Can Doctors ask patients about guns?

hm1996

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Quote:Fla. lawsuit: Can doctors ask patients about guns?

By CURT ANDERSON, Associated Press
July 13, 2011
MIAMI (AP) —

Doctors in Florida are fighting a first-of-its-kind law requiring them to have a legitimate safety concern before they start asking a patient about guns.

The physicians contend the new law is too broad and they should be free to ask patients and parents about firearms in the house to make sure people know how to keep them safely locked away. Doctors routinely offer similar advice about other household risks, from the dangers of tobacco use to swimming pools.

Gun rights supporters who pushed for the new law believe questions about gun ownership are an invasion of privacy, and say some people have been dropped by doctors simply because they refused to talk about firearms.

The law, signed by Republican Gov. Rick Scott, took effect June 2. It forbids doctors from inquiring about guns unless the information is "relevant to a patient's medical care or safety, or the safety of others."

Doctors' groups representing about 11,000 physicians in Florida immediately sued, calling on a federal judge to block the law. They say the law is already having a chilling effect on meaningful conversations about firearms with patients, which professional medical organizations have for years advocated as good practice. Many patient questionnaires ask about gun ownership.

"Making sure patients understand the risks around them is a critical part of a doctor's mission," Douglas Hallward-Driemeier, an attorney for the physicians' said Wednesday during a court hearing on the lawsuit.

U.S. District Judge Marcia Cooke didn't issue a ruling but asked skeptical questions of the doctors.

"What's relevant about asking about my gun when I came in with a cold?" said Cooke, a 2004 appointee of President George W. Bush. "Maybe it's the other way around. Maybe the questionnaire is overbroad and not the statute."

The judge noted the law allowed for exceptions. People with mental health problems, for example, could be asked about owning guns.

The Florida attorney general's office says doctors are misreading the law. They argue it protects patients from discrimination or harassment and reaffirms a patient's right to refuse to answer. It also prohibits doctors from dropping patients because they own a gun.

"It does not prohibit a conversation about firearms between doctors and their patients," said Jason Vail, an assistant state attorney general.

Doctors are worried about curious children finding weapons around the house. As recently as May, a 3-year-old South Carolina girl found the family's loaded handgun on a windowsill and shot herself to death.

"What if a family refuses to answer the question about guns and a kid gets killed?" said Dr. Lisa A. Cosgrove, a pediatrician in Merritt Island who added that she has a concealed weapons permit. "Who is responsible then? You tried your best to ask, but my heart is going to be crushed."

The issue found its way to the GOP-controlled Florida Legislature after what is known as the "Ocala incident" took place in 2010, according to the state's response to the lawsuit. In that instance, a young mother was dropped from a doctor's practice solely because she refused to answer questions about firearm ownership. Similar cases came to light as lawmakers debated the measure.

One legislator said he was told about "a mother who was separated from her children during an office visit while a pediatrician interrogated them" about guns, according to the state's filings.

Emotions were running so high during the debate the legislation initially included a possible five-year prison sentence and fines up to $5 million. The punishment was eventually scaled down to disciplinary action by the Florida Board of Medicine, including a loss of a doctor's medical license, and a possible $10,000 fine.

Doctors are worried any patient who takes offense to a gun-related question could haul them before the board.

"It's all in the eye of the beholder, whether it's harassment or not," said Hallward-Driemeier, the doctors' lawyer.

Gov. Scott said Tuesday that gun ownership rights were paramount.

"I believe in the Second Amendment. I believe the citizens have a right to bear arms," the governor said. "I believe that we should be able to lead our lives without people intruding on them."

Other supporters believe it's time to rein in doctors and professional organizations they claim are hostile to guns in general.

"Gun owners can rest assured that doctors who ask them about the subject and record their answers are motivated by a good faith belief that the information is relevant to the patient's care and well-being, and not by an ideological or other non-medical agenda," the National Rifle Association said in court documents. "Their patients have an equal right to hold contrary views and to be protected from harassment."

