If I were the devil

I don't understand what caused the cells to mutate.
Then what caused them to mutate in the right direction to become an eye.

You mean certain cells mutated to become an eye.
Others mutated to become an ear. others mutated to become a nose. And so on.

What would you say the odds of all this coming together is?
Just seems like to much to think cells mutated in the right direction to make so many different plants and animals of such perfect design.

Just think. If the first simple being to start accumulating light receptor cells had run into a rock and skinned his head right where the cells were no telling how long it would have taken to get that perfect set of mutations again.
Just seems awfully complicated.

You would think that the creatures that could see first would have eaten all the poor little things that did not have eyes yet.


I understand what you are saying I think but I still don't see why a cell would mutate into a light receptor cell. How did it know to do that?
 
tn,
Thank you for the concern for our friend. She is at Cleveland Clinic today for a second opinion on a course of treatment.


Now, why don’t you just drop the whole evolution thing?
As long as you believe the earth is six thousand years old you’ll never grasp the concept-even if you wanted to-which you don’t.

Just stick to the things you know about and explain how Jesus failed to fulfill his ultimate prophecy in Matthew.

“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” - Matthew 24:34

*

You haven’t told us what you think about this one either:

Originally Posted By: fw707tnshootist,
Please don’t think that means I don’t value your opinion.
I’d really like to hear what you think about predestination/election vs. salvation by free will.


*
 
I know you consider me an ignorant hick.
Thats fine.
I did however grasp the concept many years ago.I have just never been able to buy into it. Evolution is way complicated. To think that all things evolved from nothing to what is now just does not seem possible. To think that in all those cases just by chance everything fell into place is to much. The answer for that is always millions of years but it would seem to me that the longer it takes the more chance there is that something can go wrong.


I know you can never back off the evolution thing because if there is no God then evolution is all there is to explain existence.
I have thought about all this stuff more than you might think. I always come back to the same question.
The spark of life.
As far back in time as you want to go my question is always where did that come from. No matter how things are explained,the big boom or whatever where did that come from.

If you are honest with yourself you will conclude that no matter how it is explained those first elements had to come from somewhere.

Think about that.
They had to come from somewhere.If you go back in time to the tiniest atom it had to come from somewhere.

In the beginning there was God.
Only thing that makes sense.

Now FW.
If you will drop your crusade I will move on as well.
 
Originally Posted By: tnshootistI know you consider me an ignorant hick.
Thats fine.


No sir, I do not, and I never have.
But some of your comments and “questions” about evolution could very likely cause other folks here to think that.

Originally Posted By: tnshootist

In the beginning there was God.
Only thing that makes sense.


Ok, let’s just call it magic since nothing else seems to fit.
thumbup1.gif


Originally Posted By: tnshootistNow FW.
If you will drop your crusade I will move on as well.


The only crusade was on your side of the fence almost a thousand years ago.

You keep making statements and assertions as if they were facts, and they all come from your bible.
I don’t think it’s the least bit unreasonable to ask you to use your bible to prove these assertions, since you assert them as facts that you say will affect the lives of folks who don’t agree with you.

Can you start with the predestination/election doctrine? It’s alive and well and has a large following.
Fursniper dismissed it as a cult, but that seems to make it really easy to dismiss other denominations of Christianity as cults just because a few details are different than his.

*



*
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: fw707tn,
Thank you for the concern for our friend. She is at Cleveland Clinic today for a second opinion on a course of treatment.


Now, why don’t you just drop the whole evolution thing?
As long as you believe the earth is six thousand years old you’ll never grasp the concept-even if you wanted to-which you don’t.

Just stick to the things you know about and explain how Jesus failed to fulfill his ultimate prophecy in Matthew.

“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” - Matthew 24:34

*

You haven’t told us what you think about this one either:

Originally Posted By: fw707tnshootist,
Please don’t think that means I don’t value your opinion.
I’d really like to hear what you think about predestination/election vs. salvation by free will.


