Longer Range shotgun hunting for predators?

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blingslinger

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Any of you guys hunt predators at longer ranges with a shotgun? When I say longer ranges, I mean 80-100 yds or so.

I think TSS would serve well in that situation, and would do it with authority. I think a 1 oz load at around 1400 fps or a 1.5 oz load around 1300 fps would work great loaded with #4 or #2 TSS.

Your thoughts?
 
Originally Posted By: Droptine26Shotguns are a short range weapon. 80-100 yards is rifle range.imho

Not if you are using TSS. I know people that kill deer with #2 TSS, at ranges of 80-100 yds, and drop them in their tracks. Truth is, a shotgun with a load of #9 TSS, will anchor a coyote at 50 yds all day long, and #4s and #2s will handle the longer 80+ yds all day long.
 
I have some 3" 1-1/2 oz loads with TSS #4 shot and TSS #1 shot. I have only killed about 6 coyotes with the TSS #4 shot and I have not shot any of the TSS #1 shot yet. To me it felt like I was wasting money shooting 4 or 5 of those TSS #4 shot loads at coyotes because any of my coyote loads would have killed those coyotes.

http://www.predatormastersforums.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2806818

The TSS shot is great stuff but I don't need to use it at 50 yards and under. I have lots of 3" 1-1/2 oz reloads with Rem HD BB, HW13 BB, Win Xtended Range B shot and Federal Heavyweight #2 shot in them. All of these loads will kill coyotes farther away than what I want to shoot them at with a shotgun.

Many of my spots I call coyotes with a shotgun I can only see about 35 to 50 yards. In the open country I carry both a rifle and a shotgun or we have a rifle shooter and a shotgun shooter so long shots with a shotgun don't happen very often.

I think the military should be using shotguns with TSS #1 or #2 shot when they know the range will be under 100 yards away.
 
With the KPY Shotshell Ballistic program they say 1.50" of gel penetration is needed for ducks and 2.50" of gel penetration is needed for big geese. After checking out the different shot types and knowing what I have learned from seeing at least 150 coyotes being killed with lead BB and lead T shot I think 3.70" of gel penetration is needed to anchor, drop or kill coyotes reliably no matter what the shot angle is. Coyotes are 3 or 4 times tougher than a big goose.

Just because a shotgun load can kill a coyote at 40 yards when they are shot in the head doesn't make that load a good coyote load.

All three of these below loads are at 1300 fps.

#9 TSS shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 8.9 yards and has 3.21 pounds of energy at 8.9 yards
Lead BB shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 46.1 yards and has 11.82 pounds of energy at 46.1 yards
#4 TSS shot gets 3.70" of gel penetration at 78.9 yards and has 5.22 pounds of energy at 78.9 yards
 
As an avid waterfowler my take on TSS, a very expensive way to compensate for lack of hunting skills, calling, decoy placement and the ability to find "X"(where the ducks want to be). Almost all my waterfowing is done with 7/8 oz ITX 6's and only because my favorite waterfowl guns can't shoot steel.







For coyotes I use combo guns firing 2 3/4" 12ga loaded with 1 1/4 oz of NP lead BB's, seems to do the job but I let them come in or hunt them in very close cover. I have the rifle barrel for the longer ones.

I can see where in restricted firearms area a 100 yard load might be tempting but then your might as well be shooting slugs at anything under 50 yards. Learning to hunt so your shots are close in instead of trying to stretch your load I think would be more effective.
 
What is really great about TSS shot is you can reload it in a 410, 28 ga or 20 ga for turkeys, ducks or geese and kids or any recoil sensitive shooter can have a very deadly load that has very little recoil.

3" 12 ga at 1500 fps 1-1/4 oz of steel #2 shot "154 pellets" gets 1.50" of gel penetration at 47.7 yards

2-1/2" 410 at 1200 fps 1/2 oz of TSS #9 shot "178 pellets" gets 1.50" of gel penetration at 64.6 yards
 
Originally Posted By: blingslingerOriginally Posted By: Droptine26Shotguns are a short range weapon. 80-100 yards is rifle range.imho

Not if you are using TSS. I know people that kill deer with #2 TSS, at ranges of 80-100 yds, and drop them in their tracks. Truth is, a shotgun with a load of #9 TSS, will anchor a coyote at 50 yds all day long, and #4s and #2s will handle the longer 80+ yds all day long.

Chit...
 
Originally Posted By: AWSAs an avid waterfowler my take on TSS, a very expensive way to compensate for lack of hunting skills, calling, decoy placement and the ability to find "X"(where the ducks want to be). Almost all my waterfowing is done with 7/8 oz ITX 6's and only because my favorite waterfowl guns can't shoot steel.







For coyotes I use combo guns firing 2 3/4" 12ga loaded with 1 1/4 oz of NP lead BB's, seems to do the job but I let them come in or hunt them in very close cover. I have the rifle barrel for the longer ones.

I can see where in restricted firearms area a 100 yard load might be tempting but then your might as well be shooting slugs at anything under 50 yards. Learning to hunt so your shots are close in instead of trying to stretch your load I think would be more effective.

That is the thought process of people that have never used, or don't understand TSS.

What TSS allows you to do is use smaller sized shot, with the same performance as lighter shot. This in turn allows for a lighter payload, and also allows you to use a smaller gauge, lighter weight gun, and effectively brings your cost down equal or maybe lower than your factory tungsten shells.

