Fireforming with Cream of Wheat?
- Thread starter pyscodog
- Start date
Originally Posted By: SledgeBeen there, done that and won't do it again. Tried it in my .243 AI. Waste of time, stinks and tough to clean up. My results are way better just loading an actual round and shooting it.
The clean up after was what I was curious about. Seems like burnt COW would be a Btch to clean up.
The clean up after was what I was curious about. Seems like burnt COW would be a Btch to clean up.
Depends on what you are fireforming. If it's something like a 243 AI from standard 243, then I'd just shoot standard ammo to fireform.
I used COW to fireform some 400 Whelen brass when I first had mine. I didn't have dies yet and needed brass to send to CH4D to measure so I could order the correct dies. I used 30-06 brass and 16.8 grains of Bullseye (I worked up from 12 until I got well filled out cases). And 16.8 was what one of my Little Dandy rotors dropped. I annealed the brass beforehand and then used a 41 magnum die to neck size the cases. I checked the bore every ten shot but was surprised to find there was very little in the barrel. I did clean it every 20 shots just to be sure. The little bit of residue wiped right out with one pass of a patch damp with Hoppes #9. Clean up is really a non issue.
I have since gotten my dies and have secured plenty of Quality Cartridge 400 Whelen brass as well as a nice bunch of Norma 30-06 cylindrical and no longer need to fireform brass.
I used COW to fireform some 400 Whelen brass when I first had mine. I didn't have dies yet and needed brass to send to CH4D to measure so I could order the correct dies. I used 30-06 brass and 16.8 grains of Bullseye (I worked up from 12 until I got well filled out cases). And 16.8 was what one of my Little Dandy rotors dropped. I annealed the brass beforehand and then used a 41 magnum die to neck size the cases. I checked the bore every ten shot but was surprised to find there was very little in the barrel. I did clean it every 20 shots just to be sure. The little bit of residue wiped right out with one pass of a patch damp with Hoppes #9. Clean up is really a non issue.
I have since gotten my dies and have secured plenty of Quality Cartridge 400 Whelen brass as well as a nice bunch of Norma 30-06 cylindrical and no longer need to fireform brass.
Smokeless
New member
Originally Posted By: pyscodog243AI
The AI is designed to fire form parent cases. However, every shot can count as barrel life could be measured in the hundreds of rounds.
I've done it both ways. Both give the same result, a fire formed case. A full house 243 load will yield a more crisp fire forming IMO. They are just as accurate as the AI, and are productive.
The cream o wheat or corn meal loads are no problem to clean up after and save a bit on a barrel, but unless your using the rifle for competition, 50 rounds of formed cases is usually enough. Heck even 100 rounds isn't a big deal in the big scope of things.
I would load and shoot, but that's just me.
The AI is designed to fire form parent cases. However, every shot can count as barrel life could be measured in the hundreds of rounds.
I've done it both ways. Both give the same result, a fire formed case. A full house 243 load will yield a more crisp fire forming IMO. They are just as accurate as the AI, and are productive.
The cream o wheat or corn meal loads are no problem to clean up after and save a bit on a barrel, but unless your using the rifle for competition, 50 rounds of formed cases is usually enough. Heck even 100 rounds isn't a big deal in the big scope of things.
I would load and shoot, but that's just me.
I use to have a 243AI but when I sold it, I sold brass and dies with it. I bought this rifle under the impression it was a standard 243 but after the first round fired I found out different.I have no idea of past history other than the rifle is in very good condition. I was just thinking the COW method might just extend barrel life, but like you say, 50-100 rounds probably won't matter to much.
14-15g of bullseye, fill with cream of wheat, put a piece of paper towel in the case mouth.
This method saves barrel life.
Clean with a good bronze bristle brush.
When p. dog shooting, I usually fire formed my brass with 47g of Win 760, cci 250, 70g nosler, TNT, or Berger 69g.
Same for 6 rem ai, 17 ah, 6/250 AI, and 22/250 AI.
My 280 AI's, I use 15g of Bullseye and COW.
IN one afternoon, I fired formed 1000 of the 22/250 AI with Cream of wheat, quenched barrel in a 6 Gallon bucket of water, I thought that the wood was going to catch on fire. I Cleaned with barrel with JB when I was done, killed another 100+ coyotes with that barrel before it gave up the ghost, 55g Sierra BTHP with 760 shot 1/2" groups.
