Sanity check

Vance

Active member
Ok hear me out and then tell me why this is wrong!

I'm looking at the idea of using night vision for a scanner and a thermal weapon sight for coyotes.

Here's my reasoning, First thermal is expensive for me so one unit is about all I can do right now.
I know that everyone says scanning with thermal is the way to go. But if you can only afford one, why not put it on the weapon?

If scanning with the IR all I'm needing to see is the eyes light up once the call starts.
From there I would get on the thermal and wait for it to get into range for the shot. I could also us the IR for that positive ID.

I see a lot of videos where, when needing a follow up shot with IR, it gets very difficult to see the animal when the eyes are looking the other way.
Where as the thermal guys can stay on target much easier.

IR units are cheap by comparison, though lighting up the eyes may be about all the low tier units are good for?
For instance here is one with a 940 nm IR on it that says it will detect up to 330 yards.
But I would like to know how far could I see a coyotes eyes light up with something along these lines?

https://www.amazon.com/Yukon-Binoculars-invisible-Streaming-smartphone/dp/B076F3ZK9T

If anyone has experience with a decent low cost NV scanner I would love to hear from you.
And anyone who thinks this is a stupid idea please tell me why so I don't go out and be "That" guy.
 
Forget the night vision and get a good gun mounted thermal if you are set on shooting with thermal. Shortly you will find more money for a thermal handheld because after using it you will see how effective it is. Night vision is lousy for scanning because you cant see chit compared to even cheaper thermal. Scanning is just that which means you gotta be able to scan fast and you cant do that with night vision. With night vision you cant find em.....with thermal you cant miss em!

The only other option is to shoot with night vision and scan with decent thermal. It's all about finding them.
 
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I do have plans for a thermal scope, just want to be able to scan without swinging the rifle around every where. Eventually I agree, I'll get a thermal scanner as well.
 
Originally Posted By: varminter .223 Shortly you will find more money for a thermal handheld because after using it you will see how effective it is.

I can't wait to find that pile of money!
 
IMO you're thinking backwards.
No NV, even Gen 3, will beat even an entry level thermal for detection. I use both a thermal and a Gen 3 PVS14 as scanners. With NV you depend on eye shine. If the animal is not looking at you you might not see it. With thermal you will see it no matter which way it is looking. Plus you have to think about recovery. Nothing beats a thermal for that.
Like Varminter said, if you can't see them coming in you can't kill them.
I suggest that you start with the best thermal scanner that you can afford, and maybe digital NV scope, with a good illuminator, for the kill. Then a thermal scope later as your budget allows.
But don't get too hung up on a thermal scope. I own a Trijicon MK3 and I still use my old trusty Night Optics D760 regularly, I don't know how many animals I've killed with it over the past few years. Zero problems and bullet proof performance.
 
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Originally Posted By: 1trkyhntrIMO you're thinking backwards.
I suggest that you start with the best thermal scanner that you can afford, and maybe digital NV scope, with a good illuminator, for the kill. Then a thermal scope later as your budget allows.

I keep going back and forth on this idea. And I get that conventional wisdom says to scan thermal and shoot NV until you get both in thermal.
I'm only predator hunting since we don't have hogs in Utah. So eyes are going to be coming to the call or not depending on whats out there.

I just don't think the current options for NV scopes are what I want to waste money on.
The ATN options scare me off because of all the issues I read about with firmware and such.

The Wraith looks promising, yet field of view, focusing issues, need for external ir light leaves me on the fence there.

Is there something else out there in the Digital NV world thats not the price of thermal and still worth having?
 
All NV's, even the most high end GEN3's, need an external illuminator. That is not a big deal.

I've been there, done that as far as wasting money goes by trying to get by on the cheap.
I'll stick by what I said earlier. On a budget, thermal for scanning and digital or Gen 2 NV for killing.

The Wraith is worth looking at. I have a friend who has one and for the money I don't see how it can be beat.
 
