222 or 221 Fireball

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"... the fireball dont come close in accuracy, sorry guys..."



If you are comparing a Benchrest 222's to the "over counter" .221 FireBall, OK - but that applies to any two caliber comparisons.

But if you are talking about the two calibers in EQUAL rifles...

... sorry Guy, but you are dead wrong!

You will find no perceivable difference.

I bought one of the Remington Classics in 221 when they came out, and the barrel was junk.

So I rebarreled it with a heavier select match grade barrel, and it'll shoot with any 222 in any configuration...


"...all day long - if I do my part" /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif .


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Funny thing, my 222 Rem 700 BDL's favorite load is a 50 grain SPSX going about 2800 fps. My 221 Fireball Contender Carbine likes the same bullet going about 2900. Both rifles are amazingly accurate..3" or better at 100. I would get which ever rifle I found and liked best. If I found a rifle I liked that was available in one caliber but not the other I would just get it. Heck you will probably end up with both anyway.
 
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Bluestem,

The CZ .221 Fireball is a rifle scaled-down to the size of the cartridge.

Hold one and work the single-set trigger and you will be a quick convert to the mini-mauser CZ.

Good Hunting,

Karl in Phoenix



I own a couple of CZ rifles and they are good performers. However, I bet Peter Paul Mauser rolls in his grave every time he sees a CZ - with a removable bolt handle and a removable external metal magazine - being called a "min-Mauser".

Two of his patents were on a one piece bolt and an internal staggered box magazine which he finally perfected in his later designs.

Looking kinda' like a Mauser doesn't make it a Mauser by any stretch of the imagination.

-BCB
 
Well I dont see to many BR records set with the fireball, and it wasn't a mainstream BR cartridge for 20 years either. So that tells you something, maybe it doesn't. Sorry I disagree...
 
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Well I dont see to many BR records set with the fireball, and it wasn't a mainstream BR cartridge for 20 years either. So that tells you something, maybe it doesn't. Sorry I disagree...



You are certainly free to disagree... but your statement is meaningless, and your foundation is specious.

The 222 was in benchrest and then pushed aside before the 221 came along.

By then, ALL of the 222/223/222 Mag family had been displaced.

The fact the the 222 was a great BR cartridge does not prove that it is better than the 221, the 223, or the 222 Mag.

And we are not speaking of benchrest rifles... we are speaking of field rifles, and you will not see ANY difference in any of the 0.380" based cartridges.

He wants another CALLING RIFLE.. Duh! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif


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Right you are, Catshooter!

No doubt the .222 a fine round indeed. And for sure it was quite the BR round in its day. BUT, its day is long gone. True, it has set bench rest records, but when was the last time a record was set with it? 40 years ago? The 22 PPC and 22 BR have opened up a huge can off whupass on the .222 for over 30 years now. The 221 was only a XP-100 handgun round back when the .222 was last being used for benchrest work. Had the .221 hit the market as a rifle round before the .222 did, I dare say that it would have been the .221 making records at the 100 yard range.

The King is dead. Long live the king!
 
I think that the .221 Fireball works well as a "Calling Rifle" for those of us who like to bring the critters in close (less than 200 yards) and use bullets that are sturdy enough to kill the critters quickly.

Whether the rifle/pistol is an AR-type platform or a bolt action or single shot matters not, the little cartridge will perform disproportionately well for it's diminutive size, if well placed shots are issued. Nice too, that the cartridge is relativel quiet in a 22 inch barrel.

My opinion.

Karl in Phoenix
 
Accuracy in a calling rifle? 221/222/223, machs nix!

In bolt action rifles I like the 221FB because in a Cooper I can go to the very short M38 action...an absolute sweetheart. Plus I like the fact that it burns less powder. Once and a while brass can be hard to come by but I snagged 2000 pcs. from Midway a while back so I'm good for now.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif
 
The Remington web site shows that their 50 Gr Accru Tip bullet has a 2,990 ft/sec MV from the Fireball and 3,140 ft/sec from the 222 Rem. When sited in at 150 Yds the bullet at 250 Yds is 6.1 " low when fired from a 221 Fireball and 5.4 " low when fired from the 222 Rem. I had a 222 rifle years ago but sold it, bad deal for me. I now load a 40 Gr bullet in my 221 Fireball for prairie dog shooting. Its a nice rifle , but I should have kept the 222.
 
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I have two .221FB CZ rifles and both are super duper shooting rifles.

The Fireball burns little powder and is relatively quiet and extremely accurate.

Get the Fireball. New factory ammo is easy to get at Sportsman's Warehouse (I buy a few boxes every time I go there).

My CZ rifles shoot Rem factory ammo sub-half MOA.

They kill coyotes very well for all my shots, so far (all taken at less than 140 yards).

Good hunting,

Karl in Phoenix



Are those CZ Americans? With sporter barrels?
 
