‘The biggest sham’: Sheriffs fume at mass release of 6,000 federal inmates

hm1996

hm1996

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Quote: ‘The biggest sham’: Sheriffs fume at mass release of 6,000 federal inmates
By Adam Shaw
·Published November 11, 2015
·FoxNews.com


July 16, 2015: President Obama speaks to reporters during his visit to the El Reno Federal Correctional Institution in El Reno, Oklahoma. (Reuters)

Local sheriffs across America are voicing concern for the safety of the citizens they've sworn to protect after the biggest one-time release of federal inmates in U.S. history -- though advocates of criminal justice reform maintain the release is being handled responsibly.

The 6,112 inmates were released from federal prison at the beginning of November in response to a decision by the U.S. Sentencing Commission to reduce sentences for most drug trafficking offenses and apply them retroactively. It coincides with a broader and bipartisan push for rethinking federal sentencing.

But the mass release raises immediate practical questions about how the ex-inmates can adjust.

“There's no transition here, there's no safety net. This is the biggest sham they are trying to sell the American people,” Sheriff Paul Babeu of Arizona's Pinal County told FoxNews.com.

“On average these criminals have been in federal prison for nine years -- you don’t have to be a sheriff to realize that a felon after nine years in jail isn’t going to be adding value to the community. A third are illegals and felons so they can’t work. What do we think they are going to do?” said Babeu, also a congressional candidate.


The government is in fact trying to guide the transition for many. The Justice Department says 77 percent of exiting inmates are already in half-way houses or home confinement.

But local law enforcement officers have deep reservations, as the initiative ramps up quickly.

The November inmates are the first of approximately 46,000 who may have their cases reviewed. Of those released in the first round, the Department of Justice says 1,764 were to be turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) for deportation proceedings.

Sheriffs on the border front-lines were skeptical of the deportation claim.

“The promise is they’re going to be turned over to ICE and deported. Anyone who thinks there’s any likelihood of them leaving the U.S. … think again,” Babeu said, before saying the president should be held responsible for any crimes committed by those released.

Other sheriffs also challenged the claim that those being released are not a risk to communities.

“If [the Obama administration is] not capable of making honest and prudent decisions in securing our borders, how can we trust them to make the right decision on the release of prisoners who may return to a life of crime?” Sheriff Harold Eavenson of Rockwall County, Texas, told FoxNews.com.


'I’d be amazed if the 6,000 ... being released are non-violent.'

- Sheriff Harold Eavenson

While the average number of inmates being released to any one state is 80, Texas is slated to receive 597 inmates.

The inmates in question had been incarcerated on drug offenses, but the severity of the cases ranged broadly. An Associated Press review last month found while many were low-level drug dealers, some had prior convictions for robbery or were involved in moving serious drugs like cocaine and heroin. WGME in Maine also reported that the group includes a former "drug kingpin" previously listed as one of "America's Most Wanted," after his 20-year sentence was reduced.

“For them to tell me or tell citizens that they’re going to do a good job and these inmates are non-violent, when in many instances drug crimes, drug purchasing, drug trafficking are related to other, violent crimes – I’d be amazed if the 6,000 ... being released are non-violent,” Eavenson said.

A Justice Department official told reporters at an October briefing that the DOJ was conscious of public safety when granting each inmate early release, adding that every prisoner who applied under these new guidelines underwent a public safety assessment. The DOJ says that the reductions were not automatic, and that as of October, judges denied approximately 26 percent of total petitions.

RELATED VIDEO: Will release of thousands of inmates lead to more crime?



Advocates for criminal justice reform disagreed with the sheriffs, saying the Sentencing Commission handled the release very well from a public safety standpoint.

“I am sure many of the 6,000 prisoners would have loved to be able to leave prison as soon as their amended sentences were complete. But the Commission delayed implementation for a year so that as many inmates as possible could get to halfway houses, complete re-entry programs, and begin job searches before actually being released,” Kevin Ring, director of strategic initiatives at Families Against Mandatory Minimums, told FoxNews.com.

