Anton Chigurh
Member
I’ve thought these looked good for a while now, tempting but I always talk myself out ordering one.
Just ordered a g2 243
- Thread starter 204 AR
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yotehunter243
New member
Originally Posted By: P&YGreat review and thanks! I'm not surprised, you probably just cost me $1,200 haha. Good luck going forward, love to know what you get for speeds. It would give me a ballpark on what to expect out of the 58 gr superformance and 70 gr dogtown factory stuff.
I'm running factory Dogtown 70s in my 20" AR10 and they averaged 3400 on the nose across my magnetoo
I'm running factory Dogtown 70s in my 20" AR10 and they averaged 3400 on the nose across my magnetoo
204 AR
Well-known member
I got some crony numbers and targets this morning, now the wind is up so I'm calling it. The targets are probably the best 100 yd preliminary trial targets I've ever shot with a new ar. I didn't even mess with seating depth, just picked a length at random that chambered good.
I had 2 loads from way back, first some 58 vmax over 43.5 gr varget. 3 over the crony averaged 3517 fps, 2 touching the third 1/2" high. There's some room to go up on this load per the book and that might take out the vertical.
The other was 105 amax, loaded too long for the mag, over 43 gr h4831. A slow 2650 or so, and about an inch triangle group. Maybe a hair under, haven't measured yet.
Moved on to loading some 87 vmax, h4350 1 grain under hornady's max was 2 touching and 1 called pull that was 1/2" left. This would have been nearly 1 hole group. 2946 average.
I worked up to over hornady's max but under hodgdon's max at 44 gr, for 3013 fps. The wind was starting to give me some horizontal, but still no groups over an inch.
I loaded 2 groups of varget under the 87's, these were also nearly cloverleaf groups, but max got me only 2881 fps.
So, the good and the "bad", I think this rifle is really going to be accurate with whatever I decide to shoot. There were no malfunctions, it does ding the case shoulder a bit where it hits the deflector. No swipes with any load shooting suppressed.
Speeds so far are 200 fps slower than my 22" 243 wssm. Part is barrel length, part is the pressure difference, the wssm operates quite a bit higher and my load is maxed+, that's where it shoots. Compared to the Hdy manual, my speeds are 100 fps slower than their test 24" barrel with 87's, so that's about right on. About 200 fps slower than book with 58's. Compared to a 22" 243lbc, the dpms is 100 to 120 fps faster with what I've tried.
I'm pretty sure 3600, 3650 is doable with the 58's and varget, maybe 8208 would work also or h4895. With 87's 3k might be about all it does. However, 87's at 3k would be a little more fur friendly and still thump any coyote good. With the Eliminator, flatness of trajectory doesn't matter much. I would be interested what factory dogtowns and superformance would do also. For the price of those dogtowns, if they shot well, I might not reload for it either lol.
I had 2 loads from way back, first some 58 vmax over 43.5 gr varget. 3 over the crony averaged 3517 fps, 2 touching the third 1/2" high. There's some room to go up on this load per the book and that might take out the vertical.
The other was 105 amax, loaded too long for the mag, over 43 gr h4831. A slow 2650 or so, and about an inch triangle group. Maybe a hair under, haven't measured yet.
Moved on to loading some 87 vmax, h4350 1 grain under hornady's max was 2 touching and 1 called pull that was 1/2" left. This would have been nearly 1 hole group. 2946 average.
I worked up to over hornady's max but under hodgdon's max at 44 gr, for 3013 fps. The wind was starting to give me some horizontal, but still no groups over an inch.
I loaded 2 groups of varget under the 87's, these were also nearly cloverleaf groups, but max got me only 2881 fps.
So, the good and the "bad", I think this rifle is really going to be accurate with whatever I decide to shoot. There were no malfunctions, it does ding the case shoulder a bit where it hits the deflector. No swipes with any load shooting suppressed.
