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#3212025 - 09/08/19 11:05 PM struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable
Lodgepole Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 12/16/15
Posts: 533
Loc: montana
I hope some one could direct me to a old thread that could help.Is this a common problem for newer AR shooters ? I just removed a riser from under my cantilever mount ,I seem to be getting better accuracy but not as comfy .
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#3212029 - 09/08/19 11:53 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
lowholer1 Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 905
Loc: washington
You need an ar 15 specific scope mount. The ar platform needs a bit taller scope mount due to its desighn.There are lots to choose from. I like areo precision cantlever style you can get them on sale at aero precision quiet often around $80.00 other options as much as $250.00 the sky is the limit tons of manufactures to choose from.
Good Luck Rick
.
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#3212034 - 09/09/19 06:23 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
varminter .223 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/01/10
Posts: 2113
Loc: south central Illinois
Nikon p series mount seems to be the cheapest mount going. I have several and the height seems to work well.


Edited by varminter .223 (09/09/19 06:23 AM)

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#3212039 - 09/09/19 07:32 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
BillfromHighland Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 04/06/11
Posts: 213
Loc: Illinois unfortunately
Burris PEPR mounts work well for me on AR 10, AR 15 and Chassis guns.

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#3212041 - 09/09/19 08:08 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: BillfromHighland]
1lessdog Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 05/24/04
Posts: 565
Loc: N.D./Mn
Monstrum Slim Profile Series Offset Cantilever Picatinny Scope Mount | 1 inch Diameter | Black
Click image to open expanded view
This is what I use, they work great and very tough. Plus good price on Amazon
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#3212047 - 09/09/19 09:29 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
steve garrett Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 01/18/03
Posts: 2176
Loc: tx
I like my mount a bit higher thAn the standard at mounts. Rra works but is big and heavy. Bsquare makes on that works for me too. But I run eop uppers with nightforce rings mostly
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#3212066 - 09/09/19 12:50 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: varminter .223]
Plant.One Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 4100
Loc: Oakland County, MI
Originally Posted By: varminter .223
Nikon p series mount seems to be the cheapest mount going. I have several and the height seems to work well.


ill second the p-series. have been using them for several years now.

budget priced around $50. i like the two peice mounts as it leaves a spot for a brass catcher between the rings smile
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All reloading info shared is based on my experiences in my guns. Follow safe reloading practice and work up loads from published minimum data.
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#3212096 - 09/09/19 04:40 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Varminterror Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 03/23/12
Posts: 2824
Loc: Kansas
I’ll offer the dissenting opinion on Nikon scope mounts, both P series and M. They’re cheap, they’re available, but they’re really not a good product. I build a lot of AR’s, a couple dozen each year still, over 200 ground up, and more than 600 as rebuilt uppers. A lot of customers/colleagues/friends ask about the Nikon mounts since they are so “affordable.” If a guy is going to spend the time lapping and aligning them, great. But it’s a lot of wasted elbow grease just to save a few bucks. I have never experienced a brand of rings with more eccentricity and misalignment. Many sets of P series mounts I have installed have had less than 25% surface contact out of the box.

Warne and Vortex make far better products for not much more money than the Nikons. Warping or denting your scope tube to save $30 is nonsensical.
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#3212098 - 09/09/19 05:31 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
arlaunch Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 04/09/17
Posts: 301
Loc: OR
When you buy Nikon and Burris you support Asia. China really.

I don't like to spend a fortune for scope mounts for 50-300 yard varmint rifles...

Warne MFG scopes for me.

Here


Use code MDX if you can get your cart over $100
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Be consistent with your loading, practice your shooting, speak the truth, love your family and you will be rewarded.

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#3212102 - 09/09/19 05:56 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
GLShooter Offline
PM Sponsor

Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 4916
Loc: AZ
I just put the scope in a set of tall rings or a set of YHM mini-risers and standard rings. I don't use any canrtilvered mounts.

