Is the 204 becoming obsolete?

I have done zero experimenting with my 700. I dialed it in at 35 with Hornady 40 VMAX factory ammo and never went any further. I've shot several coyotes with it from 50 yards on out past 300 and not only never seen an exit hole, but it's tough to even find the entry hole. They act like they've been fed a live grenade on impact most of the time. I bought it because I was blowing up coyotes, and especially cats really bad and ruining them with the 22-250s. Two neighbors had killed a few cats with theirs, and showed me the lack of an exit hole at close range, so I bought one and never looked back. I never have shot a cat with this rifle yet. Dear .204 Montana, come out from amongst the woodwork!
 
This Cat was taken at just over 225yds. with a 37gr. CRT bullet. No exit and a very small entrance.



If it was me I would buy a Kimber Montana in 223 and rebarrel with a Lilja Kimber contour barrel. I'm betting it would be cheaper than finding a Kimber Montana in 204
 
Last edited:
Thanks for posting the pic, and for the advice. I'm thinking the same thing on rebarreling simply to get the faster twist, but I've got to find one first. I'm actually an FFL dealer, but small time into Ruger revolvers mostly, and never dealt with Kimber. A friend of a friend had one NIB years back he was going to sell me, but got to thinking about it and just couldn't stand to let it go. Do you know how many years, and about what years the .223 and the .204 were in Kimber's lineup? I've been out of the rifle loop quite awhile. Also, what's the best twist to go with to rebarrel the .223?

Also, I don't know much about the 17 Remington other than it's a necked down .223. What bullets do you run in the Montana you rebarreled to 17, and what do you use it for versus the .204?
 
Last edited:
I love my 204 AR! Very accurate and I got it instead of a 20 practical for commercial ammo if I ran out of reloads. Very impressive on prairie dogs.
I want a bolt gun so I went to a “sale” (not!) at a local sporting goods store. With this thread in mind I asked if they had any 204s and the guy said he hadn’t seen one in a long time! Rather surprising to me as I think it is an awesome round.
I plan to find a used model 7 223 bolt face and build one.
 
Wannemacher Gun Shows coming up in April in Tulsa. If theres one to be had, it will probably be there. I see your in Kansas. Maybe not to far a drive for you.
 
Not terrible far, and less than an hour from Dad's shop where I do part of my revolver work in Bartlesville. If I don't have one by then I'll likely go see what I can see, but I hate dealing with that crowd. I want to be able to scan tables at the speed of light, but it's tough to even move in there by mid morning.
 
Originally Posted By: gunsbam45Thanks for posting the pic, and for the advice. I'm thinking the same thing on rebarreling simply to get the faster twist, but I've got to find one first. I'm actually an FFL dealer, but small time into Ruger revolvers mostly, and never dealt with Kimber. A friend of a friend had one NIB years back he was going to sell me, but got to thinking about it and just couldn't stand to let it go. Do you know how many years, and about what years the .223 and the .204 were in Kimber's lineup? I've been out of the rifle loop quite awhile. Also, what's the best twist to go with to rebarrel the .223?

Also, I don't know much about the 17 Remington other than it's a necked down .223. What bullets do you run in the Montana you rebarreled to 17, and what do you use it for versus the .204?

I'm not sure what twist to use for a 204, but bullet weight and contour would determine it.
I've gotten along well with the standard 12T, but I don't shoot 40gr. VMax bullets which I hear don't stabilize well in some 12T barrels.
The 17 Rem. is not really a necked down 223, but you can neck a 223 down and have a 17-223. The 17 neck is much longer than a 223 and 223 brass is 1.750 to 1.760 while the 17 Rem is 1.796.
I run the 25gr. Nagel pretty exclusively in mine, but in the past ran the 25gr. Berger Match Varmint that Berger no longer makes. I also have a 30gr. load with both a Nagel bullet and a Blackhole bullet. When Genco bullet co. was still in business I ran Chappies 25gr.hp's with great success. I think Reed bullets bought his equipment????
From 1971 till about 20yrs. ago I used the 17 Rem. exclusively for Red Fox, but when the Coyote population began to take over it became my main Coyote rifle and still is.
Saving pelts was the goal for many years and the 17 Rem does that in spades, but so does the 204 with the bullets I use. In the last several years I've used the 204 more than the 17 Rem. just because....
Now with pelts in this area not selling for much I might switch to using my 9.3X62 which I'm sure will give me full penetration.
thumbup1.gif
 
