NEW Shotgun Pattern Test Results - Detail & Pic' heavy...

This is a follow up to my pattern posts on pages 80 & 81 using a Maverick 88 in 12 gauge:

I picked up a Truglow Gobble Stopper .677" choke tube and tested various (see my posts on 80 & 81) loads of # 4 buckshot. I found that the Remington (Green/yellow box) 2 3/4" , 4BK, 1325 fps, 27 pellets patterned with the most consistency. I was able to place 8-13 pellets in a 10" ring @ 40yds. When I moved out to 50yds, the patterned opened up and only 1-3 pellets landed within a 10" ring.

Down below is a picture of the target at 40yds using the aforementioned choke and load. I fired the first round then covered the holes with 1/2" x 3/4" color coding labels (stickers) and then fired another round to confirm my earlier results from two weeks ago:

Note: If I was aiming (broadside) at the vitals of a coyote, the pellets would cover from neck to hind leg.
 
Just adding my $0.02, I recently purchased a Remington 11-87 SP with a 18" cylinder bore. On a whim I fired a few rounds of hornady varmint express 4B 2 3/4". At 40 Yds it patterned about 8-9". Despite being heavier than my 28" Akkar semi I think this will be my new coyote shotgun and load. Other rounds tested were Remington 00 2 3/4", federal 00 2 3/4", Remington 4B 2 3/4" and Remington 3" 000
 
I get the same tight patterns from my 18"cyl bore with Federal LE 00 buck.Originally Posted By: 338fanJust adding my $0.02, I recently purchased a Remington 11-87 SP with a 18" cylinder bore. On a whim I fired a few rounds of hornady varmint express 4B 2 3/4". At 40 Yds it patterned about 8-9". Despite being heavier than my 28" Akkar semi I think this will be my new coyote shotgun and load. Other rounds tested were Remington 00 2 3/4", federal 00 2 3/4", Remington 4B 2 3/4" and Remington 3" 000
 
Try federal blackcloud T's in a cyl or imp cyl if you want tight shooting steel.Originally Posted By: desertcjI don't think I'm going to find anything much different than what is already in this thread. I'm going to try one more choke with the steel loads and buy a few more types of shells. It seems to me that you can spend a small fortune on either chokes or on premium shells. In the end, it seems more likely that I will be shooting the expense shells anyways. If I could shoot lead, I think this would be easy. Grab some lead #4 buck and a couple of turkey chokes....done. On fox, I'm pretty sure that turkey loads are going to hammer 'em.
 
Well, I'm getting ready for turkey season so this obviously isn't predator specific but....I found a pretty good combo with the Patternmaster Anaconda Stryker .670" and Winchester Longbeard xr 3" #4's. At 40yds, we are talking close to 40 #4's in a coyotes face/5" circle. Not my ideal setup, but I won't hesitate if I get a chance!
 
Not knocking any other loads or brand of ammo, but if you want something that will legitimately knock a coyote down at 50 yards and will hold a TIGHT PATTERN, IMHO, there is nothing on the market like this stuff.....Federal Flight Control Wad. At 25 yards, it will hold a pattern smaller than the palm of your hand in an open bore tube with no choke. Its impressive.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-56-federal-flight-control-1-buckshot/
 
The Federal Heavyweight Coyote BB 3" 12 ga load also has the FLITECONTROL wad and they have 62 pellets in each shell.

The Heavyweight shot is 35% denser than lead and much harder than lead so it out performs lead shot by quite a bit.

At 25 yards I would rather have a one foot wide pattern with 62 to 90 pellets in it than a pattern the size of my hand.
 
I just ran some loads in my new KPY Shotgun Shell Ballistics calculator. These numbers are pretty crazy on the denser than lead shot especially the Heavyweight 15g/cc shot.


All of these loads are at 1300 fps and I had 3" of gel penetration entered. The KPY Shotshell Ballistics program says 2.50" of gel penetration is needed for geese.

I am not saying 3.0" of gel penetration is good enough for coyotes but these numbers will really show the differences in penetration in the shot sizes and the pellet densities.

#4 lead shot at 1300 fps got 3.0 " of gel penetration at 20.7 yards
#4 WIN XR 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.0 " of gel penetration at 31.2 yards

#2 WIN XR 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.16 " of gel penetration at 47.7 yards

BB shot Rem HD 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 80 yards

#2 Fed HW 15g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 88.7 yards

BB shot Fed HW 15g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 137.9 yards

Number 4 lead buck shot shot at 1300 fps got 3.00 " of gel penetration at 142.4 yards

Look at the differences in the 12g/cc loads of BB, #2 and #4 shot.

