or so or faster as well causing it to explode on impact. I bet if you slowed the 50 down to 2700fps you would have gotten a completely different result. I don't, but a lot of the posters here use the 60's for deer and hog because they stay together. But once again the key is running them slower because at faster speeds they will blow up just like any other bullet.

My POF bullets are new stock that I bought a few years ago. The LTR bullets were from around early 00's so if they did change construction that would explain the exits as well. Still, you can't see the entry holes with the newer bullets I bought.
 
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