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#3309113 - 12/22/22 01:13 AM Question for the pros
Shooter222 Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 01/06/20
Posts: 250
Loc: Michigan
I have been watching minor and major feed times a lot this year since adding 6 cell game cameras to my hunting program. I have kept notes since October this year when bow started for deer season. From what I’ve noticed so far- Minor feeding periods have the bigger bucks moving. I’m gonna pay closer attention this coyote season to pressure and feeding periods. See if I can come up with a pattern of some sort.

Which brings up a few questions… does pressure mean alot while hunting coyotes?
Does it affect when they respond to vocals? Does rising or dropping pressure make them move more ? Or steady?

Just trying to learn as much as possible about the game we hunt.

Thanks in advance

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#3309240 - 12/23/22 05:51 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
1oldcoyote Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 03/18/22
Posts: 123
Loc: Central plains
Originally Posted By: Shooter222
I have been watching minor and major feed times a lot this year since adding 6 cell game cameras to my hunting program. I have kept notes since October this year when bow started for deer season. From what I’ve noticed so far- Minor feeding periods have the bigger bucks moving. I’m gonna pay closer attention this coyote season to pressure and feeding periods. See if I can come up with a pattern of some sort.

Which brings up a few questions… does pressure mean alot while hunting coyotes?
Does it affect when they respond to vocals? Does rising or dropping pressure make them move more ? Or steady?

Just trying to learn as much as possible about the game we hunt.

Thanks in advance



1st off I'm no pro. I'm not sure what that term actually stands for, lol. I'm however an old coyote hunter. I personally believe every coyote thats been around for a yr or more. Has it's own experiences/intelligence as having dealt with hunters. One guy actually told me a coyote can't/doesn't "reason". I thought him foolish. Of course they can reason. Although primitive in nature. But reasoning is reasoning. That is what keeps some animals alive...duh.

Local or territorial coyotes having been shot at by a hunter. Will still remain on it's respective territory. A good bet it may or will be harder to stalk or call the next time. Because coyotes do have a memory. How well that coyote learned from that bad experience. Is up to that idividual coyote. The ole "once burnt, twice shy" scenario.

Observable pressure; I've witnessed two hunters on separate occasions. Trying to sneak in on a bedded coyote. Both coyotes heard those hunters coming. From a long ways. I watched both hunts from the gravel road about 1/2 mile away in the hills. Both coyotes, before the respective hunter topped the last hill(between the coyote & hunter). Simply got up & walked away over the next hill. Once they got over onto the opposing hillside. They sat down facing towards the hunter & waited. I sat on the road watching & being amused. End result both hunters walked a good 1/2 mile on those hills & never laid eyes on those coyotes again. Coyotes-2, hunters-0.

So in summation; I believe pressure/education does makes a difference to a coyote. How much difference is up to that respective coyote.
_________________________
My only interest is wild canine Biology & Behaviors.

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#3309243 - 12/23/22 07:34 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
Shooter222 Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 01/06/20
Posts: 250
Loc: Michigan
Thanks for the response.


I was asking about barometric pressure raising and falling or being steady.

I been keeping notes on when the bigger bucks and been seen moving this year on my lands I hunt.
Seems there may be a pattern. But no positive yet. Since Opening day of gun season my deer have changed 100% in patterns and moving. My records include moon phase, wind direction , bar. Pressure , feeding period times

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#3309244 - 12/23/22 07:41 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
Shooter222 Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 01/06/20
Posts: 250
Loc: Michigan
No doubt in my mind coyotes learn from bad experiences.
I also believe them same coyotes can be tricked by changes in setup/ calling position.

Called in a double- big male hung back. We dropped female. Male got away.
He would respond to vocals but refused to commit on anything we threw at it noise wise.

Last time we changed from north side of field to south, he came in on a string to a female interrogation howl .

But we called that same field 3or 4 times from north side, he refused to show face.

surely smart ! But not untrickable

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#3309250 - 12/23/22 09:46 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
1oldcoyote Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 03/18/22
Posts: 123
Loc: Central plains
Originally Posted By: Shooter222
Thanks for the response.


I was asking about barometric pressure raising and falling or being steady.

