What am I doing wrong? Cases getting stuck in chamber

Greyhunter

New member
I am having issues with a particular reload getting stuck in the chamber of my ARs but I don't know why. This occurs on more than 1 rifle, so it's not the barrel. About 50% of the time I try to manually remove an unfired cartridge it gets stuck, requiring all my strength on the charging handle with both hands to remove it. Sometimes that is not enough and I have to smack the rifle butt on the ground while pulling the charging handle. At least once I ripped the rim off doing this, and once last winter the rim ripped off when I fired at a coyote (cleaning rod knocked it out).
The other issue I'm having recently with this load is failure to fire on the first round. After hitting the bolt release to chamber a round all I get is a "click", but no primer strike. No sign of the firing pin touching the primer. If I put that round back in and try again it always fires the 2nd time. This seems like more of a gun issue than a load issue, but again it only seems to happen with this load.
The load in question is a 60gr Vmax loaded in a Winchester case (guessing cases have 2-3 firings on them), using Redding dies, 2.26" OAL.
So what is causing these issues?? I'm not having a problem with any of my other loads but they are using different brass and bullets.
 
If it were all loads screw your sizer in. You probably aren't bumping the shouldersi enough. You want about 0.004 bump for reliability. Size some cases without the bullets and turn it in until they extract easily. This is where the Hornady head space gauge shines.

If it's just this specific bullet make sure you're not stuffing it in the lands.


Greg
 
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The first thing I would do is get a case gauge and verify that the rounds do seat fully into the gauge and that the trim length is good. I'm certainly no expert, but if I had to guess, which really I am, it sounds like the bolt is not fully going into battery.
 
I suspect you guys are right, that I need to adjust my resisng die. I just don't understand why it only happens with Win brass. The brass has been trimmed and there is no indication that the bullets are sticking in the lands. The failure to fire would also seem to indicate that they are not seating in the chamber fully. The FTF did not occur in my 5.56 chamber but is happening in the new Wylde chamber. Both had extraction issues.

Just so I'm clear,the hornady headspace guage and a standard case guage are checking the same thing, but the headspace guage is allowing you to measure exactly what the demensions are as apposed to just go/no go, correct?
And, short of pulling the bullets and starting over, there is nothing I can do to correct the rounds I already have loaded, right?

Thanks guys
 
Originally Posted By: Dirty HippieThe first thing I would do is get a case gauge and verify that the rounds do seat fully into the gauge and that the trim length is good. I'm certainly no expert, but if I had to guess, which really I am, it sounds like the bolt is not fully going into battery. this is spot on
 
Originally Posted By: GreyhunterI suspect you guys are right, that I need to adjust my resisng die. I just don't understand why it only happens with Win brass. The brass has been trimmed and there is no indication that the bullets are sticking in the lands. The failure to fire would also seem to indicate that they are not seating in the chamber fully. The FTF did not occur in my 5.56 chamber but is happening in the new Wylde chamber. Both had extraction issues.

Just so I'm clear,the hornady headspace guage and a standard case guage are checking the same thing, but the headspace guage is allowing you to measure exactly what the demensions are as apposed to just go/no go, correct?
And, short of pulling the bullets and starting over, there is nothing I can do to correct the rounds I already have loaded, right?

Thanks guys

also if you have another one that gets stuck rather than yanking on the charging handle real hard pull back on the charging handle and use a pair of needle-nose pliers and wedge that between the bolt and the bolt body and slightly pry back as you pull on the charging handle and it will release it really easy
 
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I had that same problem when I got cheap and decided to minimally FL size my brass to save case stretching. I immediately ran into FTE and stuck cartridges. After I screwed the die fully in and the problem quit. However I had several hundred brass & loaded shells that I had to run through the case gauge to find and resize the empty long brass and the loaded cartridges that got their bullets pulled and the case sized without the decapping assembly in the sizing die then the bullets reseated. It was a major PITA but buying the cartridge gauge saved the day.
 
The Hornady lets you get right down and get easily seen numbers spefic to your chamber. The case gage lets you see that you are within SAMMI spec but really doesn't give you the feedback you want IMHO.

If you had a FL BUSHING die you could bump the shoulders without the bushing in place. If you just use s standard sizer and no expander rod etc. you are squeezing the necks down on the bullet and this may cause issues with accuracy and is not a good idea from that stand point alone.

Greg
 
Thanks for the advice. Looks like my local place has the Hornady headspace comparator in stock so I'll pick it up and I guess I'll get some use out of my bullet puller too.
I knew this issue was occurring with this load so when I needed more of them I rechecked the die setting instructions and loaded another 100 or so. When the problem persisted I thought maybe I had a barrel (chamber) issue but the new barrel does it too so I need a way of measuring what I'm doing with the die.
Thanks again and I'll be back to complain in a couple of weeks if it doesn't work lol.
 
Originally Posted By: GLShooter You probably aren't bumping the shouldersi enough.

I'd guess this exactly, I had the same problem. I even went out and bought a small base die and it didn't help. What is was is I wasn't bumping the sholder enough, I'm pretty sure I have it set now where the full length die is a 1/2 turn past where it hits the shellplate. Initially I had it set up where it was flush to 1/8 turn past.

The problem compounded for me because I was using dirty Lake City brass which was a pain to size on a progressive. Now I have a wet tumbler and my sizing die set up properly, haven't had an issue since. I'm pretty sure I referenced hornady's direction booklet aswell as their youtube video on initial setup and it was wrong.
 
