should you use a coon for training???

There are reasons to use coons for training a decoy dog, like to fire up the game drive in a pup and maybe to teach a pup what end has teeth and means business... other than that, the dog will learn very little that will help it with coyotes.

When I ran curs, I used them for both decoying coyotes and treeing game. They did well at both. If this is the plan, coons are valuable training aids and very worthy quarry for young dogs. They learn to strike, run and tree their own game and once they start to figure coons out, they have the foundation to go on to cats and bears.

If all you're ever going to do is decoy with your dog, coons are useless in your young dogs training (Except for teaching a young dog how to fight smart).

As far as decoy dogs NOT needing to know how to fight...? Anyone that believes that, needs to go call more coyotes in to their dogs. Sooner or later your dogs are going to get caught by coyotes that mean business. Coyotes are very territorial and when they answer your challenge howl and come on the run, they're not coming to introduce themselves and shake hands.

Some coyotes will see your dog and turn tail and run, some WILL NOT! I want my dog to be ready for a fight and that is why I bring them up the ranks learning to fight other critters.

If you take a green, year or so old pup out and run into a big, aggressive male yote... You'll wish you had gave him some preliminary bouts beforehand, with something more manageable and so will he. That's a real good way to ruin a promising young dog.

This isn't rocket science, it's common sense. It's all about exposure to game and setting them up for success. Take the right pup, raise it right and you'll be amazed at what that dog will learn to do.

Take care and happy hunting!
 
some very good insight catdawg but isnt that where a decoy dog decoys them back? nipping there a$$ aint gonna kill a dog, maybe the handler should of recalled sooner?i guess if a fella is just taking pictures,yes but if the handler is toting a firearm? i no i'm speaking out of turn but rockinbar's schnauzer has made it work for alot of coyotes.i see lots of pics of decoy dogs and there aint none of them scarred up like they have been fighting. maybe the coyotes around here are different? dont know, maybe every body see's fighting/ defending at different levels?has anyone on here that decoys coyotes ever lost one to coyotes killing them?

fight or flight...
 
Who would have thought this topic would turn into such a thought provoking, informative discussion?

PredatorMasters Rocks!
 
Thanks catdawg,you said exactly what I was trying to learn,and I agree that is what I was trying to teach the dog was how to fight smart.And as for calling the dog back sooner and it being just a decoy,well a rabbit would work just as well and I would not worry about it getting chewed up or killed.She"sam" is doing a good job being them back but not every hunt works perfect and if she gets in trouble I will set up and stop it but needs to know how to fight smart with a coon or coyote,yet know the game is bring it back to me.Again thanks catdawg.
 
Originally Posted By: CatdawgThere are reasons to use coons for training a decoy dog, like to fire up the game drive in a pup and maybe to teach a pup what end has teeth and means business... other than that, the dog will learn very little that will help it with coyotes.

When I ran curs, I used them for both decoying coyotes and treeing game. They did well at both. If this is the plan, coons are valuable training aids and very worthy quarry for young dogs. They learn to strike, run and tree their own game and once they start to figure coons out, they have the foundation to go on to cats and bears.

If all you're ever going to do is decoy with your dog, coons are useless in your young dogs training (Except for teaching a young dog how to fight smart).

As far as decoy dogs NOT needing to know how to fight...? Anyone that believes that, needs to go call more coyotes in to their dogs. Sooner or later your dogs are going to get caught by coyotes that mean business. Coyotes are very territorial and when they answer your challenge howl and come on the run, they're not coming to introduce themselves and shake hands.

Some coyotes will see your dog and turn tail and run, some WILL NOT! I want my dog to be ready for a fight and that is why I bring them up the ranks learning to fight other critters.

If you take a green, year or so old pup out and run into a big, aggressive male yote... You'll wish you had gave him some preliminary bouts beforehand, with something more manageable and so will he. That's a real good way to ruin a promising young dog.

This isn't rocket science, it's common sense. It's all about exposure to game and setting them up for success. Take the right pup, raise it right and you'll be amazed at what that dog will learn to do.