I been keeping notes on when the bigger bucks and been seen moving this year on my lands I hunt.
Seems there may be a pattern. But no positive yet. Since Opening day of gun season my deer have changed 100% in patterns and moving. My records include moon phase, wind direction , bar. Pressure , feeding period times


OK got it now. As for pressure systems in relationship with wind directions. I have seen more coyotes laying out & traveling amongst the hills in a Northerly wind direction/high pressure system. I'll add Sunny days were best as for sightings. Low pressure/Southerly wind days I've seen very few coyotes (Sunshine or not). I'm talking less than a dozen sightings. My findings were observed since 1968. Hunting hard every season. Maybe my findings/sightings are a regional thing? Because I've never hunted any other region.


Edited by 1oldcoyote (12/24/22 07:03 AM)
_________________________
My only interest is wild canine Biology & Behaviors.

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#3309304 - 12/24/22 01:55 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
AWS Offline
Moderator

Registered: 02/01/03
Posts: 6413
Loc: NM
I personally do not ever look pressure or solar lunar tables. Fish and critters are out there and they have to eat. You aren't so far from animals, do you not eat when things aren't lined up correctly, does your dog not because of these things. If you get out there and hunt them they will respond.. I rarely hunt first light for coyotes, I find responses all day. Mid-day coyotes are as common as early morning or late in the day. Some.days I don't go out until after lunch when it warms up. I kill coyotes. I do find that in the daylight they do not like to expose themselves and will use every bit of brush and low terrain to approach the call.


I will say if you believe in these things and you still go out you are expecting it to be a bad day and you won't be as sharp as you will be on the days you are expecting to be good.
If you wait for the stars to align, the moon to be right(barring calling in winter night), solar lunar table to be correct for the hunt or barometric conditions to be right you are going to kill a.lot less critters.


Edited by AWS (12/24/22 01:59 PM)
_________________________
After the first shot the rest are just noise.

Make mine a Minaska.

Heaven has rules and walls, He-l has open borders

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#3309429 - 12/26/22 03:06 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
K-22hornet. Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/06/03
Posts: 1717
Loc: Colorado
"Which brings up a few questions… does pressure mean alot while hunting coyotes?
Does it affect when they respond to vocals? Does rising or dropping pressure make them move more ? Or steady?"

Like AWS, I don't look at Solunar tables, but, I do watch the weather.

Very high winds, and I'll likely stay home, though I had my single best day on a very high wind day-9 stands 9 coyotes called in, even though, on some stands, we only moved 3-400yds between stands.

Hunting right after a day(s) long storm can be very productive, for all game. They have been holed up trying to escape the weather, so when the weather breaks, game gets up and gets moving.

I think what makes them move more is hunger, with the possibility of sex being even stronger.

Years ago, I was goose hunting this time of year. Way off to the North, in a snow covered field, were 2 packs of coyotes, maybe 100yds apart. Through my bino's, I could see 2 coyotes laying several yards away from each pack. Every once in awhile, a coyote from a group would get up, circle the 2 coyotes, then go back and lay down with the group.

This went on all day. I tried rabbit in distress, and only got a glance my way. I tried howling, which caused a couple in each pack to stand up and stare in my direction, but none would come my way.

The very next year, I was again goose hunting the same spot in mid-December, and, way to the North, are 2 packs of coyotes in the same vicinity. Plus, I had the same results as the year before, nothing, NADA, zilch coming to my calls.

I can't prove this, but, I think I witnessed multiple males in the groups, with the females off to the sides. The coyotes from the group that got up and circled the 2 coyotes were, I think, doing a 'sniff check', to see if the girls were ready to mate.

The possibility of sex overrode any hunger pains the boys had.

This may also explain why I kill fewer coyotes in December, than any other month I hunt (early November-mid-April).

As always, YMMV.
_________________________
Liberals are the most highly educated, stupid people I've ever met!

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#3310431 - 01/06/23 08:35 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
Tonester Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 04/20/13
Posts: 479
Loc: SE Nebraska
This is an interesting topic and I have paid a lot more attention to a few things in the past three years or so. I have been paying a lot more attention because I read an article about "high-pressure" and deer movement. This gentleman claimed that he always killed deer on high-pressure days. I also read about the moon and how it affects deer patterns, hog patterns, and raccoons.

I learned a few things while meticulously watching the moon, wind, and pressure.

