Help me choose a new ar upper & cartridge.

J

Jim Byers

Member
Hi guys, been lurking around here but haven't posted any hunts in a while.. been killing dogs with RRA 223 just fine but I'm ready to play with something new. I'd like to stick with my lower and add a new complete upper in a hotter cartridge. So many to choose from..
My wish list .. 3500+ with 55 to 70 grain bullets... I handload and I'm not scared to dive into a wildcat, but it would be my first..

What say you?
 
If you want to push the 55/70's in a 22 the and use use a standard frame AR15 the choices get pretty slim. I've shot all the hot 22's on the market and the 22 Nosler has done well with 55's at 3624 and 69/70's at 3258 in my 24" guns. The 22-NXS will exceed those speeds without a lot of trouble with 55's up to 37732 with solid 3700 all day. The 69/70's I've shot have only been pushed to 3324 but I have not worked with that level much. I would say you could hit 3500 with the 70's with a bit of work.

OTC ammo and loading data is of course available on the Nosler. The 22-NXS is derived from 6 MM Hagar brass. It is easily formed and showing excellent case life. Loading data is easy just by starting with top 22 Nosler load data and moving up from there usually in the area of 1..5 to 2 grains on top of the starting load.

If you wanted to step up to a 6 MM cartridge then the 6X6.8 would be the logical choice. You can meet the criteria you set with them. Of course the one disadvantage you do hit is that you give up BC getting there with same same bullet weights.

I've shot literally hundreds of load combinations with the above three cartridges and others like the 243 LBC that would make a good 6 MM so feel free to contact me if you want.

Ritch can furnish any of the above chamberings I have mentioned. He designed the three wildcats and is wealth of information. You might give him a call in the afternoon and have a chat.

Greg
 
After using a 22 inch 12 twist 22 Nosler for the last 2 years the 6x6.8 will be what I am going to night hunt with when season opens on 11-10. Im shooting a recipe that I've seen work good in a couple 10 twist 22" rigs and it is 29.7 ar comp, 70 bts at 2.310" with 450 primers. Figure on 3270 ish fps. You can run em a hair faster but the Hornady brass that I am shooting loses primer pockets with any more pressure. 55s will run high 3400's to close to 3700 if I recall depending on powder. H322 is the fast stuff.
If you start looking at ballistic charts you have to get beyond 300 yards before this round lacks enough from a 243 to justify moving to an ar10 imo.
I shot a good-sized coyote at 343 yards behind my house a couple weeks ago with my AR-10 9 twist Stoner upper. Somehow I put an absolutely perfect center shoulder shot on it and it never took a step. That was with the 70 grain Dogtown ammo. I'm looking forward to seeing how the 70's in the 6 x 6. 8 do in comparison at the slower 3270 feet per second.
 
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Mike @ Dtech offers 6mmDTI Shilen match grade barrels and complete uppers. My 22" drives 55gr bullets 3550 fps. It's basically a 6x6.8 but slightly different shoulder angle and with a much better Shilen barrel. 6x6.8 dies can be hard to find, I used to have a 6x6.8 but dumped it for the 6mmDTI.
 
Originally Posted By: HogThumperThe 6x6.8 seemed like the most capable cartridge when I was looking for something similar. Now Nosler has released their own version of the wildcat, called the .24 Nosler, with a rebated rim that will use your standard .223 bolt face. Seems to make sense to me.

https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/review-the-24-nosler/357574

The 24 Nosler is very close in size to the Valkyrie so my comparisons are based on that premise.. The case has been shortened from the parent and performance is virtually mirror of the 6X45. Case capacity in a STANDRD Valkyrie within about 2-3% and with the 6X45 running at a higher pressure will stay with the 24 Nosler. The 6X45 is limited to about 87-90 grains at magazine length and since we are talking up to 70's it is a cake walk to keep up.

