Thoughts on this pattern?

DKG

New member
Patterned one of my handloads today. The load uses Federal GM hulls, 27.2 grns Longshot and 1.5 oz of lead BBB shot with the data claiming 1205 fps. The target is on 22x28 poster board with a 10.25" circle and a piece of tape as the aim point.
Shot was about 45 yards with my 26" barreled mossberg 930 equipped with the bead sight and a Carlson's Coyote choke. I did pull the shot to the right hence the deviation and some pellets hit low resulting in the dirt on the target. over all, 44 of the 65 pellets were on paper.
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HUMMM
11 pellets in the kill zone? How many to start with?
I like to get 40% ( 18 to 20) in the zone.
Is this for coyotes?
It would work, a BBB is just smaller than Lead F.
In my 3" loads of F, I have about 47 pellets.
I use steel powder and a .669 choke, 32" 870, At 70 yards I get very close to 50% in a 10 paper plate.
 
There are 65 pellets in the load and yes, these are for up to coyote. Honestly I'm not sure on the choke, from what I have read the carlson coyote is pretty tight and I may try backing the choke off a bit since I have .670 and .680 as well as the factory full .700. I honestly hunt pretty thick stuff where shots aren't much over 30-40 yards so if I can get it to pattern decent at 40 that would be ideal.
 
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I don't really trust lead BB to break down a going away coyote past 35-40 yards. Those hard going away angles require a lot of penetration and bone breaking.
 
If you can keep your shots at 40 yards and under I think your lead BBB load with 65 pellets per shell will work great on coyotes. I would rather shoot your load of 65 BBB pellets than shoot number 4 Buckshot load with 41 pellets.

Try some other chokes to see how they pattern at 40 yards.

Look below at how lead BBB shot compares to lead BB shot for penetration from KPY Shotshell Ballistics.

1200 fps lead BB shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 40.8 yards.
1200 fps lead BBB shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 50.2 yards.
1200 fps lead T shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 59.7 yards.


Each lead BB pellet weighs about 8.52 gr, each lead BBB pellet weighs about 10.03 gr and each lead T shot pellet weighs about 11.69 gr.

Lead T shot is another good size for shooting coyotes but you would have only about 54 to 56 pellets per shell with 1-1/2 oz loads.

When I could use lead shot on coyotes I really liked the lead BBB and lead T shot.
 
Originally Posted By: derbyacresbobIf you can keep your shots at 40 yards and under I think your lead BBB load with 65 pellets per shell will work great on coyotes. I would rather shoot your load of 65 BBB pellets than shoot number 4 Buckshot load with 41 pellets.

Try some other chokes to see how they pattern at 40 yards.

Look below at how lead BBB shot compares to lead BB shot for penetration from KPY Shotshell Ballistics.

1200 fps lead BB shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 40.8 yards.
1200 fps lead BBB shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 50.2 yards.
1200 fps lead T shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 59.7 yards.


Each lead BB pellet weighs about 8.52 gr, each lead BBB pellet weighs about 10.03 gr and each lead T shot pellet weighs about 11.69 gr.

Lead T shot is another good size for shooting coyotes but you would have only about 54 to 56 pellets per shell with 1-1/2 oz loads.

When I could use lead shot on coyotes I really liked the lead BBB and lead T shot.

Thanks Bob. I am enjoying loading my own, just need to get the pattern down.
 
That's not a terrible 45 yard pattern for a load nearing it's limit at that distance. Flashes through the timber or brush at 25 yards aren't best served by turkey tight patterns, not for me anyway.

Room for experimenting further there, for sure. But that pattern ain't too bad for running coyote, considering the effective range of the load. At least you are doing the work, so you know, and aren't guessing.

Trying to post your pic here, but I don't know if it's going to work...

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- DAA
 
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Loading bad a$$ shotgun shells is way more fun than loading target loads! I killed a bunch of coyotes with those 2-3/4" Federal Gold Medal hulls!
 
Originally Posted By: DAAThat's not a terrible 45 yard pattern for a load nearing it's limit at that distance. Flashes through the timber or brush at 25 yards aren't best served by turkey tight patterns, not for me anyway.

Room for experimenting further there, for sure. But that pattern ain't too bad for running coyote, considering the effective range of the load. At least you are doing the work, so you know, and aren't guessing.

Trying to post your pic here, but I don't know if it's going to work...

url]


- DAA

Thunderstorms in the forecast for the next few days, but after that I will get out with other chokes and pattern them.
 
Originally Posted By: DAAFlashes through the timber or brush at 25 yards aren't best served by turkey tight patterns, not for me anyway.
- DAA

I total agree with this. A few years ago I used a really tight choke for hunting coyotes so I had a good pattern at 50 yards. I switched to a wider pattern after having to take multiple shots at coyotes that were initially shotgunned at 10-20 yards. My aiming wasn't always good enough to instantly drop a close range moving coyote with my shotgun. I finally accepted I wasn't as good of a shot as I thought I was. The wider pattern helps make up for my shooting being slightly off on snap shots on close range moving coyotes.

It was nice to have a shotgun setup for longer shots but would rather have a shotgun I can be lethal with at 15 yards 99% of the time on the first shot. You may be happy with a really tight pattern if you are hunting more open country or an excellent shot with your shotgun. If you are making stands where you regularly shoot coyotes at 20 yards or less, you may want to consider a wider pattern.
 
What is the actual difference in inches between your wider pattern and your tight pattern at 15 yards? If you miss a coyote at 15 yards with your shotgun it isn't the choke at fault. Choke selection at 15 yards make for differences of inches. Shooter error is made in measures of feet.
 