“Tens of thousands of inmates leave federal and state prisons every week and so there is no reason to be particularly worried about this group. Anyone who says otherwise is appealing to the public’s worst fears,” Ring said.

However, the executive director of the National Sheriff’s Association, which represents the more than 3,000 sheriffs across the country, says the feeling of unease is widespread and often has to do with the Obama administration’s attitude toward law enforcement.

“I think it’s a larger feeling of unease related to a lack of a plan as it relates to criminal justice, criminal reform and criminal release and I think that’s what you’re really sensing here,” Jonathan Thompson told FoxNews.com. “There are many sheriffs feeling as though the administration will go through the motions of asking the questions but really not care what the opinion or expert advice of law enforcement is.”

Fox News’ Matt Dean contributed to this report.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/11/...t/?intcmp=hpbt1

Regards,
hm
 
Another attempt at turning our nation into a third world country. More drugs on the streets, more violence, more shootings, more excuses to take our guns. WHY does no one in government have the balls to impeach him?
 
Originally Posted By: Rocky1Another attempt at turning our nation into a third world country. More drugs on the streets, more violence, more shootings, more excuses to take our guns. WHY does no one in government have the balls to impeach him?

You aren't keeping up with reality here, it's not releasing murderers and rapists, it's letting low level drug offenders who have already served time that isn't in relationship to the crime due to excessively harsh and out of perspective political periods. 6000 inmates costs the government $300 million.

Reality check, more drug dealers does not mean more people using drugs, those wanting drugs will find them.

Prisons are big business with big lobbies, pushing rules that make for more prisoners at our expense.

Prison systems should not be privately owned for profit, that is an idiotic and hideously expensive way to incarcerate people.

Wake up call... this country is headed for some serious prison reforms if you haven't caught the prevailing direction things are headed.
 
Originally Posted By: woodguruOriginally Posted By: Rocky1Another attempt at turning our nation into a third world country. More drugs on the streets, more violence, more shootings, more excuses to take our guns. WHY does no one in government have the balls to impeach him?

You aren't keeping up with reality here, it's not releasing murderers and rapists, it's letting low level drug offenders who have already served time that isn't in relationship to the crime due to excessively harsh and out of perspective political periods.

Somehow, these guys do not quite fit the mold of "low level drug offenders" in my view.

Quote:The inmates in question had been incarcerated on drug offenses, but the severity of the cases ranged broadly. An Associated Press review last month found while many were low-level drug dealers, some had prior convictions for robbery or were involved in moving serious drugs like cocaine and heroin. WGME in Maine also reported that the group includes a former "drug kingpin" previously listed as one of "America's Most Wanted," after his 20-year sentence was reduced.

You don't suppose that more drug dealers on the street would increase the pressure/competition among said dealers to cultivate new customers and sell more drugs to, do you, Woody?

Originally Posted By: woodguruReality check, more drug dealers does not mean more people using drugs, those wanting drugs will find them.

You don't think the following is in any way political payback for the fact that Texas stood up to the current administration on Obamacare, Illegal Immigration and voter ID, do you?

Quote:While the average number of inmates being released to any one state is 80, Texas is slated to receive 597 inmates.

Regards,
hm
 
Woodguru talks about prisoners costing us taxpayers how many millions of dollars??

How much are 11-15 million illegals costing us?

I would rather have prisoners in prison and illegals gone!!
 
Someone smoking or selling weed shouldn't be in jail. Pot mellows people out if anything. Alcohol is far more deadly everyday. But I'm not for outlawing alcohol either. To many laws as I see it. And the corrupt politicians that need to be in jail don't even get arrested. It's time we focus on the big offenders. Politicians and corrupt businesses ripping off the taxpayer.
 
YES, I AM KEEPING UP WITH REALITY YOU INSOLENT NO-MINDED LIBERAL DWEEB!

(And, that was being as polite as I could possibly be!)