As the capacity is almost the same as the Valkyrie the gains just aren't there IMHO. I've been shooting the 22 Valkyrie side by side with my 223's for about three years and in light bullets in the 223 I can easily match the Valk in velocity with 25-30% cheaper brass if you actually buy new 223's

The rebated rim on the Nosler has been a bit problematic for case life in my experience and as Nosler is the only source, that I know of, for brass I wouldn't put my eggs in that basket. It tends to be soft and the rims pound out and won';t fit your shell holder and that's with standard pressure recommended loadings. Of course one could always go the 6.8 brass conversion on the 24 Nosler as opposed to needing the HAGAR stuff if you want 22 NOSGAR brass.

I will point out that the NOSGAR conversion brass is about 3.5% less than the original in capacity with my NOSGAR going 35.78 and the original factory Nolser is 36.87. A bit off topic but food for though my 2223 Win SX bras s shows 31.26 and the much vaunted 22 Valkyrie is 32.10 and with the pressure award going to the 223 you can easily see why it stays up to the new guy on the block.

Greg

I found some documentation in a Shooting Times article. that the 24 NOSLER is only 27.9 grains of H2O. If that is correct it holds far less than a 6X45 by about 15%. It isn't going to carry the mail compared to a 6X45 when shooting magazine bullets of up to 87 in the 6X45. A fairer comparison with the 24 NOSLER would be a 222 opened up to 6 MM IMHO.
 
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take a peak at the 6.5 grendel too... its a fun and easy round to load for too if you are into reloading. 6.8 knocks the socks off dogs too... there are so many awesome calibers that will fit into the AR. you are just going to have to build several so you can have every flavor
 
Originally Posted By: JMettetake a peak at the 6.5 grendel too... its a fun and easy round to load for too if you are into reloading. 6.8 knocks the socks off dogs too... there are so many awesome calibers that will fit into the AR. you are just going to have to build several so you can have every flavor

No doubt the Grendel or its variants is a great round but it won't come close to any of the velocity or bullet weight envelopes the OP is looking at. The lightest pill I've shot was 85 grains and the fastest I got that one going was 3100 and that was humped up way past what the books recommend

Greg
 
Originally Posted By: DiRTY DOGMike @ Dtech offers 6mmDTI Shilen match grade barrels and complete uppers. My 22" drives 55gr bullets 3550 fps. It's basically a 6x6.8 but slightly different shoulder angle and with a much better Shilen barrel. 6x6.8 dies can be hard to find, I used to have a 6x6.8 but dumped it for the 6mmDTI. Dtech uppers are great and they can also build an ar15 243 wssm upper that will push 75gr bullets to ~3600fps. I'm shooting 95gr TMKs at around 3100fps and they're supersonic to well past 1000yds. With a shilen select match barrel and good hand loads, you can actually make use of that 1k range. Unfortunately, the higher BC berger 105gr hybrids can't be loaded to mag length. BTW, brass availability is fine right now.
 
I have a 6x6.8 i use it for nite hunting coyotes i shoot h322 with 58g vmaxes at like 3500-3550. Mine shoots very accurate it’s a bhw barrel 22” long Ritch is the one that designed the cartridge on this and it works very good mine is very accurate.
 
22 Nosler is hard to beat. I killed well over 50 dogs with mine last year shooting Dogtown 55gr ammo. Shooting suppressed with adjustable gas block I never had any issues. I loaded for it as well and could get 4 or 5 loads before brass wouldnt fit in my shell holder. Brass is dime a dozen from midway and you dont have to wait for yearly or biyearly runs of brass. Midway runs the dogtown ammo on sale for $79 per 200 every few months and it would absolutely stone coyotes. I've since switched to an AR10 243 and stopped chasing brass, dies and load development ment. I'm running the 70gr dogtown ammo at 3400fps out of my 20in barrel and its dropping dogs weekly for me. Hunting 3 and 4 nights a week working fulltime job with 2 kids, sure making having factory ammo nice. Good luck with whatever you choose
 
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