*

If you put "Generation" into context. Jesus hasn't failed to do anything. His words in Matthew 24:34 are referring to the future. Or what is to come on the last day. Generation is referring to "The Age" or "This Nation".

Matthew 24:30
And then at last, the sign that the Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens, and there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth. And they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31
And He will send out His angels with the mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather His chosen ones from all over the world--from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.
32
Now learn a lesson from the fig tree. When its branches bud and its leaves begin to sprout, you know that summer is near.
33
In the same way, when you see all these things, you can know His return is very near, right at the door.
34
I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass from the scene until all these things take place.
35
Heaven and earth will disappear, but my words will never disappear.
36
However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or the Son himself. Only the Father knows.

So, "Generation" is "The Age" or "The Nation Israel" will not pass from the scene, or "away".

We are still in the "Church" age. The nation of Israel is still in existence.


That's the best way I can explain Matthew 24:34.
I will pray for you and your friend.

 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Savage250Originally Posted By: fw707tn,
Thank you for the concern for our friend. She is at Cleveland Clinic today for a second opinion on a course of treatment.


Now, why don’t you just drop the whole evolution thing?
As long as you believe the earth is six thousand years old you’ll never grasp the concept-even if you wanted to-which you don’t.

Just stick to the things you know about and explain how Jesus failed to fulfill his ultimate prophecy in Matthew.

“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” - Matthew 24:34

*

You haven’t told us what you think about this one either:

Originally Posted By: fw707tnshootist,
Please don’t think that means I don’t value your opinion.
I’d really like to hear what you think about predestination/election vs. salvation by free will.


*

If you put "Generation" into context. Jesus hasn't failed to do anything. His words in Matthew 24:34 are referring to the future. Or what is to come on the last day. Generation is referring to "The Age" or "This Nation".

Matthew 24:30
And then at last, the sign that the Son of Man is coming will appear in the heavens, and there will be deep mourning among all the peoples of the earth. And they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31
And He will send out His angels with the mighty blast of a trumpet, and they will gather His chosen ones from all over the world--from the farthest ends of the earth and heaven.
32
Now learn a lesson from the fig tree. When its branches bud and its leaves begin to sprout, you know that summer is near.
33
In the same way, when you see all these things, you can know His return is very near, right at the door.
34
I tell you the truth, this generation will not pass from the scene until all these things take place.
35
Heaven and earth will disappear, but my words will never disappear.
36
However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or the Son himself. Only the Father knows.

So, "Generation" is "The Age" or "The Nation Israel" will not pass from the scene, or "away".

We are still in the "Church" age. The nation of Israel is still in existence.

Also, Jesus is not a prophet. So, His words in Matthew 24:34 are not prophecy, they are fact. They WILL happen.

That's the best way I can explain Matthew 24:34.
I will pray for you and your friend.




Seems like I was asking a question you don’t have a definite answer for-just another interpretation of a divinely inspired text:




“The expression “all these things” refers to the signs the Lord had given. And “all these things” — the signs — were to be accomplished before “this generation” passed away.

The question is — what is the meaning of “this generation”? Dispensationalists are fond of saying that “generation” has reference to “race,” hence, it is merely an allusion to the Jewish race. Accordingly, the Lord was indicating that these signs would be fulfilled while the Jewish race was being preserved (cf. The Scofield Reference Bible).
Such a view of “generation,” however, is at variance with the use of that word in the New Testament. In their Greek Lexicon, Arndt and Gingrich comment that genea (“generation”) refers basically to “the sum total of those born at the same time, expanded to include all those living at a given time generation, contemporaries” (1967, 153). A survey of several passages in Matthew’s gospel will quickly confirm this (cf. Mt. 11:16; 12:39, 41, 42, 45; 16:4; 17:17; 23:36).

Clearly then, the signs of the Olivet lesson were confined to the first century.”


https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/1588-this-generation-shall-not-pass-away


*
 
Originally Posted By: tnshootistWell Same ole same ole.