Originally Posted By: K22Originally Posted By: gunsbam45Thanks for posting the pic, and for the advice. I'm thinking the same thing on rebarreling simply to get the faster twist, but I've got to find one first. I'm actually an FFL dealer, but small time into Ruger revolvers mostly, and never dealt with Kimber. A friend of a friend had one NIB years back he was going to sell me, but got to thinking about it and just couldn't stand to let it go. Do you know how many years, and about what years the .223 and the .204 were in Kimber's lineup? I've been out of the rifle loop quite awhile. Also, what's the best twist to go with to rebarrel the .223?

Also, I don't know much about the 17 Remington other than it's a necked down .223. What bullets do you run in the Montana you rebarreled to 17, and what do you use it for versus the .204?


.....The 17 Rem. is not really a necked down 223, but you can neck a 223 down and have a 17-223. The 17 neck is much longer than a 223 and 223 brass is 1.750 to 1.760 while the 17 Rem is 1.796.......


Good post K22 to correct an age old internet misconception about the 17 Remington. It is actually built off a 222 Rem Mag cartridge case to allow it to be 1.796" long.
 
I have never heard that about the 17 before now. Same parent case as the .204. Thanks again for the info there guys. I wonder how that one got mixed up? Have the coyotes purty much wiped out the red foxes where you are in West NC? You very seldom see a red around here anymore unless it's hiding out in town. Our cat population went through the roof years back when the mange really took the coyotes down hard. Instead of seeing piles of coyote tracks on the section roads, it was several sets of cat tracks and a lone coyote here and there. When the coyotes recovered, the cats thinned down substantially, but they're slippery, so still around. The coyotes seem to have decimated the foxes here. If not the coyotes, something sure has. An red is a rare sight and I've never seen a gray up here in my life.
 
Red Fox are practically gone here, but lots and lots of Grey's. Grey's are harder for the Coyotes to thin out. One of the reasons is because they can climb trees. They are actually felines. Add to that, they hardly stand still.
 
Originally Posted By: K22 They are actually felines.

No

The gray fox (Urocyon cinereoargenteus), or grey fox, is an omnivorous mammal of the family Canidae, widespread throughout North America and Central America.
 
Never heard a gray referred to as a feline, but have had some of the older guys from North Oklahoma tell me they used to tree them with the hounds out running coons. I used to see them fairly often at the Oklahoma place.
 
The 17-223 actually predates the 17 Rem by 10 years, it first showed up in a commercial firearm in the early 1960's by O'Brian arms and was bought by H&R and offered as the 17-223 H&R Ultra Wildcat built on the Sako L-461 action a beautiful little rifle.
 
As an addendum to the above the 17-223 was the second commercial cartridge that was offered in a rifle without any factory ammunition being available. The first was the 22-250.

Greg
 
I personally love my 204 and I can't see myself ever NOT using it.

I think now that the honeymoon faze is over with the market, guys are realizing that the small caliber market is already crowded and 204 brass is expensive to reload when compared to the 223.
 
In SW Pennsylvania, the .223 and .22-250 rein supreme for the lighter work although like everywhere else, people are jumping on the 6.5 Creedmoor bandwagon for a "do-all" kinda rifle. I only know one guy that shoots .204 and ammo availability is probably partially to blame
 
I hope not cause I would hate to downgrade to a 223 velocities or have to deal with deer rifle sized report just to go shooting.
 
Back
Top