Contacting who to try and get hunting laws changed.

Z

zr600

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Ok I live in ND and last year they legalized thermal and nightvision but for me thermal is out of my price range, but some nightvision is. But the problem is they don’t allow ir lights to be used. Do you really need the ir with night vision? Also who and how would you go about contacting political parties about this? Any information or help would be great.
 
I'd talk with your GFP up there and find out their opposition and see if they can be convinced to help make the change. Thats the easiest route, convince them the rule does not make sense in the current legal environment and they will recommend the change. That sails through your legislature.

If that doesn't work your avenue then is the political route. That will require some relationships with some of your local politicians. Get some talking points put together and a reasonable explanation of why this should be changed. You are going to have opposition and have ammunition ready to neutralize their argument. If you make it easy for them with plenty of information ready to counter what most likely will be GFP agency opposition you may succeed. Be ready to testify, take questions and be the point man.


If it is like SD, your GFP has a full time guy at the capitol lobbying sometimes against your behalf. It takes facts, relationships and power to overcome that advantage, plus a ton of time. James would know, he put in a ton getting SD's laws changed and did all the testifying and leg work.

Getting outside lobbying groups on your side will also greatly help. That being said if I was you I'd just save up for thermal and skip the NV and political fight and spend more time hunting.
 
Originally Posted By: zr600Ok I live in ND and last year they legalized thermal and nightvision but for me thermal is out of my price range, but some nightvision is.

The new FLIR PTS 233 Thermal scope sells for $2200 or less if you shop around .....That's a great price for a 12 micron core.

You would need to spend at least that much for a quality NV unit along with high powered emitter to make it usable.
 
The Pulsar RXQ30v is in the $1800 to $1900 range, it’s no slouch either.
We have the same law here in IA with the IR light as well. The main problem with the political route is that it’s a slow process.
 
I'm in the same boat zr600, except last year, before my wife bought me my ATN X-sight 2 for Christmas I contacted the game and fish department to clarify that the IR light necessary to make it worth the investment was legal to use... They responded to my email stating that yes, in fact it was legal to use the IR illuminator, but only on coyotes. Fast forward to this year and now I find out that it is in fact illegal to use the IR illuminator that was included with my ATN scope. I'm Pissed. If they had told me in the first place that I couldn't use an IR Light with the scope the purchase would never have been made. I would have saved up for thermal, plain and simple.

I would recommend you go to the Game and Fish advisory meetings that are going on currently. They are scheduled all over the state. If enough people bring this issue up, maybe it will get pushed through on the Game and Fishes recommendation. I have also gone ahead and sent an email to one of the district 2 reps that lives right here in Stanley to see if there is anything he could do to get an exception put in place to the ND Century Code that restricts the use of artificial Illumination. I would recommend that if the Game and Fish does not give you a favorable response, contact your local reps.
 
This is the email that I sent to one of the reps for district 2

Hello Mr. Longmuir. I was wondering if we could talk sometime about possibly gettting a change made to 20.1-01-08. of the ND century code. Right now as it reads it prohibits the use of any artificially produced light to aid in the taking of furbearers, except for raccoons and beaver.

The change I would like to discuss with you would be to make it legal to use Infrared Light when using Night Vision. Last year, the ND Legislature approved the use of night vision(NV) and thermal optics for the taking of coyotes. What was not approved was the IR lights that go along with the NV scopes. It doesn't make sense to me that NV scopes would be approved for use, but not the IR light necessary to use it in most situations. The two go to hand in hand. Can a NV scope be used without an IR light? Yes, but it requires snow on the ground and a full moon to make it even remotely close to useful. An IR light used in conjunction with a NV scope makes it much easier to locate and identify a target before the trigger is pulled.



Please forgive me as I'm not real sure how this whole process works. I just know that I love to hunt and help local ranchers control predator populations. I just want to make it as efficient and safe as possible. Please feel free to call me or email me if you would like to talk about this. I live in Stanley and would love to talk with you about this.




Thank you for your time.
 
I did hear back from my local rep Donald Longmuir. He said he was going to contact the Deputy Director of the Game and Fish department Scott Peterson and see if they would be up for giving a recommendation to get this pushed through. He thinks that if we can get the game and fish on board it would help speed the process along big time.