Thank you hm, for pointing out the obvious; I was relatively certain my point was quite clear, unless of course you are an insolent no-minded liberal dweeb, then apparently it isn't obvious.


I am well aware of the prison problem wood-rot, there are a dozen or more of them within 40 miles of me, I know not less than 40 people employed by the prison system in this area. And, the bulk of those released under Obama's plan were to be BLACK to begin with, and supposed non-violent offenders.

The problem I have with that is, most 18-19 year old, non-violent black adult inmates have extensive juvenile records. Most of them haven't graduated high school. They don't have any job skills, aside from selling drugs. And, while they may well not have been violent when they entered prison, there is a very good likelihood that many of them grew up to become that way, while incarcerated! No one, black brown, red, or white is doing 20 years for simple possession or use, possession with intent to sell indicates they have no intent of being a productive part of society.

-------

Personally I think the 597 released in Texas represents a huge influx of mules caught for the first time in the US hm, they may have been drug dealers all their lives south of the border, they simply hadn't been caught in the US until now. And, Obama trying hard to get that liberal vote and sucking up to the Mexicans, has turned a whole bunch of them loose on you folks out there in Texas, because he's all pro- illegal immigrant and turning drug addicts loose. I believe I read a post somewhere stating that you were familiar with those high dollar pigeon shoots??? Need I say more?? Open the doors, point them south, give em 10 - 15 yards just to be sporting, and start shooting! Don't fgorget to tattoo them on the forehead before release, just in case you Texans drink too much beer and miss one or two.

=====================

I'd rather see the prisoners AND illegals gone Mr. P - tell them they can get out, but they have to go live in Mexico, because we're gonna tattoo a bullseye on their forehard before we let them out, and everyone is going to believe they are repeat border jumping offenders and shoot them on site.

---------------------

Unfortunately Eugene, I don't necessarily agree with you anymore. I've had the experience of seeing what smoking pot for 40 years has cost my brother. I know what his actions partying and mellowing out have cost me. I know that of his 3 children, only one has even half a chance in life, and that is ONLY if she gets off her [beeep] and truly applies herself at this point, and doesn't allow pregnancy immediately out of highschool to destroy her plans to pursue a college degree and make something of herself. The oldest son, quit school in the 9th grade at 18 years old, with about a 6th grade education, at best, many subjects it's more like 3rd grade on any given day. The younger of the two was thrown out of school in the 5th grade, for disrupting class on a regular basis. Both of them are habitual pot users as well; have been since a very early age, having grown up around it. (i.e. They cannot go to work in the morning without burning one first!)

Oh, but it won't hurt you! ---- My brother was extremely intelligent back in high school, today he lives in a 45 year old double wide trailer that is literally falling in around them, on 2 acres of land. That he wouldn't own, had my father not paid for it 20+ years ago. He has his own business painting houses, where he, his oldest son, and an assortment of his pothead friends occasionally try to make a living, because they can't conform with the real world. None of them survive on real jobs, because they are late, or absent, on a routine basis, because they have enough THC in their system and are mellowed out to the point, that they truly don't give a [beeep] about anything as long as they have groceries on the table, munchies in the cupboard, and beer and cigarette money.

The boys have both been in jail, more than once. Were it not for grandpa bailing them out, and paying for attorneys, they would both have done hard time. Unfortunately, they have both since burned their bridges with him, with their don't give a [beeep] mellowed out attitudes in his employment. He fired them both, while they owed him several thousand dollars.

I can show you case after case after case of this in habitual pot smokers in this neighborhood alone. They lose all drive to succeed, to even try, give up on work, play the system until they qualify for disability, or deal drugs one.

And, yes I've seen the toll alcohol can and does have on people as well. My grandfather went through rehab a half dozen times before kicking it, and I lost one of the best friends I ever had to alcoholism. Dependency does not discriminate.
 