Originally Posted By: GCWhat is the actual difference in inches between your wider pattern and your tight pattern at 15 yards? If you miss a coyote at 15 yards with your shotgun it isn't the choke at fault. Choke selection at 15 yards make for differences of inches. Shooter error is made in measures of feet.

I totally agree that my poor shooting resulted in missing those close shots and it wasn't the chokes fault.

I don't have any exact measurements available for 15 yards and I would be just going off memory from tests from a few years ago. I was using Hevi shot dead coyote and my testing involved patterning only 10 shots and I didn't check the pattern closer than 20 yards. It can get very expensive to extensively test shotgun loads. I do think opening up the pattern even a couple inches at 15 yards could make the difference in a dead coyote at close range and a "spinner". It is just a personal preference for a wider pattern at 15 yards to give up a tighter group at 50 yards. It may not be what others want but I have found it more effective for me.

I didn't have any coyotes under 30 yards last year with a shotgun that required more than one shot. Last year I did have a couple shotgunned coyotes around 45 yards that required more than one shot and maybe with a tighter pattern they would have been dead with the first shot. It was probably 4 years ago but I had a handful coyotes that I attempted to shotgun at close range that required more than one shot. I'll admit that if my aiming had been better, none of them would have required more than one shot. I just learned that under "field conditions" while calling, a close range coyote with a shotgun wasn't near as easy as I thought it was.

If someone wants to shoot a really tight pattern to extend their shotgun range, they may find that works well for them. For me, I'll stick with shotgunning coyotes at closer ranges and using my rifle for coyotes at 50+ yards. I have one exception to that in an area that is shotgun only that I may hunt this winter so I may attempt some longer range shotgun loads.
 
Originally Posted By: derbyacresbobLoading bad a$$ shotgun shells is way more fun than loading target loads! I killed a bunch of coyotes with those 2-3/4" Federal Gold Medal hulls!

It's been fun so far. Thank you for answering my questions for me!
 
Originally Posted By: BrianIDOriginally Posted By: GCWhat is the actual difference in inches between your wider pattern and your tight pattern at 15 yards? If you miss a coyote at 15 yards with your shotgun it isn't the choke at fault. Choke selection at 15 yards make for differences of inches. Shooter error is made in measures of feet.

I totally agree that my poor shooting resulted in missing those close shots and it wasn't the chokes fault.

I don't have any exact measurements available for 15 yards and I would be just going off memory from tests from a few years ago. I was using Hevi shot dead coyote and my testing involved patterning only 10 shots and I didn't check the pattern closer than 20 yards. It can get very expensive to extensively test shotgun loads. I do think opening up the pattern even a couple inches at 15 yards could make the difference in a dead coyote at close range and a "spinner". It is just a personal preference for a wider pattern at 15 yards to give up a tighter group at 50 yards. It may not be what others want but I have found it more effective for me.

I didn't have any coyotes under 30 yards last year with a shotgun that required more than one shot. Last year I did have a couple shotgunned coyotes around 45 yards that required more than one shot and maybe with a tighter pattern they would have been dead with the first shot. It was probably 4 years ago but I had a handful coyotes that I attempted to shotgun at close range that required more than one shot. I'll admit that if my aiming had been better, none of them would have required more than one shot. I just learned that under "field conditions" while calling, a close range coyote with a shotgun wasn't near as easy as I thought it was.

If someone wants to shoot a really tight pattern to extend their shotgun range, they may find that works well for them. For me, I'll stick with shotgunning coyotes at closer ranges and using my rifle for coyotes at 50+ yards. I have one exception to that in an area that is shotgun only that I may hunt this winter so I may attempt some longer range shotgun loads.

Once I get more shells loaded up I will be doing more extensive testing. I just had a few loaded up and was emptying out the rest of the box of factory GM loads to load up. Once the thunderstorms around here are gone I will be at the range.
 
Interested in your choice of Longshot. I had been using it for some coyote loads in BB [16ga]but started reading about powder migration and regulated it to target loads. Don't know if that is fact or just a rumor, maybe I read too much during lockdown.
 
Originally Posted By: masshunterInterested in your choice of Longshot. I had been using it for some coyote loads in BB [16ga]but started reading about powder migration and regulated it to target loads. Don't know if that is fact or just a rumor, maybe I read too much during lockdown.

In all honesty, I am pretty new to reloading. I knew I wanted a heavy (1 3/8 or 1.5oz) load for predators. I found that longshot was what was available locally and decided to look into using it. It (Longshot) came recommended from some people on forums and some people I know who reload, they also recommended Blue Dot, but being in Central NY our winters can get cold and have heard that BD doesn't work well in the cold. That may not be true thought.
 
"they also recommended Blue Dot, but being in Central NY our winters can get cold and have heard that BD doesn't work well in the cold. That may not be true thought."


I use blue dot for heavy lead loads in the winter up here to -30* never thought it had a problem...
 
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Originally Posted By: jetman"they also recommended Blue Dot, but being in Central NY our winters can get cold and have heard that BD doesn't work well in the cold. That may not be true thought."


I use blue dot for heavy lead loads in the winter up here to -30* never thought it had a problem...

Good to know! I may pick some up.
 
I use to shoot a lot of Blue Dot and the only problem I had with it in cold weather was with my 10 ga. It was a 1-5/8 oz lead load with 50 gr of Blue Dot. It was a very fast low pressure load.

My 12 ga Blue Dot loads were all pretty high on pressure and I never had any problems with them in cold weather.
 
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