Speeds so far are 200 fps slower than my 22" 243 wssm. Part is barrel length, part is the pressure difference, the wssm operates quite a bit higher and my load is maxed+, that's where it shoots. Compared to the Hdy manual, my speeds are 100 fps slower than their test 24" barrel with 87's, so that's about right on. About 200 fps slower than book with 58's. Compared to a 22" 243lbc, the dpms is 100 to 120 fps faster with what I've tried.
I'm pretty sure 3600, 3650 is doable with the 58's and varget, maybe 8208 would work also or h4895. With 87's 3k might be about all it does. However, 87's at 3k would be a little more fur friendly and still thump any coyote good. With the Eliminator, flatness of trajectory doesn't matter much. I would be interested what factory dogtowns and superformance would do also. For the price of those dogtowns, if they shot well, I might not reload for it either lol.
yotehunter243
New member
Your making me want one even more. Onnmy 4th case of Dogtown I had major issues. Blowing primers every shot and they were falling into my trigger group causing major issues hunting. Quick call to Nosler and they told me to send my remaining cartidges in to exchange. Hopefully it was just a bad LOT because I've killed a truck load of coyotes with those.
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P&Y
Member
Originally Posted By: yotehunter243 Originally Posted By: P&YGreat review and thanks! I'm not surprised, you probably just cost me $1,200 haha. Good luck going forward, love to know what you get for speeds. It would give me a ballpark on what to expect out of the 58 gr superformance and 70 gr dogtown factory stuff.
I'm running factory Dogtown 70s in my 20" AR10 and they averaged 3400 on the nose across my magnetoo
Awesome, appreciate that.
I'm running factory Dogtown 70s in my 20" AR10 and they averaged 3400 on the nose across my magnetoo
Awesome, appreciate that.
204 AR
Well-known member
Blowing primers, yikes. Glad they took care of it. Reading the dogtown reviews, it looks like they have some brass sizing issues sometimes also.
I would suggest that anyone who is on the fence, better be finding one asap, as they are drying up fast. At least the 20" are, the 16" is still easy to find. Knowing how slow the 20 is, I dang sure wouldn't go any shorter. But if that's all there was I'd still order it and a new 20" barrel and handguard and do it while I could. Neat gun for sure.
I'm sure there's more speed available with some of the newer powders. But it does make you appreciate how efficient those small wildcats like the 6x6.8 and 243 lbc are. They get you pretty close with 10 grains less powder.
Top target is 100 yds, bottom is 200. Dots are 1", the 4 shot group at 200 measured 1.25". Not bad for the conditions imo.
I would suggest that anyone who is on the fence, better be finding one asap, as they are drying up fast. At least the 20" are, the 16" is still easy to find. Knowing how slow the 20 is, I dang sure wouldn't go any shorter. But if that's all there was I'd still order it and a new 20" barrel and handguard and do it while I could. Neat gun for sure.
I'm sure there's more speed available with some of the newer powders. But it does make you appreciate how efficient those small wildcats like the 6x6.8 and 243 lbc are. They get you pretty close with 10 grains less powder.
Top target is 100 yds, bottom is 200. Dots are 1", the 4 shot group at 200 measured 1.25". Not bad for the conditions imo.
I got mine out yesterday afternoon as well. Ran some standard federal 100gr just to get things zeroed in, shot well at 1"/100yds
Tried out some 55gr and 70gr nosler BT loads of my own and both shot under an inch with varget. I will agree this rifle seems pretty tolerant to various loads. The weight is so marginal over my AR15's that I think this will be my standard hunting rifle from here on out.
I replaced the trigger with a RR varmint 2stage, the pull was a bit less and just seemed a little smoother.
Hard to believe these guns did not have more support, think it is going to be a good one.
Tried out some 55gr and 70gr nosler BT loads of my own and both shot under an inch with varget. I will agree this rifle seems pretty tolerant to various loads. The weight is so marginal over my AR15's that I think this will be my standard hunting rifle from here on out.
I replaced the trigger with a RR varmint 2stage, the pull was a bit less and just seemed a little smoother.
Hard to believe these guns did not have more support, think it is going to be a good one.
204 AR
Well-known member
Z custom, what did you do with the old trigger? Mine breaks at just under 5lb, but I know how to lighten that second stage by working over the disconnector spring.