Its to bad Federal didn't make a Heavyweight Coyote load with #1 or #2 shot!
 
It's also too bad the heavy weight stuff isn't being made any more. That leaves the grossly overpriced Hevishot, and I personally haven't been able to get Hevishot to pattern worth a darn through the widest of tubes down to fairly open turkey chokes.

Remington, Federal, and Winchester have all phased out their HTL loads.

I'll vouch for the super tight FliteControl patterns though. I had a gun that patterned hand sized at 40 yards with 00 buck, which I sold several years ago when I was in a bind. My 500 cylinder bore patterns the same stuff in about a 12" group at the same distance.

That's some very interesting info derbyacresbob!
 
Oh, I have a question. Someone at work had told me they would consider using something like Winchester Blinside BB for coyotes. It's a steel shot though and to me, the BB wouldn't retain enough energy.

What is the consensus here on steel? I thought I had seen a chart somewhere but haven't been able to find it again.
 
If you keep your eyes open and search the net you can still find the discontinued denser than lead loads.

As far as I know Federal is still making the Heavyweight Coyote BB loads.

If you reload shotgun shells Bucks Run sells HW13 shot in sizes #6, #4, #2, BB and T shot. You can reload 1-1/2 oz loads for half the price of Hevi-Shot Goose loads and the HW13 shot is round and very consistent in the sizes.
 
Originally Posted By: RossignolOh, I have a question. Someone at work had told me they would consider using something like Winchester Blinside BB for coyotes. It's a steel shot though and to me, the BB wouldn't retain enough energy.

What is the consensus here on steel? I thought I had seen a chart somewhere but haven't been able to find it again.

Don't use steel shot on coyotes.

Winchester Blinside shot doesn't penetrate as deep as round steel shot of the same weight.

I just ran three loads for you through the KPY Shotshell Ballistic calculator.

BB steel shot at 1500 fps had 3.0" of gel penetration at 25.3 yards.

Lead BB shot at 1300 fps had 3.0" of gel penetration at 65.4 yards.

Rem HD 12g/cc BB shot at 1300 fps had 3.0" of gel penetration at 82.6 yards.

One time when I was doing some penetration tests on plywood and catalogs, the steel Black Cloud BBB shot was stuck flush in the 3/4" thick plywood at 40 yards, the Rem HD and Federal Heavyweight BB shot went completely through the 3/4" plywood.
 
Thanks for running those numbers!

I had considered the Federal 3" lead BB to be a better option than the Blindside. It's about $30 for 25 rounds. Based on the numbers you came up with its still not the most viable option at longer ranges. I wonder what it looks like to say 50 yards?

I spoke with Federal some time ago. They definitely said the heavy weight BB was not being produced any more despite it still appearing on their site. Which sucks because its less expensive than stupid Hevishot.

I spoke with a tech from Hevishot. He told me what chokes produced their best patterns through the model gun I'm using and I've not been able to get anywhere close and I'm almost at the point of thinking its just my gun. Though I get decent patterns with other stuff. I get great turkey load patterns, and I've posted patterns with 4 buck and I've been told those patterns are as good as any. My gun also patterns heavy weight B loads pretty well, but not Hevishot.
 
That's really great info Bob. In your opinion what depth of gel penetration would you enter for a coyote? Maybe 8"? That wouldn't account for hide and/or bone. It's a very useful tool.
 
The amount of gel penetration needed to kill coyotes is a good question GC. I know that if 2.5" of gel penetration is needed to kill geese it will need to be more penetration for killing coyotes.

The gel must be tougher than I thought because I entered 5.0" of gel penetration with lead BB shot at 1200 fps and the distance was only 11 yards.

Then I switched the gel penetration to 3.70" with lead BB shot at 1200 fps and the distance went out to 42.2 yards.

Rem HD 12g/cc BB shot at 1300 fps got 3.70" of gel penetration at 64.4 yards.

Federal Heavyweight #2 shot at 1300 fps got 3.70" of penetration at 72.8 yards.

Steel T shot at 1500 fps got 3.70" of penetration at 23.4 yards.

Back in the old days I killed lots of coyotes that weighed between 20 and 35 pounds with copper coated lead BB shot. The KPY Ballistic Program shows 3.70" of penetration at 42.2 yards with the copper coated lead BB shot so I think the gel penetration needed for coyotes will be between 3.50" and 4.0".

Smaller and lighter pellets can kill coyotes by shooting coyotes in the head but I never have liked the idea of using shotgun shells on coyotes that will only kill the coyote if it is head shot.