1. A full moon seems to have an impact on animal movement. However, I think it has more to do with my movement. A full lit sky makes me easier to spot. About 4 months ago, I killed the biggest raccoon that I ever shot in about a decade. It was a group of boars on a cattle feeder. They were eating and traveling together. They were not phased or "held up" by a full moon. (Hunger)

2. High wind seems to be a deterrent. I used to avoid hunting in the wind but I started to do so because animals have to eat when its cold. Last week, it was 16 degrees with 20 mph winds. My silly-self sat out in it to use my new muzzle-loader. I saw 9 doe that day and I missed one at 25 yards with my new muzzle loader. My hands were burning/numbing and I was shivering bad within 20 minutes. High winds did not stop the deer from moving and presenting themselves for a shot. (Hunger)

3. Pressure seems to be a factor when hunting. I watched the pressure meticulously during the month of December 2022. The day I went out, it was low pressure (around 28). That day was cold, high winds, and low pressure. I saw 9 doe that day. (Hunger)

4. The October Lull. That was a big thing when I started bow-hunting in 2012. Every year, from my stand, I would watch the deer disappear around October 15th. After paying attention to lunar patterns and lunar illumination, I noticed that a full moon was common around this time.

To add to that, one of my buddies was a firm believer in the lull. He had been hunting for 20 years. I believed his field observations.

Another buddy with 40 + years of deer hunting under his belt told me that the lull is a myth. I started reading articles about it, too. Long/short, I tested the lull and found out a few things. A - it is a myth. B - deer will pattern you if you keep going to the same place, scenting it, and shooting from it. C - deer will simply move over a few hundred yards from where you are. The fix is to move areas or rotate properties. (Hunting Pressure)

5. What has been working for me lately? When I hunt, I have been intentionally going out during a storm, the afternoon/night before a storm, or the afternoon before a major drop in temperature. That has been very effective for hunting coyotes, raccoons, and deer.


Here is my main point: God has proven to me that His creatures are smart. Just when I think I figured out a formula, His animals will contradict said formula. All of the items above are great "tools" but they simply cannot be used to guarantee success.

His creatures will keep you guessing.

TC


Edited by Tonester (01/06/23 08:46 PM)
_________________________
There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy. But you--who are you to judge your neighbor?

James 4:12

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#3310512 - 01/07/23 06:01 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Tonester]
1oldcoyote Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 03/18/22
Posts: 123
Loc: Central plains
Originally Posted By: Tonester
This is an interesting topic and I have paid a lot more attention to a few things in the past three years or so. I have been paying a lot more attention because I read an article about "high-pressure" and deer movement. This gentleman claimed that he always killed deer on high-pressure days. I also read about the moon and how it affects deer patterns, hog patterns, and raccoons.

I learned a few things while meticulously watching the moon, wind, and pressure.

1. A full moon seems to have an impact on animal movement. However, I think it has more to do with my movement. A full lit sky makes me easier to spot. About 4 months ago, I killed the biggest raccoon that I ever shot in about a decade. It was a group of boars on a cattle feeder. They were eating and traveling together. They were not phased or "held up" by a full moon. (Hunger)

2. High wind seems to be a deterrent. I used to avoid hunting in the wind but I started to do so because animals have to eat when its cold. Last week, it was 16 degrees with 20 mph winds. My silly-self sat out in it to use my new muzzle-loader. I saw 9 doe that day and I missed one at 25 yards with my new muzzle loader. My hands were burning/numbing and I was shivering bad within 20 minutes. High winds did not stop the deer from moving and presenting themselves for a shot. (Hunger)

3. Pressure seems to be a factor when hunting. I watched the pressure meticulously during the month of December 2022. The day I went out, it was low pressure (around 28). That day was cold, high winds, and low pressure. I saw 9 doe that day. (Hunger)

4. The October Lull. That was a big thing when I started bow-hunting in 2012. Every year, from my stand, I would watch the deer disappear around October 15th. After paying attention to lunar patterns and lunar illumination, I noticed that a full moon was common around this time.

To add to that, one of my buddies was a firm believer in the lull. He had been hunting for 20 years. I believed his field observations.

Another buddy with 40 + years of deer hunting under his belt told me that the lull is a myth. I started reading articles about it, too. Long/short, I tested the lull and found out a few things. A - it is a myth. B - deer will pattern you if you keep going to the same place, scenting it, and shooting from it. C - deer will simply move over a few hundred yards from where you are. The fix is to move areas or rotate properties. (Hunting Pressure)

5. What has been working for me lately? When I hunt, I have been intentionally going out during a storm, the afternoon/night before a storm, or the afternoon before a major drop in temperature. That has been very effective for hunting coyotes, raccoons, and deer.