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I have two .221FB CZ rifles and both are super duper shooting rifles.

The Fireball burns little powder and is relatively quiet and extremely accurate.

Get the Fireball. New factory ammo is easy to get at Sportsman's Warehouse (I buy a few boxes every time I go there).

My CZ rifles shoot Rem factory ammo sub-half MOA.

They kill coyotes very well for all my shots, so far (all taken at less than 140 yards).

Good hunting,

Karl in Phoenix



Are those CZ Americans? With sporter barrels?



Mine is. And a fine handy to tote gun that it is too. So handy in fact, that if I never needed to take a shot past 250-275 yards or so on targets up to the size of prairie dogs, that little CZ Furball would be all the gun I would ever need.
 
rfurman24:
Yes, my two .221 Fireballs are factory sporter models with wood stocks (CZ Americans, both). These are my favorite rifles: light weight, accurate, low report, enough "power" for the task intended.

If you buy one, you will like it.

Karl in Phoenix

PS: Each rifle comes with a factory test target, check it out before you buy your rifle. Good shooting.
 
Light weight and accurate sounds awesome. I have two varmint Savages that shoot under .5moa but it would be very nice to have a sporter that would do the same. Thanks for the tip about seeing the target before buying.
 
If you are interested in either the .222 or the .221, I have both listed in the classifieds.

A CZ .221 w/ all reloading equipment, brass, etc.

CZ 527 .221

and a Savage 340B, same deal, plus scope this weekend.

Savage 340B

I think both are a pretty good deal.

Let me know what you think.

RB
 
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If you are interested in either the .222 or the .221, I have both listed in the classifieds.

A CZ .221 w/ all reloading equipment, brass, etc.

CZ 527 .221

and a Savage 340B, same deal, plus scope this weekend.

Savage 340B

I think both are a pretty good deal.

Let me know what you think.

RB



The 221 is tempting but I am not ready to commit to my next purchase. I am still recovering from my 243 and scope.
 
In agreement with Kayo2. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif

Not one thing wrong with any of them but the fireball is NOT better than the 222 in any way.

Velocity wise the 223 and 222mag run about 150 fps faster than the 222 and the 222 that much faster than the 221 fireball.

IF you use the SAME BULLET. MOST hunters cant tell 150 fps in the real world

This link should show you the three and the velocity and drop at various ranges. If you look at the "Long Range Trajectory" youll see the 222 and 221 FB are exactly and INCH different in drop at 300 yards. (all using same bullet)

http://www.remington.com/products/ammuni...A221FB*PRA223RB

Should the 222 be a bit MORE than you need, load it down. There are loads WAY down there to close range squirrel loads online.

Sure, the fireball is a winner. Will it do more than the 222 which held world records on bench shooting for decades? No.

Buy which you like and the best deal on a rifle. ME? Ill stick to my 1950 Rem 722 with 26 inch barrel that gives me even MORE velocity than factory shows......if I want it. Or ...go to my 722 in 222mag in rare BDL, but funny thing??

To tell the truth, the longer barrel of the 222 gives me within a hair's breath the same velocity the 222mag does both using 50 grain bullets. 40 grainers are real zzzzzipping along in either.

I just shoot the heavier 53 gr HP or 55 grainers in the 222mag for something different but to be honest, I cant really tell!

BUY THE RIFLE you want. Few can tell squat difference out varmint hunting in either the 222 or Fireball.

BTW, to the gentleman getting 2800 fps out of his 222 BDL?
WANNA SELL IT? lol

I just traded mine for the 722 BDL in 222mag.....grrr. Was a tough choice but 222mags in 722 BDL are a BIT tough to come upon in nice shape.

Good post, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif lots of great replys. Hoping I didnt tread on anyones toes. All is just IMO all and would never DISagree but will post whom I agree with.

Steve
 
You really can't go wrong with either choice.They're both that good.I have had more fun with the Fireball that I put tougher with the Adams & Bennett barrel than I have with any of the other ones I own. My son has a Rem. 799 in the 222 that had to make a couple of trips back to Remington to get it to shoot those small 1/2" groups. but it was worth it. The small cases of the fireball makes for a lot of shots from a pound of powder. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Which ever one you choose get it in a CZ, they are well made rifles. Good luck, Jack
 
That it in a nutshell. I think that little 221 Furball just the most fun little thing to shoot that I got. A lot more quiet than a .222 and with the right gun just as accurate. I know that there has never been a ground squirrel or a prairie dog that I missed with my Furball that I would have killed with a 222.

Like I said before, had the 221 came before the 222 I have no doubt that the record books would have turned the other way. And think about it this way: If the 222 was so good, how come hardly anyone even chambers rifles for it anymore?

The 222 was a fine round in its day. But its day was back when Sea Hunt, the Untouchables, and Car 54 Where Are You were all on TV. Been a while.
 
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