Gun Control in the Bailout Bill

Hunt

New member
"Pork" Bailout Bill Could Ban Guns For Millions Of Americans
-- Ask your Senators to oppose HR 1

Gun Owners of America E-Mail Alert
8001 Forbes Place, Suite 102, Springfield, VA 22151
Phone: 703-321-8585 / FAX: 703-321-8408
http://www.gunowners.org


"HR 1 is about more than just pork. Millions of gun owners stand to
lose their gun rights without any due process." -- Larry Pratt, GOA
Executive Director


Wednesday, February 11, 2009

The Obama administration is putting a lot of pressure on Congress to
slam through the most recent $800+ billion bailout package before anyone
has an opportunity to read it.

The Obama administration intones that the details are unimportant. The
only thing that matters is the "bigness." And, by shipping a bill of
nearly $900 billion (plus interest) to our children and grandchildren,
the package is really, really big -- bigger, in fact, than the budget of
our entire government for the first 170 years of our country's
existence.

But now that some of the details are finally starting to leak out of
Washington, Gun Owners -- and a lot of other analysts -- are beginning
to look at the fine print. And some of it is particularly scary.

Of particular concern to gun owners are sections 13101 through 13434 of
HR 1, which would set up the infrastructure to computerize the medical
records of ALL AMERICANS in a government-coordinated database.

True, the bill doesn't mandate that the data will be in a giant computer
under the Oval Office. But it does mandate that your medical records be
reduced to a computerized form which is available to it in a second.

This it would do by establishing a National Coordinator for Health
Information Technology -- tasked with, among other things, "providing
information to help guide medical decisions at the time and place of
care."

It should be scary enough that a government bureaucrat is directed by
statute to try to influence your doctor's decisions with respect to your
medical care.

But of even greater concern to gun owners is the fact that a
government-coordinated database (which government can freely access)
will now contain all records of government-provided and private
psychiatric treatment -- including, in particular, the drugs which were
prescribed.

Remember last year's "NICS Improvement Act" -- otherwise known as the
Veterans Disarmament Act? This law codified ATF's attempts to make you
a prohibited person on the basis of a government psychiatrist's finding
that you are a "danger" -- without a finding by any court. Well,
roughly 150,000 battle-scarred veterans have already been unfairly
stripped of their gun rights by the government.

But people who, as kids, were diagnosed with Attention Deficit
Disorder... or seniors with Alzheimer's... or police with Post-Traumatic
Stress Disorder... or people who are now theoretically covered by the
new law... these people have, generally, not suffered the consequences
of its sanctions -- YET. And the chief reason is that their records are
not easily available to the government in a central, easily retrievable,
computerized form.

The bailout bill would change all of that. It would push increasingly
hard to force your private psychiatrist or government-sanctioned
psychiatrist to turn over your psychiatric records to a massive
database. This would be mandated immediately if your doctor does
business with the government.

This would supposedly save Medicare money in connection with medical
treatment. And, the sponsors insist, they would work very hard to
protect your privacy.

But this turns the concept of "privacy" on its head. The privacy which
is MOST important is privacy from the prying eyes of government -- not
privacy of government data against the prying eyes of others. After
all, many government data bases have been hacked in recent years, with
mountains of information stolen.

So, once the government has access to these computerized psychiatric
records, the stage will be set for using that database to take away the
gun rights of those with Alzheimer's, those with ADD, and those with
PTSD.

ACTION: Write your two senators. Urge them to vote against the bailout
bill (HR 1) until it is stripped of provisions which would turn your
psychiatric records over to a central government-coordinated database
against your will -- without you getting your day in court.

You can go to the Gun Owners Legislative Action Center at
http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm to send your Senators the
pre-written e-mail message below.

----- Prewritten Letter -----

Dear Senator:

I am particularly concerned about sections 13101 through 13434 of the
new bailout bill (HR 1). These sections would set up the infrastructure
to computerize the medical records of ALL AMERICANS in a
government-coordinated database, including psychiatric records.

It is scary enough that a government bureaucrat is directed by statute
to try to influence my doctor's decisions with respect to my medical
care.

But of even greater concern to gun owners is the fact that a
government-coordinated database will now contain all records of
government-provided and private psychiatric treatment.

Last year's "NICS Improvement Act" codified ATF's attempts to make a
person a prohibited person on the basis of a government psychiatrist's
finding that he is a "danger" -- without a finding by any court. Well,
roughly 150,000 battle-scarred veterans have already been unfairly
stripped of their gun rights by the government.

Now, this new government-coordinated database threatens the gun rights
of people who, as kids, were diagnosed with Attention Deficit
Disorder... seniors with Alzheimer's... police with Post-Traumatic
Stress Disorder... and many other law-abiding Americans.

Please vote against cloture on HR 1 until this provision is removed.

Sincerely,


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Thanks for promoting and reminding us of the fight.

I was already mad about the health care portion of that bill. Which Dashle, over a year ago, stated in his book that they would need to slide this kind of legislation in on a budget bill to avoid the resistance.

I had not even thought about the implications with using it to take guns. Great catch on that one.
 
I have done so already but, be advised the bailout has already been passed. By a huge margin, Democrats going gung ho for it, and the few Republicans who were against it were just not enough. I am afraid that this is the face of things to come, with Obama rubber stamping anything the liberals want, and the liberal congress falling over themselves to do the annointed one's bidding. It is going to be a hard two years till we can take back congress, and a Harder next two to get that guy out of the white house.
I don't know who will be chosen to run against him but they will be in an up hill battle all the way. Now is the time to start helping any conservative politicians you know of campaghn we have two years then a lot more years to correct this liberal mess that is coming. Look for a terrorist attack with in the next eight to ten months, to engender fear in the sheeple and to help them outlaw the constitution or to rewrite it in as version that will keep them in power.
 
well i dont have no guns had to saell them to buy food /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Folks,
I know this is the firearm forum but I also know this site gets hit pretty good with viewers. Therefore, I hope you all don't get tired of my "all hands on deck" posts. I'm going to keep at the good fight until the Dems. are out of majority or Obama is voted out (or both).
 