I think I will move on even if you don't.
I grow tired of your game.

Yeah I think moving on would be the best thing for you to do.
You have never provided any evidence whatsoever to support your claims.
 
Originally Posted By: swampwalkerSpeaking of blasting a trumpet.. definitely should have avoided that hotdog stand this afternoon..

Spicy brown mustard?

lol.gif
 


Originally Posted By: tnshootistYou just have no class.

And you have no evidence.



“Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence. “

Richard Dawkins

thumbup1.gif


*
 
Well I asked you for answers and you have given none. Not one.
Why? Because you have none. The best you can do is quote your liberal mentors.

Proof. I hardly think the opinion of Dawkins could be called proof.

Answer one question. Where did everything start. The first element. Where did that come from.
Put up or shut up.
Answer the question.
Just one simple question.


It dont matter if it was millions of year ago or last week.
where did the first element that everything else sprang from come from.
No cop out jargon like usual
Give an answer.
 
Originally Posted By: fw707How about Matthew 24:34?

Did Jesus Wrongly Predict a First
Century Return in Matthew 24:34?

“Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.” - Matthew 24:34

If you want to see some contortions trying to explain one of the worst errors (maybe the worst ever) in your inerrant book you can read them here on a Christian apologetics site:

http://www.thingstocome.org/whatgen.htm

The author wrote a short novel about "full and partial Preterists" attempting to defend a scriptural screw up that even C.S. Lewis wouldn't touch.

Maybe you can explain it all in 2 or 3 sentences like you did the predestination/elect issue-
with absolutely no evidence except your personal interpretation enlightenment.

OK then. I'll explain Matthew 24:34 using your references for evidence. Your link below shows that Jesus did not wrongly predict a second coming.

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/1588-this-generation-shall-not-pass-away

The Olivet Sermon is divided into 2 major sections.

First, Jesus explained the impending destruction of Jerusalem and the “signs” that would herald that event (Matthew 24:4-14). The destruction of Jerusalem then occurred around 70AD, about 40 years after the death of Jesus. All of the signs that Jesus gave were fulfilled and that generation of people in Jerusalem were killed by the Romans.

Second, Jesus spoke of his final return and the lack of signs that would characterize that occasion (Matthew 24:35-36). Jesus declared that only the Father knows the day and the hour of the second coming. No time indicators were given to signal his return. Judgment day would catch men unaware.
 
Originally Posted By: tnshootist
It dont matter if it was millions of year ago or last week.
where did the first element that everything else sprang from come from.
No cop out jargon like usual
Give an answer.


How the heck would I know? Science hasn't found a definite answer yet, and your "theory" is just magical and supernatural trash.
So I don't guess anybody knows.
The only thing for 100% certain is the fact that you have never provided even one shred of evidence to support your supernatural assertions. They are still the same fantasies they have always been.

You see, up until a short time back in history, there was this thing called "The Church". When anybody asked the question you just asked they were burned at the stake, so not a lot of folks asked. You know, stuff like the Inquisition, heresy, and witch trials kinda stifled the discussion.

That lasted over 1700 years, and then folks got up enough nerve to start asking. So they wondered and discussed it for a while, and then a little over a hundred years ago they started developing technology capable of actually looking and learning.

So, let's give science the same 1700 year time frame to research the subject that "The Church" had to suppress it and see what happens.

If you really are interested you can read some good stuff here on the ongoing research:

http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20161026-the-secret-of-how-life-on-earth-began

But I don't expect you'll read it.
You probably think you'll go to he11 for clicking on the link.
grin.gif



But isn't it great that you got to ask the question and you won't be burned at the stake?

*
 
well one guess why I don't try to answer your questions.
You would just ridicule.
I tried to tell you of the journey I have made and why I came to believe as I do. Your response. Ridicule.
You can pick apart the Bible without my help.
You are not ready to discuss the Bible.
You don't even understand faith and how a man could come to believe.You are not ready for details.
Until you can consider Jesus Without ridicule there is no point.