Brady Center attorney Daniel Vice said no other state has such a broad prohibition on what physicians can say about guns.

"This isn't about the Second Amendment. It's about the First Amendment," Vice said.

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/fla-lawsuit-can-doctors-ask-patients-about-guns


Regrds,
hm
 
You know, I may be out of the mainstream here. I don't consider Doctors to be special. I don't defer to my Docs thinking they are smarter than me. They simply put extra time studying things that I didn't. They don't intimidate me. I don't let them decide which test they will do until they give me a valid reason why they believe it necessary and then at times I still say no. Too many people are reluctant to be in charge of their medical care and allow unnecessary cya tests. It's no wonder medical costs are skyrocketing.

Although no Doc has ever asked me about guns, if it happened I'd have no qualms about telling him it's simply none of his business, now carry on. People need to take control. If the Docs ego is too big to handle this, then it's time to find another.
 
While I have not been asked, the answer would be, "none of your business".

I would have my suspicions about the motivations behind such a question and apparently some physicians have refused to treat patients who refuse to answer the question. It would be a mutual dismissal as far as I would be concerned.

Apparently Fl court pretty much gutted the law, however:

http://www.courthousenews.com/2011/09/19/39889.htm


Regards,
hm
 
The problem isn't necessarily in the well intentioned Doc asking you or I about the guns in our homes, because anyone with half a brain would be inclined to tell him, it's none of his damm business, unless he is treating you for a self inflicted gunshot wound. The true problem lies in the doctors questioning the children of gun owners, without the parents' presence in the room. Well meaning children, will respect the doctor enough to tell them anything they want to hear about guns in the household. And, the problem lies there in the laws surrounding leaving a gun where a child can get hold of it.

We essentially go back there, to the Canadian gentleman who was arrested because his child drew a picture of a gun in school. If the kid says he's seen guns out around the house, exaggerates because it makes the god doctor happy, then in comes Family Services to determine how many guns are out around the house. Possibly with the law in tow, if they fear for their lives, or feel the law has been broken, simply because there are guns in the house.

The doctor has no business questioning such, period. It is not his place, unless the patient would be considered mentally unfit to own a gun.
 
Due to the tremendous rise in my medical insurance premiums (over $2000 monthly) I now go to the VA. One of my first visits was to the phsyc eval doctor who asked me several questions about my gun collection. Not wanting to lose my VA benefits I was completely honest with this lady. I explained that yes I did have a gun safe and that there were no children in my home. She also inquired to my mental state and did I ever feel suicidal. Although I felt the questions concerning my guns were none of her business I was polite and honest in my answers. Sure hope this doesn't come back and bite me in the butt. I also must say that I have never recieved better care and am treated as an honored quest.
 
The biggest problem that I see with questions of that type from oblique sources is that most medical records are now stored in a mega data base that is accessible by other doctors, insurance companies, and various federal law enforcement agencies (usually with a warrant, supposedly)....

I take the position that what I own is no one's business and those type of questions are inappropriate from a medical standpoint, unless I'm the subject of a mental evaluation...
 
Information is a valuable commodity. Personal information can be particularly valuable across a multitude of scenarios. A good policy is to attempt to collect information rather than dessiminate it. Under no circumstances would I feel it necessary to discuss any weapons I might own with any individual other than a close personal friend. I do not own any weapons.
 
Originally Posted By: TnslimDue to the tremendous rise in my medical insurance premiums (over $2000 monthly) I now go to the VA. One of my first visits was to the phsyc eval doctor who asked me several questions about my gun collection. Not wanting to lose my VA benefits I was completely honest with this lady. I explained that yes I did have a gun safe and that there were no children in my home. She also inquired to my mental state and did I ever feel suicidal. Although I felt the questions concerning my guns were none of her business I was polite and honest in my answers. Sure hope this doesn't come back and bite me in the butt. I also must say that I have never recieved better care and am treated as an honored quest.