Rocky you are spot on about pot use. It takes away the ambition to do anything after a while. Very hard on the lungs. It may have some benefits to those already very sick but it is no benefit to those who are healthy nor is alcohol.Granted some people can use either in moderation and keep the bad effects to a minimum but many can not. Pot use eliminates most job prospects because the person can't pass the drug test to get hired. Lost production,poor performance,accidents and so on cost this country an extraordinary amount. I know people are going to do it no matter what but if the energy spent on just pot and alcohol was turned productive it would make a big difference. I understand it will never happen though.
 
Rocky I guess you know some real stoners. I'm more concerned with guys that want to use it once in a while. As long as a guy is living and getting by, I could care less how much he smokes and lives in a trailer. At least he's not on welfare with 12 kids with 11 different women's. If everyone is an overachiever, we won't have people to do certain chores. I'm just against the government controlling everything. Except the crooked politicians and cops seem to get a pass.
 
I cannot ever condone the use of marijuana. For every person who just wants to get a "buzz", and might smoke a joint once a month, there are ten times as many who practically live on pot 24-7. My youngest brother was into pot pretty heavy, but kicked it and is now a successful businessman. However, just yesterday I ran into one of his former pot smoking buddies who is still wandering around aimlessly out in left field. I could never, ever, vote for the legalization of marijuana. Also, as a farmer who grew tobacco as my main cash crop for over 30 years, I could never understand why tobacco took such a huge hit, while alcohol was given a pass. Alcohol abuse has caused just as many problems, if not more, than the use of tobacco. know there are a lot of people who don't think drugs are a problem, but they must be living in the Dark Ages, because it is a problem.....a huge one. Many of the crimes that are committed are because of drugs. There is no way one can overlook that, and not see a connection.
 
Originally Posted By: Rocky1YES, I AM KEEPING UP WITH REALITY YOU INSOLENT NO-MINDED LIBERAL DWEEB!

(And, that was being as polite as I could possibly be!)


Thank you hm, for pointing out the obvious; I was relatively certain my point was quite clear, unless of course you are an insolent no-minded liberal dweeb, then apparently it isn't obvious.


I am well aware of the prison problem wood-rot, there are a dozen or more of them within 40 miles of me, I know not less than 40 people employed by the prison system in this area. And, the bulk of those released under Obama's plan were to be BLACK to begin with, and supposed non-violent offenders.

The problem I have with that is, most 18-19 year old, non-violent black adult inmates have extensive juvenile records. Most of them haven't graduated high school. They don't have any job skills, aside from selling drugs. And, while they may well not have been violent when they entered prison, there is a very good likelihood that many of them grew up to become that way, while incarcerated! No one, black brown, red, or white is doing 20 years for simple possession or use, possession with intent to sell indicates they have no intent of being a productive part of society.

-------

Personally I think the 597 released in Texas represents a huge influx of mules caught for the first time in the US hm, they may have been drug dealers all their lives south of the border, they simply hadn't been caught in the US until now. And, Obama trying hard to get that liberal vote and sucking up to the Mexicans, has turned a whole bunch of them loose on you folks out there in Texas, because he's all pro- illegal immigrant and turning drug addicts loose. I believe I read a post somewhere stating that you were familiar with those high dollar pigeon shoots??? Need I say more?? Open the doors, point them south, give em 10 - 15 yards just to be sporting, and start shooting! Don't fgorget to tattoo them on the forehead before release, just in case you Texans drink too much beer and miss one or two.

=====================

I'd rather see the prisoners AND illegals gone Mr. P - tell them they can get out, but they have to go live in Mexico, because we're gonna tattoo a bullseye on their forehard before we let them out, and everyone is going to believe they are repeat border jumping offenders and shoot them on site.

---------------------

Unfortunately Eugene, I don't necessarily agree with you anymore. I've had the experience of seeing what smoking pot for 40 years has cost my brother. I know what his actions partying and mellowing out have cost me. I know that of his 3 children, only one has even half a chance in life, and that is ONLY if she gets off her [beeep] and truly applies herself at this point, and doesn't allow pregnancy immediately out of highschool to destroy her plans to pursue a college degree and make something of herself. The oldest son, quit school in the 9th grade at 18 years old, with about a 6th grade education, at best, many subjects it's more like 3rd grade on any given day. The younger of the two was thrown out of school in the 5th grade, for disrupting class on a regular basis. Both of them are habitual pot users as well; have been since a very early age, having grown up around it. (i.e. They cannot go to work in the morning without burning one first!)

