.204 vs. .17 Fireball

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Ceelatrans

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I have used different calibers for coyote hunting (.222, .22-250, .221 and .223). Hits from these sometimes require sewing skills I do not care to exercise.

Recently, I been using the .17 Rem Fireball. No, pelt damage. However, I have had two animals jump up and run off after solid hits @200+yds-- I followed one 2 miles and it never stopped once. Both were frontal quartering chest shots. I am wondering if the Fireball has the moxie needed to put a coyote down when you hit bone (like a shoulder) at longer yards?

I am reconsidering options. Has anyone shot a large enough sample size of coyotes with .204 to tell me what happens to pelts when shots are close and what happens to the coyote when shots are long?

Thanks. This is my first posting. Great site!
 
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Quartering chest with a centerfire 17 is a 50/50 deal best to wait or move onto the center neck. Most often the core may make it into the chest but usually ends up between the scapula and rib cage. I run my Mach 4 about 3200 with a 25 hornady and 200 is about as far as I like to push it.
 
I suggest trying the Speer 52gr HP Flatbase in your .224's very seldom do I get a exit with it unless I get real close to the edges. It has been a favorite of a lot of pelt hunters for a long time. I think it has been around 50+ years.
 
Quote:I am wondering if the Fireball has the moxie needed to put a coyote down when you hit bone (like a shoulder) at longer yards?

You will see most 17 cal shooters say it is a shot placement cartridge. Don't count on it going thru bone. I ran my 17 Mach IV around 3700 with 25gr Match Bergers and 25gr Hornady HP's. Chan Nagal makes some great 25gr bullets too. What bullet are you using.

If you are wanting better knockdown and sometimes hitting bone, I suggest a 22-250 and 55gr Sierra SBT,s or Nosler 55gr BT's. Hornady 55gr spt's are good too. But you may have to sew a little with these three.
 
What bullet and weight were you using when you had the run offs ?

EDIT: I am shooting 25 gr Hornady V-MAX and HP. Though this is a new rifle for me I have taken several coyotes with it, even one with the 20 gr factory load. It was DRT but I will not shoot that load again unless the coyote is under 75 yards.

I have tried to keep my shots at under 250 and have done so. I also really try for broadside shots only. I have shot 2 with the HP bullet that were facing me, one at 110 and one at 60 both laser ranged. Both DRT amazing damage from shot but no exit. I shot both in the upper chest sort of aiming just below the coyote's lower jaw.

All the others were hit either in the neck, just behind the shoulder or just a bit forward and high in front of the shoulder in the center of the neck. Shots on those went from 50 or so yards out to laser measured 220. Truthfully there were some drop and bounce but none of them got up.

I will admit I am much more careful with shot placement with the 17 then with any of my other rifles.
 
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I am shooting 27g. Golds over 19.4g H335. Rifle shoots circa 1/2"MOA with that load.

I did shoot an 85 lbs wolf with that rifle/bullet and hit bone. But, I only took a bite out of the edge of a rib on the way in (1/2 the diameter of a .17 bullet out of the rib edge). He did not run off.

I completely agree about shot placement; however, there are times when you can feel the coyote is about to go to Defcon 1 and you take that shoulder shot...

Regarding the .224s. Thanks for the advice, but I have been that route, tried many kinds of bullets and 4 different calibers and do not plan to ever go back.

Still would like to hear from folks that have shot a large sample size of coyotes with the .204, what happens when the coyote is 30 yds. away, and when it is at 300 yds.

Thanks for all the responses, great to hear different views.
 
.204. I shot a couple last year with the 32gr. Varmagedon. They were about 90 yards out. They ran about 40 yards and piled up. Shot placement was middle of the chest in line with the front leg. One hole in only. I'm going to try the 39 gr Speer HP this year when I get my .204 threaded for the suppressor. I want to try a little heavier bullet. I tried the 35 gr. Berger and lost the first coyote I shot. A lot of guys swear by them and maybe this was just a fluke that it got away. Rudy
 
I don't have 100's of Coyotes shot with my 204, but I have enough to know that I like it. I've used the 35gr. Berger and the now out of business 37gr. CRT. Runners were short runs with most DRT. Also 1 Bobcat with the 204. It was setting facing me and it just flipped it over backwards with an instant lights out.
I like the 35gr Bergers, but Blackhole Bullets was working on a 37gr.hp with the intent of equaling the CRT bullet. I would sure look into that one.
I'm a huge fan of the 17 Rem. and love Chan Nagels 25gr.hp's along with his 30gr.hp.
I'm not a dedicated fur hunter anymore, but if I was the 17-204 would be the way I would go and I would never look back.
 