Have been going to VA for 8 or 9 years and was never asked any questions regarding firearms ownership but the last visit they were updating and computerizing all patients files and I was asked about depression, suicidal thoughts, anger issues, PTSD etc. I figure that is a reasonable question to ask any vet, so answered all questions asked. Had they asked about firearms I'm afraid I would have declined to answer as I don't think that is relevant to my medical issues.

Edit to add: Agree that the VA care and treatment of all concerned is superb.

Regards,
hm
 
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Originally Posted By: HunterBear71Information is a valuable commodity. Personal information can be particularly valuable across a multitude of scenarios. A good policy is to attempt to collect information rather than dessiminate it. Under no circumstances would I feel it necessary to discuss any weapons I might own with any individual other than a close personal friend. I do not own any weapons.

I'm not your Doctor or close friend but if you own no weapons how do you hunt 'Predators'?
 
Originally Posted By: jumprightinitOriginally Posted By: HunterBear71Information is a valuable commodity. Personal information can be particularly valuable across a multitude of scenarios. A good policy is to attempt to collect information rather than dessiminate it. Under no circumstances would I feel it necessary to discuss any weapons I might own with any individual other than a close personal friend. I do not own any weapons.

I'm not your Doctor or close friend but if you own no weapons how do you hunt 'Predators'?

TROLL!!
 
Originally Posted By: jumprightinitOriginally Posted By: HunterBear71Information is a valuable commodity. Personal information can be particularly valuable across a multitude of scenarios. A good policy is to attempt to collect information rather than dessiminate it. Under no circumstances would I feel it necessary to discuss any weapons I might own with any individual other than a close personal friend. I do not own any weapons.

I'm not your Doctor or close friend but if you own no weapons how do you hunt 'Predators'?

Why ask that question?
 
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Quote:I'm not your Doctor or close friend but if you own no weapons how do you hunt 'Predators'?....With a Big Knife and a Sharp Stick...Didn't someone on the board develop a "Tactical Stick"...I think that's the one I copied...
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Originally Posted By: OldTurtleThe biggest problem that I see with questions of that type from oblique sources is that most medical records are now stored in a mega data base that is accessible by other doctors, insurance companies, and various federal law enforcement agencies (usually with a warrant, supposedly)....

I take the position that what I own is no one's business and those type of questions are inappropriate from a medical standpoint, unless I'm the subject of a mental evaluation...



Or, with a letter of consent... In renewal of my Concealed Carry Permit in ND, you now have to sign a consent form to allow search of your medical records, for any evidence of metal illness, if you've EVER been treated for drug or alcohol abuse, or if you've EVER had a DUI. Pretty ridiculous considering the DUI occured 23 years, but it's required.
 
Originally Posted By: HunterBear71Originally Posted By: jumprightinitOriginally Posted By: HunterBear71Information is a valuable commodity. Personal information can be particularly valuable across a multitude of scenarios. A good policy is to attempt to collect information rather than dessiminate it. Under no circumstances would I feel it necessary to discuss any weapons I might own with any individual other than a close personal friend. I do not own any weapons.

I'm not your Doctor or close friend but if you own no weapons how do you hunt 'Predators'?

Why ask that question?

Just wondering about your real interest in predator hunting.
 
He is a spy for obummer!

He does nothing other than monitor this site for people that speak their mind and he reports in daily.

A predator hunters website and he is not a hunter nor does he have any weapons! Yet! When this country goes into a dictator country he will have wished he did!!!!!


Obummer will just throw him out like yesterdays paper!!
 
Negative. Not a spy and just made a post explaining why it is better to gather information than dessiminate it. I've hunted predators since the early eighties when I was using a piece of cellophane as a call. I'm kidding about the weapons but it really isn't anyones business. I have never understood the desire to share that kind of information. The country will be just fine and none of our current political parties are interested in a dictatorship.
 
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