Oh, but it won't hurt you! ---- My brother was extremely intelligent back in high school, today he lives in a 45 year old double wide trailer that is literally falling in around them, on 2 acres of land. That he wouldn't own, had my father not paid for it 20+ years ago. He has his own business painting houses, where he, his oldest son, and an assortment of his pothead friends occasionally try to make a living, because they can't conform with the real world. None of them survive on real jobs, because they are late, or absent, on a routine basis, because they have enough THC in their system and are mellowed out to the point, that they truly don't give a [beeep] about anything as long as they have groceries on the table, munchies in the cupboard, and beer and cigarette money.

The boys have both been in jail, more than once. Were it not for grandpa bailing them out, and paying for attorneys, they would both have done hard time. Unfortunately, they have both since burned their bridges with him, with their don't give a [beeep] mellowed out attitudes in his employment. He fired them both, while they owed him several thousand dollars.

I can show you case after case after case of this in habitual pot smokers in this neighborhood alone. They lose all drive to succeed, to even try, give up on work, play the system until they qualify for disability, or deal drugs one.

And, yes I've seen the toll alcohol can and does have on people as well. My grandfather went through rehab a half dozen times before kicking it, and I lost one of the best friends I ever had to alcoholism. Dependency does not discriminate.

You have stated it very well, my friend. I will attest to the truthfulness of your statements as I am one of the very fortunate ones who the good Lord has seen fit to help stay clean and sober for the past 35 years. When I read your account of your brother and his children, it was if I was reading the story of my life back then. I did not limit myself to just pot but also got into other more dangerous drugs. I thank God daily that I got sober before I got married and had children. They never had to see a dad who had sunken to the lows I had. Gratitude cannot begin to express the way I feel toward the people who cared enough to push me into treatment.
 
I'm pretty convinced that some people are just losers. It's not because of drugs. Even without drugs they would be worthless bums. And drugs make people commit crime like guns make people commit crime. Some people are criminals. If anything the price of drugs makes people commit crime, because they need to get their fix, so they rob and steal stuff. Some people want to ban all guns, I don't. That's why I feel some drugs are fine if people want to, as long as they don't bother me. I don't use drugs, but I use guns, so the arguement can go both ways. So I try to side with individual freedom. A lot of people around here think the same as gun grabbers do on other issues.
 
Pot is a gateway drug. A few can use pot and stop there but many move into other drugs that do put others at risk. Flaka,gravel or whatever you want to call it as well as heroin is a problem around here now. I would bet 90% used pot first or they would never have come in contact with the other drugs. I don't think prohibition works however. That just makes wealthy the wholesale dealers. Street level dealers are usually users themselves. Drug use is an insidious problem.Wholesale legalization is no answer either. I think for simple possession the workhouse would be the answer. Potheads hate to work as a general rule,hard drug users are unable to work but with time in the sun can recover to the point they can begin to work.Good clean hard work cures a lot of ills and takes away confusion.Pot use does make a person lazy and irresponsible,slow to react,saps ambition,ruins the lungs,in general a slow way to start down the road to a sorry life. It is however in my opinion less dangerous than alcohol to the population in general. A great deal of these problems could be less if the borders were secure. And if the borders were secure billions of dollars would not leave circulation in the economy as drug money going south..I see no easy answer but I think legalization will prove to not be the answer either. Drugs cause the killing,weapons are only the means. Wonder for example why no talk is heard about what prompted gang murder in Chicago instead of just how it is commented.
 
lots and lots of propaganda being thrown up here on this one..

I don't look down my nose at those that want to live in a trailer, that's their choice.
I don't blame any substance on the reason people choose to not do something with their lives.

