Scope mounting on bolt guns for correct eye relief with the Photon RT 4.5

Dultimatpredator

Well-known member
I decided to mount my photon on my LTR 223 and also switch it back and forth to mount on my ruger American 22 wmr. The problem is with the lack of forgiving eye relief with this scope. The optic needs to come extremely far back and looks kinda goofy when it's positioned correctly. It's no problem when mounting it on my AR with an adjustable stock but a major pain in the rump when trying to find a mount to get the photon all the way back to my eye mounting on a bolt rifle. I've been burning my batteries down on the iPad for weeks and stumbled across a lot of photon users in the UK mounting their optics on bolt centerfire and rimfires. I wanted a QD mount but wasn't paying two bills for the only one that I could find. The biggest challenge is finding a mount with a ring that extends behind the picantinny mount or it won't come back far enough. In sure most shooters "choke up on the bat" when shooting them from bolt rifles the way I've seen them mounted being you have to move your head way forward in order to see the sight picture. I wasn't going to strain to do this or I would have just left it in my AR.

The shooters in UK had them mounted with what they called a Yukon branded mount. It looks exactly like a primary arms extended mount.

Well, I ordered a primary arms deluxe extended mount and a pair of EGW bases for both my 223 and 22 wmr.

The mount came the other day and the bases yesterday. I mounted the bases...not a big fan of how picantinny bases look....UGLY! But if it gets the job done so I can mount my day/night vision mission accomplished.

Then I unboxed the PA base. I went to remove the scope ring and found one of the screws was screwed in half way and seized. I removed it with a bit of force and found that someone cross threaded it. Really? I bought it direct form PA. I emailed them right away on my defective $60 base. I will follow up tomorrow as soon as they open.

Well, so I wasn't at a complete loss I wanted to see if the eye relief worked or if I was just chasing the impossible. I mounted the optic with the other screws loosely to check eye relief. With the optic mounted about a 1/8-1/4 from the rear ring and the base lined up with the last picantinny slot...on both the LTR and RAR the eye relief was perfect! Too bad one of the screws were tripped or I'd be in business!

I just don't like the looks of the picantinny rails and how high my day optics sit on them...but I'm sure it will grow on me.

Will the Primary arms mount return to zero when taking it on and off...or be pretty close?

I read that set up this exact way with zero MOA bases that the scopes zeroed in pretty easy without running out of windage and elivation adjustments. Guess we will see when PA sends me another base. I figured this might help others trying to set their photons up on non AR type rifles struggling with eye relief.

The RAR balances out out nicely and feels as light a feather compaired to the LTR...but I like the way the LTR feels with it mounted on it. Torn between the two!


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It does look rather odd on the Ruger rimfire, extending back that far. It sure would be nice if the scope companies would do something about eye relief.

Sorry to hear about the stripped screw. That's frustrating. Hopefully the company will make things right, but that just prolongs getting it mounted and ready for some shooting.

 
The photon was definitely made specifically for an adjustable stocked AR's with the lack of eye relief.

$47 for the RAR rail shipped from EGW and I found the steel LTR base on eBay for $65...normally $109. Then another $60 for the defective mount. There is no such thing as a cheap mount setup for bolt rifles if you want to run a photon on it. I called PA this morning and they gave me a song a pond dance. I emailed them the pics of the screw cross threaded. They told me that they don't check the bases when they receive them and just send them out. Im sure someone in China stripped it. I will call them in an hour to follow up that my email was received. I was told to send it back, they would inspect it and get back to me. I'll be calling shortly and getting tuff with them.
 
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The 2nd mount showed the other day. It was in 10 times worse shape than the first one. The mount was definitely used. It had several gouges in the mount, bluing gone and aluminum showing. Two of the screws were grabbing when removing as well. I emailed PA the pics. They offered to hand pic me a third one and send it out. I told them to forget it and I was under the understanding that was happening the second time around. The refunded me and said not to send back the mounts. I found this one in eBay for $39.99...$20 less and I believe they probably come from the exact same manufacture (China) and I just skipped the middle man. This one is the exact same dimensions but has a QD base! What I wanted in the first place. We will see how it works when it shows. I figure it will have a better chance returning to a "true" zero vs trying to touque nuts every time when switching between the two rifles.

Here us the Aztec base off eBay...

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Vs the PA mount...

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If this one doesn't work I'll be paying $180 for a mount.
 
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Originally Posted By: 6mm06
How about the Burris PEPR mount? Would that one work? Does it have enough extension?

I wish it would...its a great mount but im sure it won't bring the optic far enough back to my eye. I believe it sits about a a good half inch further forward when reversed like I'm mounting mine.
 