I've heard great things about the wraith.
Not sure what your budget is but scanning with a decent thermal handheld and shooting with digital night vision is the most economical effective way to get started. Thermal absolutely rules when it comes to detection.
 
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When you are scanning with thermal, you have an idea of where the animal is approaching from. Yes, if they are approaching quickly, it can sometimes be difficult to find the animal moving from the scanner to the gun if the gun optic has a narrow field of view. However, it could also be said once you get the animal in the scope, they will be much larger so it can make the shot easier or at least be more confident. If a person is scanning with the gun optic, I really wouldn't recommend a narrow field of view but it can be OK if you have a good idea where the animal is approaching from.

I agree with what everyone else is saying is you really want thermal for scanning. Of course, I am biased that I really recommend thermal for both, but I understand, thermal is expensive.

If you go with a Hogster and a Wraith. There are some positives. First, if you decide you want to use the Hogster on a gun, you can as well as use it as scanner, so it can be used as either down the road. Also, if you decide on a Wraith, you can also use this as a day optic if you like, if you decide to shoot with thermal at night.

To get into decent NV scanner range, it is going to be the same as doing with thermal. The Wraith, or an ATN XSight or 4K, are inexpensive enough as a scope, it makes it somewhat interesting. You will be adding a better IR light most likely, so keep that investment in mind. You can probably sell any of these digital NV scopes for 60% of what you paid for them if you decide to upgrade later.
 
I bought a ld19 from htrn a few years ago and while not the best I love it. I have a gen2plus nemesis that most nights don’t need the ir but use it for eye shine. I love it. Had times when the woods are glowing with the thermal and I can pick out the animal with the nv.Have around 3 grand for both and feel I’m not handicapped at all. You can id so much better with nv , but couldn’t even think of scanning with thermal on a rifle. My arms get tired even with the monocular. And hunting at night you have to have thermal for finding them, just no other way.
 
Originally Posted By: Vancehttps://www.agmglobalvision.com/thermal-imaging/thermal-monoculars/agm-asp-tm25-384

Here is an interesting monocular, I’m thinking I could swing this and a Wraith. I’ve also been looking into a Bering prodigy monocular for about the same price.

I had never heard of AGM but their website shows they are from Springerville, Arizona. Does anyone on here have experience with them?

You can get a USA made genuine FLIR for less money. Not the best image compared to newer technology but they are pretty much bullet proof. I've owned 2 and never had a single issue.
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1...hz_thermal.html
 
Originally Posted By: Vancehttps://www.agmglobalvision.com/thermal-imaging/thermal-monoculars/agm-asp-tm25-384

Here is an interesting monocular, I’m thinking I could swing this and a Wraith. I’ve also been looking into a Bering prodigy monocular for about the same price.

I had never heard of AGM but their website shows they are from Springerville, Arizona. Does anyone on here have experience with them? They were called PRG just recently and went through a name change so that is one reason so few people have heard of them. I used one of their python compact scopes and it was OK. I didn’t like it nearly as well as the hogster, but again it was OK. I have no experience with this scanner. I don’t believe they do any assembly or manufacturing at their facility, but I could be wrong.

I did hear some comments they were not holding their point of impact due to their base. This would impact the scopes but not the scanner.

I have used 2 Prodigy’s to date. The entry-level model and their brand new 640 model. The 640 holds some promise, but it is twice the price that you’re looking at currently. I personally would look at the Hogster 25mm before either of these scanners. Better image, more versatile, and not much difference in price. It can also be a scope if you want.

If you need a bit more money, don’t spend the bare minimum and then wished you would have saved a little longer and got something you will use for a longer time. Just my .02
 
Another option would be to scan with the thermal mounted rifle scope. my son and I clamp our guns into rigid tri-pods and one of us always scans with a gun and the other scans with a hand held scanner.

just my 2 cents

Shaun
 
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