If you choose so, you can load the heavier payload shells, and even shoot those in the 12 and 10 ga guns, and run up your cost per shell. The truth is, all that just isn't needed, but some folks just like to brag how big of a gun and how heavy of a payload that they shoot.

An example in the Turkey realm, folks like to throw around the $6-$8/shell price range for the 20 ga. At $38/ lb, I can load a 1 7/16 oz 20 ga turkey load for $4.25, which is cheaper than 20 ga Hevishot Mags blends, before taxes.
 
Originally Posted By: GCOriginally Posted By: blingslingerOriginally Posted By: Droptine26Shotguns are a short range weapon. 80-100 yards is rifle range.imho

Not if you are using TSS. I know people that kill deer with #2 TSS, at ranges of 80-100 yds, and drop them in their tracks. Truth is, a shotgun with a load of #9 TSS, will anchor a coyote at 50 yds all day long, and #4s and #2s will handle the longer 80+ yds all day long.

Chit...

It's the truth!
 
That makes sense, but almost everything you read about it on the waterfowl sights is how far you can kill with it not how you can load lighter loads and be more effective with it.

Again it seems to be a very expensive solution to a very rare problem.

1 oz of steel in my old 20ga auto loader worked well for waterfowl, my old hunting buddy uses that old gun for almost all his hunting, quail, wild pheasants and sharptails with the same 1 oz of steel.

Turkey hunting is not my world, hate the taste and smell of turkey cooking.
 
Originally Posted By: AWSThat makes sense, but almost everything you read about it on the waterfowl sights is how far you can kill with it not how you can load lighter loads and be more effective with it.

Again it seems to be a very expensive solution to a very rare problem.

1 oz of steel in my old 20ga auto loader worked well for waterfowl, my old hunting buddy uses that old gun for almost all his hunting, quail, wild pheasants and sharptails with the same 1 oz of steel.

Turkey hunting is not my world, hate the taste and smell of turkey cooking.

I agree, a lot of folks like to sky bust, and you can do just that with it, but you can do a lot more than just shoot long distances with it. It really shines in the smaller gauges.

Also Derby Bob, that coyote I was referring to was anchored with #9 TSS, with a broadside shot, and not a head on shot.
 
Originally Posted By: AWSSo what states allow you to use anything smaller than buckshot for deer hunting?

Florida, and Mississippi, I know for a fact do.
 
Originally Posted By: blingslingerAlso Derby Bob, that coyote I was referring to was anchored with #9 TSS, with a broadside shot, and not a head on shot.

you were there? you saw this?

how many coyotes have you killed with a shotgun? or with anything?
 
Originally Posted By: SlickerThanSnotOriginally Posted By: blingslingerAlso Derby Bob, that coyote I was referring to was anchored with #9 TSS, with a broadside shot, and not a head on shot.

you were there? you saw this?

how many coyotes have you killed with a shotgun? or with anything?

I wasn't there, but I trust the source 100%, that's not the only coyote that I know of that's been anchored with a broadside shot from #9 TSS, and at 40 or more yds.

As for the number of coyotes I've killed, more than I can count, and I've killed them with anything from a compound bow, to a 12 ga shotgun, to high powered rifles. I'm well versed.
 
years ago, I had two Ithaca 10ga auto mags, 32" full chokes. The shell of the day was 2 1/2 oz of Copper plated BB's and another load with 54 pellets of #4 buckshot.

At 60 yards, they were grave yard dead most of the time. 75 yards was iffy, patterns were falling apart quickly. We killed quite a few way on out there, but it was luck. Guys loved shooting that big soft kicking shotgun.

I can only imagine what a 10ga Browning Gold gas operated, loaded with really good shot would do in today's great wads, but very expensive per shot... 1 3/4 oz of TSS going real fast.

Shotguns at longer ranges have to be though of in terms of drop and some wind drift if there is any, similar to shooting a bow.

You would probably have $2000 invested in gun, loader, wads, shot, chokes before you had everything figured out.
 
Originally Posted By: ackleymanyears ago, I had two Ithaca 10ga auto mags, 32" full chokes. The shell of the day was 2 1/2 oz of Copper plated BB's and another load with 54 pellets of #4 buckshot.

At 60 yards, they were grave yard dead most of the time. 75 yards was iffy, patterns were falling apart quickly. We killed quite a few way on out there, but it was luck. Guys loved shooting that big soft kicking shotgun.

I can only imagine what a 10ga Browning Gold gas operated, loaded with really good shot would do in today's great wads, but very expensive per shot... 1 3/4 oz of TSS going real fast.

Shotguns at longer ranges have to be though of in terms of drop and some wind drift if there is any, similar to shooting a bow.

You would probably have $2000 invested in gun, loader, wads, shot, chokes before you had everything figured out.

That isn't entirely true, development of a load like you are talking about is simple, if you work with a handloader that has experience in load development, specifically with TSS. As far as figuring a gun and choke out, that's one of the advantages of TSS, it isn't very picky at all, as long as you don't try to choke it down too much. TSS tends to like more open chokes. TSS has also come down in price, and quality shot can be had for $38/lb now shipped
 
"Truth is, a shotgun with a load of #9 TSS, will anchor a coyote at 50 yds all day long,"


"I wasn't there, but ..."

Chit...
 
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