Anyway, suppressed it is way overgassed so last night decided to take care of that by drilling and tapping the gas block for a set screw, making it adjustable. Today I got home early enough to get it tuned in and shoot a few groups over the crony also. It looks like 42.5 gr rl17 will be the winner with the 87 vmax, speeds were consistent at 3080-3090. My phone app didn't work today with the crony so I don't have the actual average but I'm going to figure 3085. Groups were improved if anything, I've always noticed that turning the gas down to minimum helped accuracy and it seems true here also. Here's a target:
Bottom groups are my 30 RAR. I shot my small 2.5" steel target at 200, giving me a lot of confidence this is going to be a winner.
I also got a couple new barrels this week from cdnn, I just couldn't pass up that deal for $80 each, they were down to 40 left and I'd have been pretty bummed if I'd have missed the boat.
Anyway, suppressed it is way overgassed so last night decided to take care of that by drilling and tapping the gas block for a set screw, making it adjustable. Today I got home early enough to get it tuned in and shoot a few groups over the crony also. It looks like 42.5 gr rl17 will be the winner with the 87 vmax, speeds were consistent at 3080-3090. My phone app didn't work today with the crony so I don't have the actual average but I'm going to figure 3085. Groups were improved if anything, I've always noticed that turning the gas down to minimum helped accuracy and it seems true here also. Here's a target:
Bottom groups are my 30 RAR. I shot my small 2.5" steel target at 200, giving me a lot of confidence this is going to be a winner.
I also got a couple new barrels this week from cdnn, I just couldn't pass up that deal for $80 each, they were down to 40 left and I'd have been pretty bummed if I'd have missed the boat.
Varminterror
New member
Originally Posted By: CoyotesilencerDPMS and Bushmaster are OOB and no more Remington branded AR's. Freedom Group/ Cerberus is done with them, I heard Tapco also and maybe AAC on the chopping block.
Cerberus divested Freedom Group a couple of years ago, and Freedom Group was dissolved into Remington Outdoor Company, held in majority part by JP Morgan.
Remington stopped making their AR’s and DPMS stopped making GII’s a couple of years ago already also. The Bushmaster, DPMS, Tapco, and Stormlake Barrels closed this winter as part of their “refocusing of energy,” or rather their none-too-subtle retreat from future liabilities assumed under the SCOTUS ruling that their brands had improperly advertised AR’s to underage children. No way around that - the brands would be held liable for any future use of their weapons in crimes committed by minors, such they shuttered the businesses, and the assets are simply held, following the bankruptcy declaration, by the investment firms which seized the assets when the bankruptcy was declared. Cerberus had tried for 5 years to divest the company/companies at value, themselves a “property flipper” firm, but failed to do so. Rather than assuming damages, cutting ties through bankruptcy absolved them to depart with the brands.
Where Remington goes from here will be interesting. But in the context of a GII, I wouldn’t be jumping out to buy one today, as there simply isn’t a great market for repair/replacement/upgrade components, and no means for DPMS to support warranty work.
Cerberus divested Freedom Group a couple of years ago, and Freedom Group was dissolved into Remington Outdoor Company, held in majority part by JP Morgan.
Remington stopped making their AR’s and DPMS stopped making GII’s a couple of years ago already also. The Bushmaster, DPMS, Tapco, and Stormlake Barrels closed this winter as part of their “refocusing of energy,” or rather their none-too-subtle retreat from future liabilities assumed under the SCOTUS ruling that their brands had improperly advertised AR’s to underage children. No way around that - the brands would be held liable for any future use of their weapons in crimes committed by minors, such they shuttered the businesses, and the assets are simply held, following the bankruptcy declaration, by the investment firms which seized the assets when the bankruptcy was declared. Cerberus had tried for 5 years to divest the company/companies at value, themselves a “property flipper” firm, but failed to do so. Rather than assuming damages, cutting ties through bankruptcy absolved them to depart with the brands.