When a man has only ridicule and quotes from the odd prof and liberal he don't have much.


Look at science a little more and you will find scientist who have come to the conclusion that after all creation is the only explanation that works. Science will never be able to explain how the beginning came to be without creation..It don't matter if they have millions of years. Science can't do it.There will always be that next step. Like finding the end of space. There is not one.It don't matter who you are thats a fact.

Of course those scientist are wrong and the others are right.I would hate to have to tip toe through life picking and choosing which facts to believe and which facts may change.
You can't know from one day to the next what you believe.
No wonder you are such an angry man.
As for the beginning I understand that you don't know.And if you don't know that then your whole theory falls apart. You can't just pick up something like the existence of all life in the middle and work both ways to make the ends meet. Thats not science.

Do a little research into what physicist say about the "Supernatural". Time. Different planes of time. Not saying I buy it all but a scientist such as yourself would most certainly be forced to defend the science behind their theory's.
So,there goes the ridicule of the supernatural set straight by science.
And no I am not going to post all this for you. Do your own research. Way to much info to post here.Try Google.

And no I don't care in the slightest if you believe me. Be my guest. Look it up.
 
Originally Posted By: Fursniper


OK then. I'll explain Matthew 24:34 using your references for evidence. Your link below shows that Jesus did not wrongly predict a second coming.

https://www.christiancourier.com/articles/1588-this-generation-shall-not-pass-away


Yeah, I read it before I posted it.
Lots of contortions going on, but they got 'er done, didn't they?
grin.gif


XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

They took a different route to "explain" it here:

http://www.bereanbiblechurch.org/transcripts/eschatology/bbc_story.htm

The Birth of a Preterist Church
Delivered 04/25/1999
The Story of Berean Bible Church's Inception

What's your take on "preterists" and "full preterists", and their assertion that the second coming has already occurred-in 2 different ways?
Maybe just more cults by your definition?

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

And 7 of the common "rationalizations" are listed here:

https://blacknonbelievers.wordpress.com/jesus-failed-prophecy-about-his-return/


Rationalization #7: Maybe in our human understanding we don’t know what Jesus meant when he said “this general would not pass away” and that “some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom”. He couldn’t have meant he was coming in the first century because he hasn’t come back yet and that would make him a false prophet.
"This rationalization is nothing more than interpreting the Bible by a doctrine you want to be true. If you’re going to believe in the Jesus of the Bible, shouldn’t you base your doctrines on what the Bible actually says? It is self-deceit to look at Jesus’ “prophecy” detailing his return in the lifetime of his disciples and rationalize why it didn’t happen. Only a mind interested in maintaining the illusion of faith could twist and mangle the plain words of the Bible the way Christians have in an attempt to make the incredible credible. An honest mind looking at the facts would have no choice but to admit that Jesus’ prophecy of the end of days has failed to come true."


All I see is a failed prophecy by Jesus himself, and failed attempts to defend it.
Just more of the jumbled up and man-made mess.

*
 
Originally Posted By: tnshootist
Do a little research into what physicist say about the "Supernatural". Time. Different planes of time. Not saying I buy it all but a scientist such as yourself would most certainly be forced to defend the science behind their theory's.



So did you find a little something in science that you like?
It must be tough to find something that doesn't contradict your "beliefs".


*
 
Last edited:
The archaeological discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls contain the original text of the bible that go back in time to the Old Testament. Advances in technology since the scrolls were found, are now allowing scientists to read the oldest biblical text ever found. The scrolls are proving the bible to be true. More is expected to be gleaned from them in the future.





 
Originally Posted By: Fursniper Advances in technology since the scrolls were found, are now allowing scientists to read the oldest biblical text ever found. The scrolls are proving the bible to be true.


Looks like science is proving the bible to be the same mess it always was.
Nothing new.

rolleyes.gif


*
 
Last edited:
Back
Top