The leade gets shot out in a 243 AI within 2000 rounds.
I also hunted coyotes while fire forming brass in the 22/250 AI, 243 AI, 6 Rem AI, and 25/06 AI. Forming loads were usually 1.0-1.5g less than a formed load for best accuracy. NEVER fire form with a light load, never. Work up your best accuracy fire forming just like you would any other load, you want the pressure up.
This method saves barrel life.
Clean with a good bronze bristle brush.
When p. dog shooting, I usually fire formed my brass with 47g of Win 760, cci 250, 70g nosler, TNT, or Berger 69g.
Same for 6 rem ai, 17 ah, 6/250 AI, and 22/250 AI.
My 280 AI's, I use 15g of Bullseye and COW.
IN one afternoon, I fired formed 1000 of the 22/250 AI with Cream of wheat, quenched barrel in a 6 Gallon bucket of water, I thought that the wood was going to catch on fire. I Cleaned with barrel with JB when I was done, killed another 100+ coyotes with that barrel before it gave up the ghost, 55g Sierra BTHP with 760 shot 1/2" groups.
The leade gets shot out in a 243 AI within 2000 rounds.
I also hunted coyotes while fire forming brass in the 22/250 AI, 243 AI, 6 Rem AI, and 25/06 AI. Forming loads were usually 1.0-1.5g less than a formed load for best accuracy. NEVER fire form with a light load, never. Work up your best accuracy fire forming just like you would any other load, you want the pressure up.
wormydog1724
Member
It's not a scientific test but I shot groups with fire formed brass vs brass only ran through the forming die for my 20 Tactical. Same loads. Both groups were sub-moa and pretty much same POI.
Yes, my fire forming loads were always sub 1/2 MOA. The 243 AI fire forming loads were in the .375 group area and less.
AA2700 works as good as Win 760, they both meter like water.
243 AI and 6 Rem AI are excellent coyote and deer cartridges, i put the 6 AI on the long actions which has never bothered me one bit.
As a varmint hunter, you could just hunt with forming loads and be very, very happy. Accuracy and velocity with fire forming loads seem to be higher than the parent case...just work up a load for fire forming for accuracy, and in every AI I have hunted with, the best accuracy is right up there where you start to find pressure. Kiss the lands with the bullet of course.
AI chambers are supposed to be shorter than the parent case by .004. I make mine shorter than that to give a slight engagement feel when on the bottom of the bolt closing. New brass will vary in Head space length, so I like to eliminate any case stretching, so 50 firings from now, the brass is still going strong.
I wish every coyote hunter could own a 243 AI/6 Rem AI, and a 22/250 AI. The only thing better would be a 22/243 AI, 22-6 Rem AI shooting 80g A max. Coyotes, Crows, deer, and hogs all in very bad trouble.
AA2700 works as good as Win 760, they both meter like water.
243 AI and 6 Rem AI are excellent coyote and deer cartridges, i put the 6 AI on the long actions which has never bothered me one bit.
As a varmint hunter, you could just hunt with forming loads and be very, very happy. Accuracy and velocity with fire forming loads seem to be higher than the parent case...just work up a load for fire forming for accuracy, and in every AI I have hunted with, the best accuracy is right up there where you start to find pressure. Kiss the lands with the bullet of course.
AI chambers are supposed to be shorter than the parent case by .004. I make mine shorter than that to give a slight engagement feel when on the bottom of the bolt closing. New brass will vary in Head space length, so I like to eliminate any case stretching, so 50 firings from now, the brass is still going strong.
I wish every coyote hunter could own a 243 AI/6 Rem AI, and a 22/250 AI. The only thing better would be a 22/243 AI, 22-6 Rem AI shooting 80g A max. Coyotes, Crows, deer, and hogs all in very bad trouble.
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DannoBoone
Active member
Originally Posted By: wormydog1724It's not a scientific test but I shot groups with fire formed brass vs brass only ran through the forming die for my 20 Tactical. Same loads. Both groups were sub-moa and pretty much same POI.
Ditto! My best group to date was shot with newly down-sized .223 IMI
brass!
Ditto! My best group to date was shot with newly down-sized .223 IMI
brass!