Take care and happy hunting!

Thank you !! Is it really that hard to imagine ? Jesus...some of this has made me feel like I was explaining ice to a Pygmy.
 
Originally Posted By: emeraldterriers1some very good insight catdawg but isnt that where a decoy dog decoys them back? nipping there a$$ aint gonna kill a dog, maybe the handler should of recalled sooner?i guess if a fella is just taking pictures,yes but if the handler is toting a firearm? i no i'm speaking out of turn but rockinbar's schnauzer has made it work for alot of coyotes.i see lots of pics of decoy dogs and there aint none of them scarred up like they have been fighting. maybe the coyotes around here are different? dont know, maybe every body see's fighting/ defending at different levels?has anyone on here that decoys coyotes ever lost one to coyotes killing them?

fight or flight...

You don't run decoy dogs.....so why do you continue to act as though you know coyote behavior with regards to decoy dogs ? Starting to piss me off.
 
Hate to see folks get upset. I feel like the process here has yielded some really good discussion which brought out some well articulated info. Sure was valuable to me. Isn't that what this is all about?
 
Originally Posted By: DoubleCKHate to see folks get upset. I feel like the process here has yielded some really good discussion which brought out some well articulated info. Sure was valuable to me. Isn't that what this is all about?

That's exactly what it's all about....however, you have one guy who has said he doesn't hunt this way give an opinion on how these dogs should be trained and how coyotes should react to them. Even though he doesn't use 'em,


Be like me telling him how to dig terriers.
 
You know how some dogs hate to turn loose after they get ahold.

I love that about Terriers ....... and their owners.
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Originally Posted By: DoubleCKYou know how some dogs hate to turn loose after they get ahold.

I love that about Terriers ....... and their owners.
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HAHAHAHAHAHA !!! It's true ! And it's no different in the British Isles either.
 
Besides that I was born in Kansas. Everyone knows that the nicest people you will ever meet are from Kansas.
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I expect that goes for Terriers also.
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And as a former Husker...well I would Sooner be a Husker.
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Originally Posted By: Aaron_ProffittOriginally Posted By: emeraldterriers1some very good insight catdawg but isnt that where a decoy dog decoys them back? nipping there a$$ aint gonna kill a dog, maybe the handler should of recalled sooner?i guess if a fella is just taking pictures,yes but if the handler is toting a firearm? i no i'm speaking out of turn but rockinbar's schnauzer has made it work for alot of coyotes.i see lots of pics of decoy dogs and there aint none of them scarred up like they have been fighting. maybe the coyotes around here are different? dont know, maybe every body see's fighting/ defending at different levels?has anyone on here that decoys coyotes ever lost one to coyotes killing them?

fight or flight...

You don't run decoy dogs.....so why do you continue to act as though you know coyote behavior with regards to decoy dogs ? Starting to piss me off.

aaron proffit, dont be mad
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do you hunt your dogs? do you decoy coyotes? i have a airedale but dont have a good enough handle on her to bring her back
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is it because she is to "gamey" maybe? or maybe she justs turns a deaf ear, but i can promise you this she will fight and i didnt have to teach her $hit.lol can she kill a coyote that is uninjured? nope i dont believe so,can she track/trail a coyote wounded or not ? you bet she can.i have ran her like a trail hound many times pushing creek bottoms and moving several coyotes (up to 5) and she does this alone
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never had one or two whip her. maybe i'm just lucky? dont know. one thing to remember... its better to be pissed off than to be pissed on
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Originally Posted By: emeraldterriers1i have ran her like a trail hound many times pushing creek bottoms and moving several coyotes

Cool! Do you post shooters up the creek? Sounds like fun.