Greg
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#3212109 - 09/09/19 07:28 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Gman757 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 10/15/09
Posts: 1557
Loc: FL

Nice AR mounts with choice of height and offset.

https://www.americandefensemanufacturing...mp;pagenumber=2

I just got a set of Vortex Pro Series high rings in today. They seem to be well made.

https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-pro-series-30mm-rings.html?vx_ring_height=1182


Edited by Gman757 (09/09/19 09:03 PM)

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#3212147 - 09/09/19 11:47 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Lodgepole Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 12/16/15
Posts: 533
Loc: montana
Thanks all .Please explain the offset mounts and why you use them .Do you folks find that you can comfortably mount and get on target with AR s as quickly as with a bolt rifle ?
_________________________
Be not angry that you cannot make others as you wish them to be, since you cannot make yourself as you wish to be.”
― Thomas à Kempis, The Imitation of Christ

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#3212159 - 09/10/19 09:20 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
willy1947 Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 11/20/11
Posts: 3028
Loc: Ohio, Ohio


You have noticed the iron sights on an AR-15, they are set high.
Because your buffer tube is your cheekpiece.
On a bolt action rifle, you have a drop at the comb.
So you can see your iron sights.
Centerlines of scope to bore on an AR should be around 3 inches.
It is just because that is the way AR's are made.
A lot of people set their scopes to low on the AR platform.
It is important to see your eyepiece correctly.
This is covered in a book by Maj. John L. Plaster, USAR (RET.)
"The Ultimate Sniper"
And Bryan Litz's "Applied Ballistics for Long-range shooting"
I was lucky I received my training at 29 Palms before they wrote these books.
Thank you, US Marine Corp and my DI "John C"
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#3212163 - 09/10/19 11:57 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Plant.One Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 4100
Loc: Oakland County, MI
Originally Posted By: Lodgepole
Thanks all .Please explain the offset mounts and why you use them .Do you folks find that you can comfortably mount and get on target with AR s as quickly as with a bolt rifle ?


i'll answer your second question first: yes - but only if setup correctly.



if your AR is setup for your eye to fall in the middle of your optic when you cheek weld that firearm - like it is with the drop comb stock on a traditional firearm - you're gonna get good quick target acquisition in the same fashion you're used to with your favorite traditional firearm. we're just using a different tool - scope mounting device, vs the firearm stock itself - to achieve that eye-optic alignment.

try to setup your AR close to the barrel like you would a bolt gun and no.. you're gonna struggle every time you want to put an eyeball behind your optic - but its because you're trying to treat it like a differently designed firearm.

that why we use special ar-specific rings. to avoid a 'round peg, square hole' issue.


likewise the offset mounts are for ease of achieving eye relief.

again - due to the design differences in ar's vs traditional firearms, you either need to pick an optic with a specific eye-relief (which can be challenging) OR be able to move the optic closer/further to you (usually easier).

sometimes that means you need your optic to be level with the rear of the charging handle , sometimes forward, and sometimes behind it. unfortunately because of the charging handle, the rail slots cant go back to the end of the receiver - and likewise unless you use a full rail handguard it cant be moved forward - so if you need to adjust the optic back/forward more.. you need a cantilever style mount.

its just one more way for the platform to be truly modular and adaptable to just about any piece of equipment (and shooter!) on the market.
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All reloading info shared is based on my experiences in my guns. Follow safe reloading practice and work up loads from published minimum data.
This disclaimer will self destruct in 10 seconds.