Lead #4 shot at 1300 fps gives 3.70" of gel penetration at 8.8 yards. Lead #4 shot at 1300 fps gives 2.58" of gel penetration at 31.8 yards.
 
I'm down to my last 30 rounds of Wingmaster HD BB. I just ordered a 12gauge reloading press, Lyman shotshell manual and the coyote manual.

How does ITX -10 (bismuth) BB compare to HW13 (tungsten)BB ? Have they improved the bismuth or does it still fragment on impact ?
 
Originally Posted By: TXCOONDOGI'm down to my last 30 rounds of Wingmaster HD BB. I just ordered a 12gauge reloading press, Lyman shotshell manual and the coyote manual.

How does ITX -10 (bismuth) BB compare to HW13 (tungsten)BB ? Have they improved the bismuth or does it fragment on impact ?

Check out this link to Natcez. This old Remington Hevi-Shot is not preety but it is a great buy.
https://www.natchezss.com/hevi-shot-bb-10lb-bulk.html

I bought TPS wads and new 3" Fiocchi primed hulls from BPI and was able to reload the 1-1/2 oz BB Hevi-Shot loads for right at $1.60 per shell.

BPI has a reloading manual called Handloading Hevi-Shot and Bucks Run that sells HW13 shot has a Heavyweight Shot Reloaders guide. Bucks Run phone number is 507-356-2195

I ran the numbers on ITX BB, Bismuth BB,lead BB, HW13 BB and Federal Heavyweight BB.

ITX BB at 1300 fps had 3.50" of gel penetration at 37.7 yards.

Bismuth BB at 1300 fps had 3.52" of gel penetration at 32.7 yards.

Lead BB at 1300 fps had 3.56" of gel penetration at 51.7 yards.

HW13 BB at 1300 fps had 3.52" of gel penetration at 87.8 yards.

Federal Heavyweight BB at 1300 fps had 3.80" of gel penetration at 115.3 yards.
 
Originally Posted By: derbyacresbobI just ran some loads in my new KPY Shotgun Shell Ballistics calculator. These numbers are pretty crazy on the denser than lead shot especially the Heavyweight 15g/cc shot.


All of these loads are at 1300 fps and I had 3" of gel penetration entered. The KPY Shotshell Ballistics program says 2.50" of gel penetration is needed for geese.

I am not saying 3.0" of gel penetration is good enough for coyotes but these numbers will really show the differences in penetration in the shot sizes and the pellet densities.

#4 lead shot at 1300 fps got 3.0 " of gel penetration at 20.7 yards
#4 WIN XR 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.0 " of gel penetration at 31.2 yards

#2 WIN XR 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.16 " of gel penetration at 47.7 yards

BB shot Rem HD 12g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 80 yards

#2 Fed HW 15g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 88.7 yards

BB shot Fed HW 15g/cc shot at 1300 fps got 3.26 " of gel penetration at 137.9 yards

Number 4 lead buck shot shot at 1300 fps got 3.00 " of gel penetration at 142.4 yards

Look at the differences in the 12g/cc loads of BB, #2 and #4 shot.

Its to bad Federal didn't make a Heavyweight Coyote load with #1 or #2 shot!

Very interesting post, I'm in Scotland, UK, so no coyotes my interest is fox. I think 3" gel penetration would be adequate on fox thus if I understand your post correctly lead 4 Buck [0.240" dia] would have sufficient energy out to 142 yards which is about double the distance I can get a killing pattern with my handloads. Your lead T Buck [0.200" dia] same as our AAA size would seem a better choice and patterns well with my guns. Have you any penetration data for T Buck that you can share. My best gun for this work is a Mossberg 500 with screw in chokes. Thanks for any data you can provide.
 
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michaeluk, check out test loads #7 & #8 above. #7 & #8 are set for 3.50" of gel penetration for coyotes.

For fox lead BB may work great and you would have a much higher pellet count per shell.

When I could use lead shot on coyotes the lead T shot worked really good for me. The lead BBB shot also worked good on coyotes and should also work good on fox.

I just ran three lead loads through my KPY Shotshell Ballistics Program. All three loads were 1250 fps loads and the gel penetration was set at 3.0" for hunting fox.

Lead BB shot at 1250 fps got 3.0" of gel penetration at 67.5 yards.

Lead BBB shot at 1250 fps got 3.0" of gel penetration at 78.9 yards.

Lead T shot at 1250 fps got 3.0" of gel penetration at 90.1 yards.

I hope everybody understands that these yardage numbers doesn't mean that you should be shooting these loads at these yardages on fox or coyotes. Your effective pattern could be up to 40 yards less with the bigger shot than the gel penetration yardage is.
 
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