Here is my main point: God has proven to me that His creatures are smart. Just when I think I figured out a formula, His animals will contradict said formula. All of the items above are great "tools" but they simply cannot be used to guarantee success.

His creatures will keep you guessing.

TC


Interesting observations. I will add a tidbit about deer hunting/hunters & the hunting pressure they unleash. I'm not a deer hunter as I have no interest in them. However, I've seen plenty of their behaviors. When shotgun season is in full swing. The "smart" deer for the most part. Will abandoned heavily hunted timber. They move to neighboring land void of timber. As they feed & bed amongst the hills.
_________________________
My only interest is wild canine Biology & Behaviors.

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#3310594 - 01/08/23 09:23 PM Re: Question for the pros [Re: 1oldcoyote]
spotstalkshoot Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 12/22/13
Posts: 2567
Loc: so.mn
Weather trumps the moon. Some say hunt when the moon is overhead, others moon rise or set. I don't like wind direction changes during the day when I'm spotting. I see more animals moving as pressure falls with front coming in, than as front leaves and pressure increases.

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#3311154 - 01/16/23 10:58 AM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
Shooter222 Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 01/06/20
Posts: 250
Loc: Michigan
Lots of good info.
Thanks guys. I’m gonna keep going with my records and see if I can come up with anything useful over the years.

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#3313198 - 02/03/23 11:36 AM Re: Question for the pros [Re: Shooter222]
Infidel 762 Offline
Moderator

Registered: 04/04/14
Posts: 7045
Loc: Okie
Originally Posted By: Shooter222
I have been watching minor and major feed times a lot this year since adding 6 cell game cameras to my hunting program. I have kept notes since October this year when bow started for deer season. From what I’ve noticed so far- Minor feeding periods have the bigger bucks moving. I’m gonna pay closer attention this coyote season to pressure and feeding periods. See if I can come up with a pattern of some sort.

Which brings up a few questions… does pressure mean alot while hunting coyotes?
Does it affect when they respond to vocals? Does rising or dropping pressure make them move more ? Or steady?

Just trying to learn as much as possible about the game we hunt.

Thanks in advance



I am no pro, but I see the same patterns every year, trail cameras can show you patterns you would never see hunting because they document their nocturnal activity when they are most active. I have hunted whitetails on our ranch for 35 years. Around 2007 trail cameras became a tool in our arsenal. We fill gravity feeders with a blend, but the main mix is corn that we buy in bulk from a corn farmer by the tons, along with food plots. Feed patterns change with the length of daylight which triggers the dying off a lot of their native food sources. The does are not traveling to breed, they are building up fat for the upcoming harsh winter conditions.

The biggest factor you will see in regards to buck movement is the doe estrous cycle. Pre-rut is what breaks up the bachelor groups of bucks and their reason for travel shifts from food to breeding. Cold, cloudy days with low wind will definitely increase their movement, but natural instinct drives them to seek out does to breed. I’ve heard multiple people say they don’t know what happened, they had all these bucks on camera early fall and now they are gone. Depending on the personality of the individual buck they leave their core area at different ranges to chase. In my area I take off work every year November 7th to start hunting the rut. I see rut activity reports being posted and people asking in groups if others are seeing rut activity, I don’t pay no attention to what they are saying I just set my clock for November 7th. Why, because the estrous cycle is not triggered by weather, it is triggered by length of dayLight.

IMHO there are not really lulls. There are lockdowns after the first several days of rifle season opening, when the orange army descends from the city limits to fill tags. Our gun seasons starts the weekend before thanks giving and after thanks giving daylight movement will significantly decrease. Those deer live out there and they notice all the new scents, activity and gunshots or they get shot. In my area they respond by turning more nocturnal and mature bucks will seek out bedding areas where there has been no human scent. Some of the thickest timber on our property we leave as sanctuary and hunt the edges and pinch points around them. There are times the instinct to breed will still trigger a mature buck to get up and travel in the middle of a sunny, windy day, but the majority of their movement will still be nocturnal.

IMHO I don’t let barometric pressure or moon phase decide when I hunt. I plan my hunts and tactics based of estrous cycle, length of daylight, wind direction and other hunters putting pressure on them. I use some of those same tactics planning my coyote stands.

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