In my 204, I only shoot the 35gr Bergers, with a hot load. It shoots under 3/4".

I have only had one really nasty damaged coyote. I shot it in the butt and had a huge splash. Most others drop either on the spot or very short runs. Occasionally I hit a front shoulder and get a runner. It (204 Ruger) seems to hit with more authority over the 17 with a 25gr bullet. I also shoot a 17-204 only using 30gr bullets and love that rifle. It is maybe my mostest bestest favorite!
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However I still take some of my other rifles out or they get jealous.
 
I work in the oilfield and until just recently we were allowed to carry rifles with us. I carried a 204 for about 7 years and have shot a fair amount of coyotes with it. 39gr Blitzkings rarely exit at close range. At longer distances like 150 yds on they will exit most of the time. When they do exit it leaves a decent size hole. There are very few runners with the Blitzkings.
 
I think you will be disappointed in the .204 over time and although I have shot less than a 100 coyotes and quite a few Bobcats with the 20 tactical(same thing really) I am really basing that off Mike Granger's experience with the .204. If you do a search Mike used the .204 up in Montana for several years with his Tolling dogs and he finally gave up and back to the 220 swift. He is also concerned about fur damage which is what reminded me he has been there done that.
 
I may have been a little short with my answer about stringing steel, it is the only way to get undamaged pelts.

I don't care what cartridge you use you will be making a comprimise, NONE of them are the perfect pelt hunting round. You are going to have to deal with sewing splashes or pass throughs at times which can be minimized with bullet selection, some think past throughs with small exits are the ticket, I'm in the keep them in the critter crowd. I hunt for pelts and have two bullets that perform for me, the 40gr NBT in my 22-204 at around 3950fps and the 52gr Speer HP FB in my 222Rem, 5.6x50R Mag and 22-250, for me it has been a magic bullet doing a good job unless I get real close to the edges. I do try and keep all my shots under 200 yards and these seem to do the job up close also. Going small with the 17's will get you results but you then have to deal with limited range, more precise bullet placement or runners. The 204 to me is a great varmint round but when it comes to coyotes it seems you have to go heavy to get results and then what is the difference between a 22-204/223AI with 40gr NBT(I think is the only 40 stout enough for coyotes) or 40's in the 204.
 
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Much thanks to one and all...I will be thinking about your advice throughout this season as I continue to evaluate the performance of my little .17 FB. With that accumulating experience and all of your advice in mind, I can make a an informed decision which way to go. Thanks!
 
I've been shooting a 204 exclusively for 4 yrs now. Over a hundred coyotes shot. Only 2 runners 1 of those I recovered. All other hits resulted in DRT coyotes. My recipe a 32 sierra blitzking launched at just over 4000 fps. Coyotes have been 40 yards to almost 500 yards. Previously I was using 35 gr. bergers and was experiencing a few runners. I dont feel undergunned with a 204. I should include though that shot placement is critical, try to stay away from shoulders and slip it in between ribs or if their straight on right at the base of the neck works well.
 
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By the way (and changing the subject), I am interested in night vision/FLIR sights. I have hunted at night using moonlight quite a bit but not with any vision aids and so know nothing about the commercially available night vision and FLIR devices. Perhaps this is the wrong Forum to pose these questions, but could someone please tell me the rudimentary information about them, like: Are they best used on rifles or shotguns? How effective are they? What is the least expensive but still effective way to get into one.

Incidentally, I live where it is very, very cold during the fur season, if that matters.
 
Originally Posted By: CeelatransI am wondering if the Fireball has the moxie needed to put a coyote down when you hit bone (like a shoulder) at longer yards?



Nope. Hit them like that with a 17 they usually do what you described.

I've shot a bunch with the .204 Using 40gr Noslers I had pretty good results even hitting a shoulder. The other bullets I tried (35gr Berger, 39gr BlitzKing) although a bit more accurate didn't perform as well when you caught a shoulder.
 
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