Deep downwind in the timber

ANF Hunter

ANF Hunter

New member
Well i've been at it all summer, and have been skunked so far. i hunt the timber, and that's all there is around here. literally zero fields, so they're not even something i concern myself with. maybe a 50 yard opening or stone pit or something, but no big wide open spaces, and these coyotes very rarely allow themselves to be seen in those areas. these woods are the only national forest in PA, and as such, they draw in the forest tourists by the thousands. the population of my county probably increases 1000% during hunting seasons as every outdoorsy type from metropolitan areas for hundreds of miles comes here to hunt and enjoy the big woods. so.... the coyotes around here are not dumb, and most of them have seen or heard every trick in the book. my question is, do any of you timber hunters think it would be prudent to hunt deep downwind of the call? i'm talking like 200-300 yards if the remote can range that far? i believe i've called in a few coyotes over the summer, but they've circled downwind, far out of sight, and busted me. there's just nothing you can do about it when the woods are unbroken for miles in every direction and they circle you out of sight. i've been tossing the idea around for a couple years, but my wildfire II just won't allow me to get that far away from it. i just bought a Fusion with that fancy remote and i have pretty high hopes as far as the range of that tx1000. i'm going to give it a shot regardless, because there's really nothing to lose, but i just thought i'd ask for some opinions in the meantime. happy hunting
 
Bad idea... Get a second hunter stationed downwind. I call it a "tail gunner" and using the topography in your favor this second gunner can make 30%+ of the kills. But always have eyes on the caller...
 
I doubt if you could find any controller that will range that far in the open let alone in the woods. Ever consider trying a tree stand. Second shooter suggestion is probably the best option !
 
Well that's not the miracle answer I was looking for, but I'll yield to you two's experience. It's tough to come to terms with the fact that the coyote will never give you an easy setup here, and luck may well be the biggest contributor to success. I'll work on the setup, but lacking a reliable "tail gunner" I'll probably have to get used to consistently losing to old Wiley.
 
Same here, man. I'm not far either. I'm always down for hunting a new area.

If you could pinpoint their location and get in real close (I'm talking like 40-50 yards away), you might be able to get them to come right in. However, finding them sometimes is almost impossible now, unless they answer your call.

Question, are you hunting at night, or during the day? If you're only hunting timber, my suggestion is to only hunt during daylight hours, and when you walk in take your time, be as quiet as possible. Find paths or trails that limit breaking sticks or crashing through brush to your stand.
 
Originally Posted By: ANF Hunteri believe i've called in a few coyotes over the summer, but they've circled downwind, far out of sight, and busted me.

I have to ask, did you get a response to your howls to come to your conclusion? Were they barking at you from down wind? Or are you not seeing or hearing anything, and just speculating?

I'm not trying to be rude, but maybe they're just not around at the time you're calling. From studying my local pack this summer I noticed they made a loop back to my property every other month or so. After shooting at them three times this summer and missing, I don't expect them back until late October.
 
i stubbornly refuse to use a climbing treestand, although it might be a really good idea, simply based on the fact that i really don't want to carry anything else around with me and i can put on some miles. although this time of year, ladder stands seem to sprout up nearly everywhere you look in the woods, and i've been known to help myself to the view out of a few of those when i find them. i mainly hunt daylight, since the timber makes night hunting even more difficult than it already is. usually a response, followed by a group of squawking blue jays that moves from the area of the response to the area directly downwind of me is what tips me off. flushing birds and chattering squirrels in the area directly downwind of me also tend to ruffle me up a little. i'll figure it out eventually
 
Originally Posted By: ANF Hunteri stubbornly refuse to use a climbing treestand, although it might be a really good idea, simply based on the fact that i really don't want to carry anything else around with me and i can put on some miles. although this time of year, ladder stands seem to sprout up nearly everywhere you look in the woods, and i've been known to help myself to the view out of a few of those when i find them. i mainly hunt daylight, since the timber makes night hunting even more difficult than it already is. usually a response, followed by a group of squawking blue jays that moves from the area of the response to the area directly downwind of me is what tips me off. flushing birds and chattering squirrels in the area directly downwind of me also tend to ruffle me up a little. i'll figure it out eventually

You know, since you're already frustrated and not getting results, maybe try moving the minute you get a response. If it's in the distance, try to move closer to it. The worst that could happen is that they really are winding you and they won't come in. Or, maybe you'll get lucky and moving on them might make them second guess approaching. I've seen a group of hunters maneuver their way closer to coyotes in thick timber on more than one occasion. I won't name names, but they shotgun a lot of coyotes in thick brush down south.

Are you using an e-caller or mouth calls.
 
I only hunt timber aswell, no fields. I don't ever have the call more than 30-40 yards from my position. Lots of times they run right up to it.

I stick with coyote vocals and pup distress and it pulls them in close and fast, never had much luck with prey distress. Only killed one or two while prey distress was currently playing. Maybe they move in slower and circle further? I have no idea. With my current sequence I usually have a visual in the first minute, if they're there. I won't call unless their's a likely bedding area nearby, preferably a swail bog swamp.

One hunt a few years ago I sat with my back to a tree with the call at arms distance and had one run directly into me, shotgunned it at point blank range. Thick timber where you could probably only see 35 yards, that's why I put the call right next to me. Could hear the footsteps in the leaves and got ready and he came directly to the call, pinpoint. I don't think you'd see them outside shotgun range so it's usually the weapon of choice.