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#3212201 - 09/10/19 11:13 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Lodgepole Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 12/16/15
Posts: 533
Loc: montana
Willy and Plant With the cantilever and a riser under it the center of bore to center of scope was 3 1/4 inches .I seemed to get better scope picture and quicker on target however my accuracy was suffering I think because of canting (inconsistent ) I have plenty of eye relief ,my problem I think is getting over the comb far enough (laterally ) . Thanks for your help .
_________________________
Be not angry that you cannot make others as you wish them to be, since you cannot make yourself as you wish to be.”
― Thomas à Kempis, The Imitation of Christ

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#3212206 - 09/11/19 01:51 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Plant.One Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 4100
Loc: Oakland County, MI
switching to a rifle with a pistol grip does take some adjustment.

like everything else - practice makes perfect and is the only way to develop muscle memory.

may wish to consider a visible level to put onto your gun (or optic) to help you get used to getting rid of any cant.

hand placement and how you hold the pistol grip play a big part in the correction - that pistol grip hanging down is a very leverage heavy point for the vertical index of your firearm..

treat it more like good hangdun fundamentals and things will fall into play a bit easier.

i know that when i fixed my grip related accuracy problems for my handgun, my long gun accuracy increased significantly. much like with a handgun - if you do everything else but your trigger pull and grip position on the gun sucks - the results you get are going to follow right along.
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All reloading info shared is based on my experiences in my guns. Follow safe reloading practice and work up loads from published minimum data.
This disclaimer will self destruct in 10 seconds.


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#3212214 - 09/11/19 10:54 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Gman757 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 10/15/09
Posts: 1557
Loc: FL
Originally Posted By: Lodgepole
Willy and Plant With the cantilever and a riser under it the center of bore to center of scope was 3 1/4 inches .I seemed to get better scope picture and quicker on target however my accuracy was suffering I think because of canting (inconsistent ) I have plenty of eye relief ,my problem I think is getting over the comb far enough (laterally ) . Thanks for your help .


What type buttstock are your using? Fixed or adjustable? Adjusting your cheek weld might be a factor.

The Magpul CTR/MOE stocks have an adjustable cheek weld option with 3 different heights of cheek risers.

https://www.magpul.com/products/ctr-moe-025-cheek-riser

There are several others that have an integral adjustable cheek riser.

https://www.fab-defense.com/en/category-buttstocks.html

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#3212334 - 09/12/19 11:52 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Lodgepole Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 12/16/15
Posts: 533
Loc: montana
Gman I am not sure .It came on a Palmetto lower. I will find out .Thanks for the help .
_________________________
Be not angry that you cannot make others as you wish them to be, since you cannot make yourself as you wish to be.”
― Thomas à Kempis, The Imitation of Christ

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#3212335 - 09/12/19 11:53 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Lodgepole Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 12/16/15
Posts: 533
Loc: montana
It is not adjustable and I need to check those out .
_________________________
Be not angry that you cannot make others as you wish them to be, since you cannot make yourself as you wish to be.”
― Thomas à Kempis, The Imitation of Christ

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#3212339 - 09/13/19 01:02 AM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
Plant.One Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 4100
Loc: Oakland County, MI
make sure whatever version you select doesnt interfere with the operation of the charging handle. a very real consideration when adding stuff to the stock of an ar15, both adjustable and not. also something us folks with pistols have to take into consideration when selecting something to use as a buffer tube sleeve (that metal gets cold when its chilly outside - especailly when rested against the side of your face!)


larue makes one that moves with the CH, but thats for an adjustable stock model (CTR) which will require replacing your buffer tube, spring and buffer assembly along with the need to purchase a CTR stock.

https://www.larue.com/products/larue-tactical-risrtm-reciprocating-inline-stock-riser/



_________________________
All reloading info shared is based on my experiences in my guns. Follow safe reloading practice and work up loads from published minimum data.
This disclaimer will self destruct in 10 seconds.


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#3212406 - 09/13/19 10:29 PM Re: struggling with AR scope height to get comfortable [Re: Lodgepole]
22 Chuck Offline
Predator Master

Registered: 08/11/17
Posts: 57
Loc: Montmorency Co, MI
Get a cantlever-Weaver if still available for about $40 as opposed to $80 for those labelled 223 something. Probably Chinese

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