Where Remington goes from here will be interesting. But in the context of a GII, I wouldn’t be jumping out to buy one today, as there simply isn’t a great market for repair/replacement/upgrade components, and no means for DPMS to support warranty work.
204 AR
Well-known member
Originally Posted By: Varminterror
But in the context of a GII, I wouldn’t be jumping out to buy one today, as there simply isn’t a great market for repair/replacement/upgrade components, and no means for DPMS to support warranty work.
True, there isn't much aftermarket, but I don't really need to modify anything to make it pretty much what I would have built. The repair issue could be an issue for sure, if the bolt or carrier breaks I'm sol. I will pick up another extractor while they're available, even though these are supposedly "unbreakable".
This isn't my only DPMS orphan either. I am the proud owner of a 300 Saum for which no parts are available, and a 30 Rem AR, which also takes special parts that aren't available. I guess I know the risk, and am not too worried about it.
But in the context of a GII, I wouldn’t be jumping out to buy one today, as there simply isn’t a great market for repair/replacement/upgrade components, and no means for DPMS to support warranty work.
True, there isn't much aftermarket, but I don't really need to modify anything to make it pretty much what I would have built. The repair issue could be an issue for sure, if the bolt or carrier breaks I'm sol. I will pick up another extractor while they're available, even though these are supposedly "unbreakable".
This isn't my only DPMS orphan either. I am the proud owner of a 300 Saum for which no parts are available, and a 30 Rem AR, which also takes special parts that aren't available. I guess I know the risk, and am not too worried about it.
I have a box full of triggers, I get used to a certain trigger and nothing else seems to work for me. The stock trigger was pretty good, I was switching back and forth between the G2 and one of my RRA guns and the trigger just wasn't the same. The varmint 2stage breaks just a little lighter and is definitely smoother.
What do you do to the spring to lighten it up?
What do you do to the spring to lighten it up?
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Varminterror
New member
Drill out or file the peened head of the disconnector pin. Replace the disconnector spring with a reduced power spring. Stake in a new pin.
204 AR
Well-known member
Originally Posted By: VarminterrorDrill out or file the peened head of the disconnector pin. Replace the disconnector spring with a reduced power spring. Stake in a new pin.
Bingo. I've also clipped a coil off the existing spring with good success. I never found any new pins either so I just jb welded the head of the old pin to keep it in place. Has worked for years.
Bingo. I've also clipped a coil off the existing spring with good success. I never found any new pins either so I just jb welded the head of the old pin to keep it in place. Has worked for years.
204 AR
Well-known member
So it's been awhile since I updated this thread, and honestly it's been a love/hate relationship with this rifle. My initial load with r17 fell apart at longer ranges, and that powder was so sooty that poi shifted as the barrel fouled. In the end, I ended up trying many different powders with the 87 vmax and nothing got me what I was after, so I changed barrels out. The second one liked the vmax no better, at least not consistently, so I started digging through the cabinet and I think I found paydirt with the 87 grain hpbt hornady and h4350. Running a modest 3k fps, all of my test groups were under an inch at 200 yards while fighting a 5 mph breeze. By far the most consistency I've seen.
I only had about 25 of those bullets though so further testing will have to wait.
The float tube and barrel nut came off easily, although the aluminum barrel nut is pretty fragile where the wrench engages it. It isn't one that will be able to be changed an infinite number of times imo.
I only had about 25 of those bullets though so further testing will have to wait.
The float tube and barrel nut came off easily, although the aluminum barrel nut is pretty fragile where the wrench engages it. It isn't one that will be able to be changed an infinite number of times imo.
P&Y
Member
Picking mine up from the FFL tomorrow after work! Got a lightly used one (supposedly under 200 rounds). Seller said it likes 58 grain vmaxs and he already put an adjustable gas block on it which helped sealed the deal. I've wanted one for some time and them getting discontinued helped me commit.
Got a nice UTG handguard, prs stock and Timney waiting.
I'll add some impressions after some tinkering and trigger time fwiw.
Got a nice UTG handguard, prs stock and Timney waiting.
I'll add some impressions after some tinkering and trigger time fwiw.