Tell us how that works.
 


aaron proffit, dont be mad
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do you hunt your dogs? do you decoy coyotes? i have a airedale but dont have a good enough handle on her to bring her back
cursing.gif
is it because she is to "gamey" maybe? or maybe she justs turns a deaf ear, but i can promise you this she will fight and i didnt have to teach her $hit.lol can she kill a coyote that is uninjured? nope i dont believe so,can she track/trail a coyote wounded or not ? you bet she can.i have ran her like a trail hound many times pushing creek bottoms and moving several coyotes (up to 5) and she does this alone
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never had one or two whip her. maybe i'm just lucky? dont know. one thing to remember... its better to be pissed off than to be pissed on
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[/quote]

Sounds to me that your dale is not hunting for you to me! Man I must have really screwed my dogs up. We hunt what ever arises at the time. But we have a great time.
 
ET- The only person talking about a decoy dog killing a Coyote, is you pal.

Usually a "Decoy Dog" has a handler with a gun (Or a couple Stags... huh UHD?) along to do the killing. You have made it very clear you don't do any decoying by some of the things you have said and the interpretations you have made.

If you can't see the obvious need/benefit of having a dog that knows how to defend itself when decoying coyotes, then you really have no clue how this game is played.

I will agree with you that if a coyote gets put in a position where it's life is on the line, it will seek a way out! I am in no way talking about that scenario when I say a decoy dog needs to be able to fight to protect itself.

I was more thinking about the scenario where a big, dominant male coyote comes hauling in to your challenge howl, on a dead run and ole "Fido" is sitting there licking his nuts... He's about to get in a fight and it just might help if he knows how!

Take care.
 
where have you seen me make a post about a decoy dog killing a coyote??? you have me mixed up with someone else,pal. iv'e seen lots of pics on here but they sure aint killin coyotes they are DECOYING them. catdawg, have you had a big, dominate male come hauling in and just bowl your decoy dog over? did he stay on top of your dog and soundly whoop him? i would love to see the coyote that could /would try this on our airedale or duanes@ssu catahoula's,or one jesses hounds... like i said before we must have a different coyote here... smart ones.

decoy dog sitting there licking its nuts. maybe that one needs ate.lol
all joking aside
i agree with you 100% about a young dog not getting it handed to him
 
Originally Posted By: Dustballs

aaron proffit, dont be mad
rolleyes.gif
do you hunt your dogs? do you decoy coyotes? i have a airedale but dont have a good enough handle on her to bring her back
cursing.gif
is it because she is to "gamey" maybe? or maybe she justs turns a deaf ear, but i can promise you this she will fight and i didnt have to teach her $hit.lol can she kill a coyote that is uninjured? nope i dont believe so,can she track/trail a coyote wounded or not ? you bet she can.i have ran her like a trail hound many times pushing creek bottoms and moving several coyotes (up to 5) and she does this alone
thumbup1.gif
never had one or two whip her. maybe i'm just lucky? dont know. one thing to remember... its better to be pissed off than to be pissed on
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Sounds to me that your dale is not hunting for you to me! Man I must have really screwed my dogs up. We hunt what ever arises at the time. But we have a great time. [/quote]

that my freind has alot to do with being a terrier and not a cur... naw i bet your dogs suits you fine other wise you wouldn't keep them. same here too, have worked coons,coyotes badgers,bobcats,if the critter lives here we have tried it.last but not least thats the most important have a good time.
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Originally Posted By: DoubleCKOriginally Posted By: emeraldterriers1i have ran her like a trail hound many times pushing creek bottoms and moving several coyotes

Cool! Do you post shooters up the creek? Sounds like fun.

Tell us how that works.

yep have posted shooters or sent the stags when they pop out. my favorite place is a dry creek bottom(really dry this yr) that covers 2 sections. we start the airedale on the south end of the creek we move a 1/2 mile west into a hay field and kind of follow/border her as she moves up the drainage.any coyotes that squirt out on this side the stags get the call. the north end usually a shotgunner waits and takes any thing that goes all the way through. this is usually a late winter stand as most break for open ground till then. the east side we let go its open wheat fields,but we get after'm as soon as they get across them. its just a game rich spot, we have taken lots of coyotes several bobcats,coons in this place lots of fun and action.
 
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