I don't care if someone wants to live in a trailer, occasionally paint houses and barely make it. Personal choices. It's not about rocky, I am just saying that if someone wants to live like that, they will, there are plenty that do that without drugs, is OK for them as long as they don't smoke pot.

Before anyone says they don't support peoples rights to smoke pot, but drink alcohol or smoke nicotine, your a Hippocratic double talker that says what i do is OK and what you do isn't..

As for the medical benefits, if you believe there are no benefits to it, you are repeating propaganda and not doing your own research.. Before, you try selling that, ask yourself if you believe what Obama is saying about guns or healthcare, or anything else the government is telling you.
Most of use get fired up hearing them talk about taking away guns, and then in the next post talk about keeping Pot illegal and telling others they have to do what you think they should to be successful or you don't like the motivation or drive they have and you want something else.

The irony is thick.

If you are an addict your an addict.. Do you treat the person or ban it.. Think about that answer you came to, and is it the same answer for guns? Liberty is liberty.

I know many people that are high functioning, make a lot of money and do just fine.. The medical research from Isreal (since it's one of the few places where they have been allowed to study it) show dramatic life improvements for those that suffer from Post Traumatic Stress.
There are studies that show that after Chemo, use of pot has shown to have an impact on cancer returning. There are studies of Charlotte's web POT that was designed to be high in CBDs and is given to kids and adults that have limiting seizures. There are kids that would have more than 300 seizures in a week. Traditionally that would lead to all of these kids death. The use of the CBD oil from pot, stops that. It has shown to reduce these cases to less than a couple of seizures a week. If you are a parent that has a kid that is 5 but mentally 2 and slowly dying, and CBD solves this and gives them a normal life.. That should be banned?

If you don't know the difference between THC, CBD, Sativa, Indica, then maybe you should do some research from many sources and be willing to rethink your previously held beliefs.

22 vets a day die from suicide. The VA is starting to study it, and creating groups to test it. They are finding that it helps with pain management, and allows the vets taking Opiods (which are linked to drug abuse) to reduce or stop those and be a lot more functional on pot than Oxy, tramadol, codine, and the others they hand out like crazy. The are finding that it helps vets deal with the trauma of war, and the issues that also come from being in war like social anxiety and hypervigolence. I know vets that hadn't slept through the night, and woke up without being in pain in more than a decade, and with a small amount of pot at bed time, he sleeps through the night, no night terrors, no waking up with pain.. You can buy the 60's propaganda video's from elementary school, or look at the research and results.

Don't get mad at antigunners unwilling to learn if you are not willing to do the same.
 
Originally Posted By: tnshootistPot is a gateway drug. A few can use pot and stop there but many move into other drugs that do put others at risk. Flaka,gravel or whatever you want to call it as well as heroin is a problem around here now. I would bet 90% used pot first or they would never have come in contact with the other drugs. I don't think prohibition works however. That just makes wealthy the wholesale dealers. Street level dealers are usually users themselves. Drug use is an insidious problem.Wholesale legalization is no answer either. I think for simple possession the workhouse would be the answer. Potheads hate to work as a general rule,hard drug users are unable to work but with time in the sun can recover to the point they can begin to work.Good clean hard work cures a lot of ills and takes away confusion.Pot use does make a person lazy and irresponsible,slow to react,saps ambition,ruins the lungs,in general a slow way to start down the road to a sorry life. It is however in my opinion less dangerous than alcohol to the population in general. A great deal of these problems could be less if the borders were secure. And if the borders were secure billions of dollars would not leave circulation in the economy as drug money going south..I see no easy answer but I think legalization will prove to not be the answer either. Drugs cause the killing,weapons are only the means. Wonder for example why no talk is heard about what prompted gang murder in Chicago instead of just how it is commented.