Hunt, Are you telling me you support gun rights for alzheimer's patients. I strongly believe in gun rights but I also believe some people should not have guns. My mother could not even figure out how to make the letter "D" to spell her name and she was a very smart woman before the disease, but she should be able to pack a gun? Come on and as far as the Government knowing that you have a condition Medicare and Medicaid are government run programs and your treatments and medications records are sent to them to allow payment so they already know. We need to pick our fights smartly and not come out looking like the anti`s or peta.
 
viper - Please correct me if I a wrong, but it sounds like you understand the stimulus bill to be referring to medicaid and medicare recipients. I believe the actual legislation applies nationalized records for "every American". Which would extend their reach and control well beyond the elderly.

For example (as I speculate) the government may try to say that people with A.D.D. are statistically more dangerous. They search the national database, and pull out the names of everyone that have that diagnosis, and viola a new group of people that can't have guns. One group down and onto the next.

The bill has passed and that fight is over. It is, however, important that we are aware of what is coming and the ramifications it will have.

The government never gives us anything without taking something away and it is never an equal swap. People need to quit waiting and hoping they will be named for the next handout.
 
I am from Wasinton state. Our Senators are either corrupt, or stupid. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif Wast of tim talking to them. They are the problem.
 
Quote:
For example (as I speculate) the government may try to say that people with A.D.D. are statistically more dangerous. They search the national database, and pull out the names of everyone that have that diagnosis, and viola a new group of people that can't have guns. One group down and onto the next.



well said. and who's to say which group big bro will pick next. maybe you had a seizure once,or you have arthritis, or smoked dope once upon a time (but didnt inhale /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif), the problem is THEY get to decide /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angry-smiley-055.gif
 
Viper,
I am not trying to be condescending here but I don't think you are seeing the whole picture. Gun control starts with control that seems sensible to the masses and then digresses from there. I'm not for mentally ill people having guns but I certainly don't think that would include someone as being mentally ill as having ADHD. Therefore, that's how it will be broken down. With this said, I don't think pro-gun advocates have the luxury of picking and choosing their battles. We need to be heard louder now than any other advocacy group. It seems the squeaky wheel gets the oil.

Lastly, as for the electronic health record, I don't need to discuss this. I live it every day as I work in the healthcare industry for a Fortune 100 Healthcare company. We have been on this initiative for several years now and to say it's interesting is an understatement.

Quote:
Hunt, Are you telling me you support gun rights for alzheimer's patients. I strongly believe in gun rights but I also believe some people should not have guns. My mother could not even figure out how to make the letter "D" to spell her name and she was a very smart woman before the disease, but she should be able to pack a gun? Come on and as far as the Government knowing that you have a condition Medicare and Medicaid are government run programs and your treatments and medications records are sent to them to allow payment so they already know. We need to pick our fights smartly and not come out looking like the anti`s or peta.

 
Oxnam, I agree we need to watch and fight to protect rights but my point is the government already can access many records, Medicare and Medicaid being an example. Veterans that go to VA clinics also could be accessed by the goverment if chosen to do so. Some good things could come from a medical data base. One would be drug seekers that go from doctor to doctor to get drugs would be caught. Another would be that if you have a cardiac doctor prescribe you a medication and you go to an ortho doctor and he happens to prescribe something that could be dangerous if taken with the other medication maybe a data program would have alerted him. Or a person could be on vacation hunting coyotes and have a stroke where he can not speak for himself. Maybe a data base would be a valuable tool to allow that ER to know your history, medications , and allergys. My whole point is some rules/laws maybe used for bad things but lets not be so unbendable that we throw the good water away with the bad. And let not be so unbendable that we support allowing people rights that would endanger themselfs and others. Everyone wants to protect gun rights but the alzheimers quote in Hunters post was a little in left field. It would be like saying blind people have rights which they do but would anyone defend their right to drive a car? That was my point.
 
The government has been pushing for several years now to have doctors keep patient medical files on their computers. It is said to be for the purpose, at least in part, for containing medicare and medicaid costs.

Jeff
 
ptsd anit a mental thing like being mentaly ill,,, it is a brain injury caused from too much stress it has nothing to do your mind seting like being crazy,,,, i hate polits
 
Viper - Thanks for the reply. No doubt there are many advantages of standardized medical records. My fear, the government has to get bigger (promise more, take even more).

I run a nursing home and am all too aware of big brother. The BS and wasted time that we go through to satisfy the every growing regulation requirements is insane.

Here is a perfect example: Surveyors (H&W policy police) come into the building at regular intervals. They end up looking at a residents chart and scrutizing everything from daily cares to doctors orders. In a matter of hours, they can decide that we are in violation of federal guidelines because of cares we have given a resident according to the physician orders. What they decide trumps the doctor's orders. The doctor, who has known the resident for literally decades, is basically told that government knows better. Now that is scary when you expand it to everyone and now your doctor has less control to act in your best interest.

Polititians don't believe we could manage without them holding our hands and making the important decisions for us. They are like having a manipulative, ingnorant parent.

Government eventually abuses power, period. And many of those in power do not like the idea of an armed people beneath them. Easier to abuse and push a people around when they have no means to fight back. This is why it was put in the Constitution.
 
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