I spent about 15 minutes on the phone with Don and explained the whole situation to him and he agreed that it was kind of crazy that NV was legalized, but not the IR lights necessary to use NV. He figured it was just overlooked during the process and didn't figure it would be too much trouble to get it changed. He did however say it would take a while. like 2019.

I would definitely recommend contacting your local representatives to let them know you would like this to be addressed. The more people we can get pushing on this to get it changed the better.

Here is a list of the district representatives
http://www.legis.nd.gov/assembly/65-2017/members/members-by-district
 
Welp, today Mr. Longmuir was able to get a letter sent off to Mr. Peterson with the NDGF. He included my original email with it and requested their input on what route to take with it. Hopefully their response is favorable and they will help push it through...
 
Today Mr. Longmuire called me and he asked that I contact Scott Peterson, the assistant director of the Game and Fish so I did. Mr. Peterson seemed very open to the idea of allowing IR lights, but he admitted that he, along with many others at the Game and Fish just don't know enough about NV, Thermal and Infrared Lights. I spent about 15 minutes on the phone with him explaining why it is necessary and a few of the small details involved with NV/IR light usage.

He did state that approving the use of IR lights with NV equipment is something that the game and fish could push through via the annual furbearer proclamation that the governor has to sign every year and in fact that is how NV and Thermal were approved for use. He is going to get some meetings going within the department to research and discuss the options for IR usage. He did state though, that the main concern they might have is that they may view this as another step towards spotlighting and spotlighting is not something they are willing to support at this time.

All in all I got a pretty good vibe from the call and I am optimistic that things will go well!
 
Ok well I contacted one of my local representatives and I’ll try and get my hunting buddy to do it to. I’m going to try and call famenfish and see what I get out of them. I think the more numbers we get calling about this stuff the better our luck would be of getting this stuff passed.
 
Definitely contact the game and fish. If you can, get your local rep to contact them as well. I think the more reps we get contacting them, the more likely it is that it will be changed via the furbearer proclamation route rather than the legislative route.
 
He emailed me saying he would look into it. Who knows if he really will or not but I left him my phone number if he wants to talk to me about it any further. I’ll contact game n fish Monday.
 
Ok I got some more information from the guy I contacted in my district he has been emailing me back and forth this weekend I am actually very impressed with this. Hears what the final email said.
This was in Rep. Porters committee. Please see below.

If it’s built in and part of the scope it’s legal. We had some discussion on the topics and deadlines had passed. Game n fish addressed it and with rules allowing the type that are built in type.

I’m not opposed to the red or blue lights to enhance infrared, the law as it stands was designed to stop shinning, before the new technology existed.
Thanks
Todd

So I contacted Rick C Becker Friday nite he contacted me Saturday morning telling me he would check into it. Saturday morning he forwarded my email to Todd Porter saying what are your thoughts on this guys comments. And above is what Todd emailed Rick then Rick emailed me Todd’s Response this morning. Anyways what are your guys thoughts on this? Aren’t most of the infrared lights on the nightvision scopes external? Would that be considered part of the scope? I’m going to stop in the game n fish office and show them these emails and see what they say. They flat out told me that infrared lights weren’t legal but what these guys are saying it’s kind of confusing. But then again I am very impressed that I have got a response quit quickly and on a weekend at that. Anyways we will see were it goes with game n fish.
 
From what I gather, there are many NV units with built in IR, but from what I was told when I talked to the lady with the enforcement division of the Game and Fish department, any artificial illumination is illegal... It's hard to tell what is right and what isn't.

Keep on pushing man, the more people you talk to about it, hopefully the better the response will be.
 
Yep I agree they told me it was illegal also. Put the way these guys are making it sound it’s legal. I’ll see what game nfish says.
 
Hey guys and gals, ND now has a proposal on the board to allow artificial infrared illumination, as well as red, amber, and green filtered light for hunting coyotes at night. It basically just gives coyotes and fox the same light laws as raccoon and beaver and adds lights on the infrared and green spectrum into the mix. I'll put a link to the proposed bill at the end of this post. I urge any of you from ND to read it, it's pretty basic, and if you support it I ask that you please contact your local representatives and request that they get behind the bill. It is Senate Bill #2058 for the 2019 session. Thanks!

https://www.legis.nd.gov/assembly/66-2019/documents/19-0501-01000.pdf
 
I have a few questions, how do you make sure there isn't a tractor, building or worse a person sitting down range 600-800 yards with a red or amber light ?
 
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