Yeah that's the part I don't understand. I'm setting the dies up per the instructions and I'm still having issues. I'm a very novice level reloader, but I've never had an issue with this in over 20 years and now I'm plauged with the problem. Actually it seems to be getting worse, hopefully the headspace guage will let me know what's going on.
I assume the reason the problem is getting worse is because I'm shooting suppressed now so the chamber is that much dirtier and stickier, but I definitely had some issues with it before.
 
what brand of dies are you using?

have you taken any measurements of the cases after you resize them with your calipers?

i'm thinking body diamater, among other points of measurement.


also when discussing "case gauges" its important to know what brand you're referring to.

not all case gauges are the same, or "measure" the same specs.
 
I have a 6x6.8 and was using the bushing dies initially. The new brass necked down all shot fine, but the 2nd time the brass was loaded either the bolt wouldn't close completely or it was painful to get open using the charging handle. I picked up the Hornady headspace gauge and could tell right away that I was not bumping the shoulder like I should be. I ended up getting a custom die set for the 6x6.8 and it works sweet, brass looks like it should and measures like it should. I'm planning to go out tomorrow evening to make sure everything is cycling fine.
 
The dies are Redding deluxe set, only set of 223 dies I have ever had, and I only use the full length sizing die. The guage I got today is the Hornady Headspace Comparator set, I need to do some youtubing to figure out how to really use it.
Just trying it out quickly tonight I can see that the problem rounds are measuring anywhere from .005 to .012 longer than factory loaded 55gr Vmax. The reloads I have that don't cause issues are from .003-.005 longer than factory Vmax.
Couple questions:
1. My fired cases are actually measuring a little shorter than my unfired reloads, shouldn't that be the other way around?

2. Is there a specific measurment I should be trying for here? I assume the exact number varies from chamber to chamber but there must be a SAAMI measurment to start from. **Disregard** I see that this guage doesn't really work that way. Still, could I use the factory Vmax number as a minimum reference number? I'm assuming factory ammo is on the short side of SAMMI spec to ensure it works in all guns?

3. Why am I getting significantly longer measurements with the Winchester brass vs Federal using the same die setting?
Thanks
 
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It's always nice to have other reloaders to bounce idea's off of. That's one thing with reloading is when your new you're very hesitant to go against the book or manufactures instructions, and for good reason. Myself and a buddy talk at great lengths about problems we've come across and believe me we've seen some problems.

In regards to possibly not bumping the shoulder enough. Just as a test, set the sizer up so it touches the shell plate with the ram all the way up. Go 1/8 turn past that and size, run it in the chamber and see how smooth it is (i'm suspecting that will stick). Then go another 1/8 turn and try again. Eventually you'll find where it chambers and extracts smoothly. With my Reddings it ended up being about a 1/2 turn past and you can feel it camming over pretty good. I then marked the die with a marker so I know exactly where it needs to be.

Your trimming to book length after sizing, correct?

I never ended up getting the guages but that would be the right thing to do.
 
Just use the gauge on fired cases. Forget what unfired is. Set the press to bump back 0.004-0.005 off fired length. If your dies don't let you push that much grind the shell holder about 0.010 on a regular press.

I NEVER stress the press by camming over. Much easier to have more working room rather than fighting it IMHO.

Greg
 
Originally Posted By: GLShooterJust use the gauge on fired cases. Forget what unfired is. Set the press to bump back 0.004-0.005 off fired length. If your dies don't let you push that much grind the shell holder about 0.010 on a regular press.

I NEVER stress the press by camming over. Much easier to have more working room rather than fighting it IMHO.

Greg



How do some folks manage to get more sizing on their brass after a solid steel shell holder contacts a solid steel die?

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try a RCBS shell holder...

i'm not sure about redding, but i know with some dies, a 223 lee shell holder in your press is just a bit thicker and wont always allow your brass to get fully resized all the way down to the base of the shell. this solved some base-resizing issues i was having with a lee #4 (223, 204, 300blk, etc) shell holder


i would also suggest you take some caliper measurements of the body at certain places - right behind the shoulder, down at the case web, etc - and compare them to a fired piece of brass vs a resized one. i would then compare these measurements against those of SAAMI spec for 223

223-Remington-cartridge-and-chamber-791x1024.jpg



also - can you post some pics of the brass thats giving you fits? maybe someone here can spot something right out of the gate that way.

any info will help with the trouble diagnosis
 
You grind the shell holder as noted or you can grind the die body. Anyone can do the first pretty easily. I've had Hornady do a couple dies for me for free. Redding usually refuses to do that. Spec wise the shell holder adjustment renders closer to spec than grinding the die.

The die may touch the holder lightly but mine don't. I ave worked almost all my shell holders and after years of doing it nothing unexpected has occurred.

Greg
 
Originally Posted By: GLShooterYou grind the shell holder as noted or you can grind the die body. Anyone can do the first pretty easily. I've had Hornady do a couple dies for me for free. Redding usually refuses to do that. Spec wise the shell holder adjustment renders closer to spec than grinding the die.

The die may touch the holder lightly but mine don't. I ave worked almost all my shell holders and after years of doing it nothing unexpected has occurred.

Greg

Yes.
thumbup1.gif


I had .010 taken off the shellholder plates on both my Co-ax presses.
Problem solved.







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