Dropped 2 tonight and lost both. No more .223 for me

V

varminter .223

Well-known member
On the 4th stand we had 3 come running and circling down wind of us out into a big open wheat field. As soon as 1 stopped broadside at probably 150 yards I settle the photon dot and shot. The coyote dropped like a sack of taters. He flopped and then spun a time or 2 and flopped again so I launched another 60 vmax and then began scanning for another coyote. My buddy shot at one on kind of a hail Mary. He then scans back to my coyote and it is now gone. One starts barking at us across the field. We moved towards him and I did pup distress and bark howls on my hand call. We finally got him close enough and I shot him at about 175 facing me. He dropped like a sack of taters as well then spins and flops etc. 30 seconds later it appears he is maybe up and running away. Hard to see at this point. They had to go a quarter mile across an open field to make the brush. We scanned the entire field and brush edges with thermal and no coyotes to be found. I feel like I did everything right and the shots felt great, not to mention that rifle is .5 moa. I hated to just shoot the pizz out of them. I think the photon is going on the 700 vls 6mm rem tomorrow. I have 55 ballistic silver tip and 70 varmagedon loads for it. Apparently 60 vmaxes with 24 varget isn't sufficient for healthy Midwest coyotes. I killed a big male with it last Saturday and never did find a hole. He made it about 20 yards. I'm baffled. Know all I can wonder is if they are dead. I would guess to level them that hard it would a about have to be a pretty solid hit.
 
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Originally Posted By: wklmanI guess it's time to change your name.
Well I joined here long ago when an AR was the only rifle I had other than a 7mag. Over at 6mmbr and Savage shooters I am Swift4Yotes
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and I only went back to the AR at night.
How does cannon4yotes aound?
 
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I think your load is underpowered with 24 grs. of Varget. Hodgdon lists 25 as the minimum and 27 as the max. When I was shooting 60 vmax and Varget, I shot 26.7 grs. which put me around 3,100 fps out of a 22" barrel. Lots of coyote hunters swear by the 60 vmax, so I don't think it is the bullet. I just don't think you are pushing it hard enough, but the 6mm will certainly give you all the punch you want.

I know that bad feeling of losing an animal and the frustration that goes with having called them in successfully and then losing them. My hunting buddy shoots an AR in 223 using 55 vmax and he has had some struggle with shooting them straight on too. It knocks them down and then they get up and run, but usually fall over in a short distance. In my opinion the reloads he shoots are underpowered at only about 2,800 fps. I finally told him as long as they are moving you keep shooting.
 
I agree it is under powered. I think hornady lists 24 within their min. and max under .223 buy my chamber is 5.56. I saw that hodgdon list 25 as a starting point after it was sighted in and driving tacks. It had really been leveling coyotes well but I think the shots were closer. I might swap scopes and do some load work today. With the 24" tube I should be able to get them moving along fairly quick. I can tell you the bolt won't hang open after the last one in the mag and it actually didn't pick up a new round after the 2nd shot on the first coyote so I know pressure is down.
 
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I too have had some issues with getting a hit with a 223 and having them run off but I've also dropped them in their tracks. I did change to a vmax bullet but still see the same result. I've come to realize Coyotes are no different than deer, a good hit drops them while a soft tissue hit or gut shot allows them to run off? I've noticed the ones that drop usually have bone damage and those that ran off and we found have only soft tissue damage. I'm not saying you're a bad shot, just no matter how hard we try we can't depend on a skeletal injury each time we pull the trigger. I feel that will be true with any caliber you choose. I believe this because I've had deer run off when shot with a 3006 but drop with a 223, so what's the difference? Shot placement. We shot one the other night hit in the ribs behind the shoulder and exited out the guts, no blood but found him 200 yds later
 
I've shot coyotes with a 50 caliber muzzeloader right in the boiler room and have had them make in 75s and I have had them make it almost 100 yards with perfect lung shots with a .223. It's odd, sometimes it's like you could flick em with you pinky and they drop over dead and the next one is bullet proof. Coyotes are about the most inconsistent critter to kill imo. I don't think I've had one escape with a 3600 plus fps 6mm or 22 nosler bt or vmax. I am not a 223 fan for coyotes but the AR is handy at night for sure. I think I had the right idea putting together my 22 nosler but they would have to be about 10 yards out or closer to hit em with that piece of crap.
 
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That is a bum deal. Same thing happened to my hunting partner last night on his bait pile. 150 yards .223 55gr vmax. You still havent gotten that 22 nosler figured out? I returned my ar stoner Upper and I'm waiting on a 6.5 grendel upper from Specialized dynamics. Debating on selling my 22 nosler brass and die set or getting a different setup.
 
I have to agree with others 24 grains is pretty low. I'm running 27.0 behind 55 grain bullets and 26.5 behind 60 grain bullets. If the brass had a little more room I'd probably try more

Never did like the V-max on Coyotes. To many runners. Iv'e had my best luck with 60 grain flat base Berger Varmint. The 60 grain Berger's have a much smaller Meplat than the 50 or 55 grain Berger's
 
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Photon is going on my uber accurate 12fv in 22 250 that I nearly forgot about. It is a little more accurate that my 6mm.
26" inch tube
60 ballistic tips
34 grains of Varget
Book shows around 3600.
If I have to add a cheeking piece no worries drilling that stock.
If they run after that it is my fault for sure. Hope the local shop has 30mm rings.

 
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If you hit vitals they are dead. Does not matter what you poke them with...you hit them..they are dead. You need to keep blasting until there is no doubt, like I do with the .22mag. They keep movin...I keep shootin.
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I had similar issues with the 60 gr V-Max in my 16" AR. I switched to the Nosler Varmageddon 62 gr FBHP and have had really good results so far on coyotes from 70-150 yds. On a different note, for the 22-250 you can't beat the Sierra 55 gr Gameking SPBT. I shot 17 coyotes in a row with that bullet, from various distances and angles, and it just put them in the dirt, hard.
 
Pound for pound, coyotes are tough as they come,I lost two chances at doubles this year to bad hits,and then again I pulled off some amazing shots, it happens...
 
55 gr. Vmax have been working great for me. Hit in the lungs and there good for 30 to 75 yds. at times. I've had more drop right were they stood than not. I should have take a picture of the one. Dropped straight down on his legs with head slightly tucked like somebody threw a switch. Can only hope when my time comes I can go that quick.
 
I stopped using vmax many years ago. Now use sierra #1365 55 grain boat tail soft point. Very few pass throughs an i haven't had one run off in years. Running in a 223/5.56 AR-15 20 inch barrel
 
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Originally Posted By: CZ527You don't say??

Yep, also did get three doubles drt this season, I use a 55 grain Nosler Varmagedon with 26 grains of Varget.
 
Lots of excellent coyote hunters seem to have trouble with the v-max bullets, but they have always worked well for me in several calibers. I think mostly the problem is splashes on shoulder shots. In calling it is difficult to put a bullet exactly where it needs to go because they are often coming hard and fast and not staying still very long. A lot of hunters like to break them down shooting through shoulders and that is probably where the soft points shine. That is one reason why I like the 243 even when using the 58 v-max for a little added knock down if I can't get the perfect heart/lung shot.

The following 3 video clips are of 3 coyotes I shot in the last few weeks on my bait pile using a Stag AR carbine with 16" barrel shooting a 50 gr. v-max at about 3,100 fps, range just under 100 yds. Granted I had time to place the shots but the results were impressive to me.







Conclusion: V-max bullets kill with devastating effect when placed where they need to go.

 
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