If you've got area's where you can get a high perch and look over open hardwoods with a rifle is good too. Sometimes you can pick one off at 300 yards that normally you wouldn't have seen. In the winter hunt the frozen over swamps, they usually produce.
 
Originally Posted By: Flesh EaterI have to ask, did you get a response to your howls to come to your conclusion? Were they barking at you from down wind? Or are you not seeing or hearing anything, and just speculating?

Believe it or not, in my experience if they howl back most of the time I don't end up seeing one. Conversely, MANY times like clockwork, I start my sequence with a "group howl (pick your favorite)" howl and then PAUSE the d*mn remote and be quiet. I usually reset the timer and let it go for five minutes of silence. So you got that right, one sound for about 15 seconds then silence.

Many guys are too quick to get in a frenzy of back and forth, which is ineffective. It's like they hear a howl then unleash the whole library of sounds and then are like W-T-F they didn't come??

You also mentioned conclusion, I always start with vocals and end with pup distress this has made me much more successful. 80% of the time, i'll let out a howl then pause, give it 60 seconds and they come trotting out like whole the h*ll is that? BANG. If that doesn't suck them in the pup distress at the end of my stand finish's the deal. Body language you can generally tell they're comfortable and somewhat curious. The pausing of the sound is the key because it then puts the ball in your court, they want to hear more but they're not getting it so they come check you out. I've found if they immediately howl back generally they just hold tight and wait for you to come check them out.

Works for me but to each his own. Had to come up with my own solutions for the east, what you see on youtube isn't it.
 
No need to have E-caller 200-300 yards from your set-up -remember your scent rises in the morning and falls in the evening know where your scent is at all times---Frozen Beaver ponds in winter produce well--- I love to sit on top of the Beaver House --Gives a great view no matter how big the pond is--Hardwood ridge looking down into swamp or marsh also is a producer--Don't forget the winter deer yards------------Happy Hunt'en GOOD LUCK---------- SVB
 
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Thanks for the advice and encouragement gentlemen. After what was probably some exceptional success last year (killing 6 and having the opportunity, but missing or being too slow to shoot 5 more) I've been grinding through 11 months of absolutely no success. I've been hearing them, and I think i've enticed a handful to at least investigate me from downwind, but frustration is really the theme lately. Hunting in these eastern woods is definitely not what you see on the coyote hunting videos of the internet. To answer a question - I usually use a foxpro wildfire II, but just bought a refurb fusion and haven't received it yet. I've had some luck with the unmentionable diaphragm calls, but honestly can't find a mouth blown call that sounds deep enough to mimic the coyotes I hear around here. Foxpro female deep howls is unquestionably the most productive sound I have ever used as far as getting a response, but in retrospect I probably call too much. I'll keep at it, and go with "less is more" because distress sounds have never really done me any favors..... at least not without a decoy, which is another story. Persistence is key, but it's tough when you're on the wrong side of it
 
A decoy for coyotes is about a 50/50 proposition. Half the time it's helpful... maybe. About half the time it spooks coyotes. A decoy is always good for calling cats. If all I were calling was coyotes I wouldn't bother with it.
 
Good advice as usual, GC. It's been a while since I've read that thread and I'm working back through it again. One thing I can say with certainty is that I won't be throwing in the towel any time soon...
 
Hey brother, if it was easy everybody would do it. We choose to hunt coyotes because it isn't easy, and because everybody can't and won't.
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Originally Posted By: LARUEminatiBelieve it or not, in my experience if they howl back most of the time I don't end up seeing one. Conversely, MANY times like clockwork, I start my sequence with a "group howl (pick your favorite)" howl and then PAUSE the d*mn remote and be quiet. I usually reset the timer and let it go for five minutes of silence. So you got that right, one sound for about 15 seconds then silence.

Many guys are too quick to get in a frenzy of back and forth, which is ineffective. It's like they hear a howl then unleash the whole library of sounds and then are like W-T-F they didn't come??

You also mentioned conclusion, I always start with vocals and end with pup distress this has made me much more successful. 80% of the time, i'll let out a howl then pause, give it 60 seconds and they come trotting out like whole the h*ll is that? BANG. If that doesn't suck them in the pup distress at the end of my stand finish's the deal. Body language you can generally tell they're comfortable and somewhat curious. The pausing of the sound is the key because it then puts the ball in your court, they want to hear more but they're not getting it so they come check you out. I've found if they immediately howl back generally they just hold tight and wait for you to come check them out.

Works for me but to each his own. Had to come up with my own solutions for the east, what you see on youtube isn't it.

The last two coyotes I've called in all responded to group yip howls, almost immediately. However, they were so close it sounded like a FoxPro at full volume replying. Once they replied, I sat tight for maybe 60 seconds, then hit pup distress and waited. Overall they came charging in, in less than 5 minutes from the time I set up. However, it's good to know you have success without hearing them as well. The hardest part about hunting thick timber is having enough eyes to cover all their possible approaches! My hearing isn't too good anymore, so hearing foot steps is highly unlikely.

Also, like you said, too many guys start throwing their entire library at these animals. I've had great success with minimal calling. I've also set my FoxPro up so it only plays once, then stops. It gives me time to hit the mute button and sit tight. Prey distress also hasn't done me any favors for coyotes. It works well on coon and fox, though, especially squeaks.
 
Most hardwoods are to open for them to expose themselves before catching the wind. Try calling thicker areas, where they have enough cover to approach the call. look for thick edges where you can call them out of, a lot of time they'll stick to where they have cover instead of circling wide. If they do circle it'll be in range if they feel they have an easy escape
 
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