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Eye relief on the Photon sucks, only non adjustable stock i've seen it fit OK is on a ruger 10/22 which has a really short length of pull.
 
The QR mount came. It won't work. The bolt won't clear the QR levers. I never checked the PA mount...the RAR won't clear the mounting bolts when all th way back! I never checked it. I moved the punt about an inch or so forward and the bolt clears and I still gave enough clearance for my eye. I just have to put my head a hair forward now. That means that it will open my options up to other mounts that will work. I bought a $6.99 30mm mount to go around the optic to mount my UNV 201R. I didn't try it on my LTR for bolt clearance but I would assume I'll have to move it forward as well.


It clears when mounted forward....

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It has been a pain for sure. Would be nice if the company would take notice and do something about eye relief on future models.
 
I haven't had a chance to sight it in yet but bore sighted it today at 25 yards. I wasn't off by much at all. I had to go 2/3 clicks to the left and about 5/6 clicks up at the most. The cross hairs stayed centered in the middle of the screen when done. I did this in the daylight. It isn't the crispest picture...maybe my lazek has something to do with this. I'll try it a longer distances and in the dark as well. At least it seems my mount I chose lined the optic up "true" enough that I didn't run out of windage and elevation adjustments.
 
Now you have me worried! I ordered a Photon last week for my buddy, and he wants to mount it on a T/C Venture 22-250. We're having trouble finding a base, haven't gotten as far as rings yet. He's not an AR guy, sure hope we don't have the problems you're having. Let me know if you have any suggestions.
 
Looks to me like the mount would work better if turned around. There is no way I could shoot a rifle with the eye piece that far back. I know very little about night vision so I'm just going by the way it looks to me.
 
Originally Posted By: pyscodogLooks to me like the mount would work better if turned around. There is no way I could shoot a rifle with the eye piece that far back. I know very little about night vision so I'm just going by the way it looks to me.

If I turned it around I'd have to pull my face forward and strain to look through it. You wouldn't believe the lack of eye relief this optic has. The only firearm it would work on is an AR with a colapsable stock...just about all the way in. If you google pics of phonons mounted on bolt action rifles you'll see most are mounted the same way. I'm not a small guy either. 6'2" and have a 32" draw length on my bow. It's the way these optics are designed. You'd have to try to look though one to understand. You can mount it with normal rings and then you'll be straining you eye and neck WAY forward to try....and I mean TRY to see through it. Photon is aware of this and told me it wouldn't work on my LTR and RAR but I figured out in how to make it work.

The rubber bell can be removed which makes the optic tooks closer to the action but I don't suggest to take it off. It lungs your eye up to the scope...and it's not forgiving if you move left or right. Your looking at a black and white tv screen...not a magnified lens.
 
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Originally Posted By: nr123Now you have me worried! I ordered a Photon last week for my buddy, and he wants to mount it on a T/C Venture 22-250. We're having trouble finding a base, haven't gotten as far as rings yet. He's not an AR guy, sure hope we don't have the problems you're having. Let me know if you have any suggestions.

I have a pair of QR sitemark 4302 rings I'll sell you...depending on long your stock is you might have to "clinch up on the bat" to use them. They worked great on my AR for eye relief when the stock was collaped. I have them listed here in the classifieds.

The biggest issues I've read I'd that a lot of users have run out of sight and elevation adjustments and have had to schim the base and or rings to get the optic sighted in. Or they sighted it in with adjustments cranked all the way in one direction so the crosshairs are sitting to high,low, left, or right in the screen. It's a TV screen and not a glass optic you have to remember. There is no variance in eye relief, your eye has to be perfectly ligned up In the EXACT spot to look through this thing. Photon told me to sight my optic in with a lazer bore sighted after mounted and that would show if it has enough adjustments to do so. If not try another mount or what they said, another gun. The mount I bought worked great as far as bore sighting but I still have to sight in in. I new it probably would work fine since I did my research and found a lot of guys in the UK using a similar mount set up the exact same way. If your putting it on a non AR type rifle with a non adjustable/colapsable type stock your going to be leaning waaaay forward to look through the Optic. I'm sure without a doubt my and anyone else's accuracy would suffer by having to lean in and strain. It felt rediculous.

Once you get the optic hold it and look through for eye relief while your buddy holds the rifle next to it so see how close you need it to you eye. I were you I would be buying a picantinny base and probably the same mount to reverse or one very similar or your going to have eye relief issues.
 
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Have you looked at the Vortex - Sport Cantilever Mount? I picked up the 2" offset for my AR after using the Burris PEPR last year... they also have a 3" offset. I liked the Burris, but I just wanted to try something a little more streamlined. The Vortex mount uses Torx head bolts so you should avoid the clearance issues that you were having.
 
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