From the CDC:
For much of the past century, scientists studying drug abuse labored in the shadows of powerful myths and misconceptions about the nature of addiction. When scientists began to study addictive behavior in the 1930s, people addicted to drugs were thought to be morally flawed and lacking in willpower. Those views shaped society’s responses to drug abuse, treating it as a moral failing rather than a health problem, which led to an emphasis on punishment rather than prevention and treatment. Today, thanks to science, our views and our responses to addiction and other substance use disorders have changed dramatically. Groundbreaking discoveries about the brain have revolutionized our understanding of compulsive drug use, enabling us to respond effectively to the problem.
http://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugs-brains-behavior-science-addiction/preface

The National Instatute of Health, and DEA list even the most addictive drug of Heroin is less than 25% of people that do it get addicted.

But toss that out, and the most addictive top 5 drugs include drinking, and smoking with Heroin and cocaine. By extension if there is a gateway drug then based on the addictive and abused rates we should ban drinking and smoking too. Canibis doesn't come in within the top 10. it's actually down with caffine.. Did you have a cup of coffee today? According to the DEA and NIH, you are just as likely to be a gateway user with your coffee this morning as smoking pot..
 
No matter my view on this,, They shouldn't be letting criminals out of jail.. Most of these people were not caught with some personal pot or anything else on them for their own use.

They have rap sheets that show a pattern of not being a good citizen and are where they are for a reason. Releasing ciminals will only raise the crime rate..

Any cop will tell you they spend most of their time dealing with the same people over and over. Jail is just a time out. But, now there are going to be a pile of new victoms from criminals that are just that.. CRIMINALS.. They will then clog up the system again, and go back to where they were.
 
Originally Posted By: Tbone-AZOriginally Posted By: tnshootistPot is a gateway drug. A few can use pot and stop there but many move into other drugs that do put others at risk. Flaka,gravel or whatever you want to call it as well as heroin is a problem around here now. I would bet 90% used pot first or they would never have come in contact with the other drugs. I don't think prohibition works however. That just makes wealthy the wholesale dealers. Street level dealers are usually users themselves. Drug use is an insidious problem.Wholesale legalization is no answer either. I think for simple possession the workhouse would be the answer. Potheads hate to work as a general rule,hard drug users are unable to work but with time in the sun can recover to the point they can begin to work.Good clean hard work cures a lot of ills and takes away confusion.Pot use does make a person lazy and irresponsible,slow to react,saps ambition,ruins the lungs,in general a slow way to start down the road to a sorry life. It is however in my opinion less dangerous than alcohol to the population in general. A great deal of these problems could be less if the borders were secure. And if the borders were secure billions of dollars would not leave circulation in the economy as drug money going south..I see no easy answer but I think legalization will prove to not be the answer either. Drugs cause the killing,weapons are only the means. Wonder for example why no talk is heard about what prompted gang murder in Chicago instead of just how it is commented.

From the CDC:
For much of the past century, scientists studying drug abuse labored in the shadows of powerful myths and misconceptions about the nature of addiction. When scientists began to study addictive behavior in the 1930s, people addicted to drugs were thought to be morally flawed and lacking in willpower. Those views shaped society’s responses to drug abuse, treating it as a moral failing rather than a health problem, which led to an emphasis on punishment rather than prevention and treatment. Today, thanks to science, our views and our responses to addiction and other substance use disorders have changed dramatically. Groundbreaking discoveries about the brain have revolutionized our understanding of compulsive drug use, enabling us to respond effectively to the problem.
http://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugs-brains-behavior-science-addiction/preface

The National Instatute of Health, and DEA list even the most addictive drug of Heroin is less than 25% of people that do it get addicted.

But toss that out, and the most addictive top 5 drugs include drinking, and smoking with Heroin and cocaine. By extension if there is a gateway drug then based on the addictive and abused rates we should ban drinking and smoking too. Canibis doesn't come in within the top 10. it's actually down with caffine.. Did you have a cup of coffee today? According to the DEA and NIH, you are just as likely to be a gateway user with your coffee this morning as smoking pot..

For much of the past century I have watched what is happening around me,being Pot was around and no drug test when I entered the work force and during my young years was they heyday of Pot years. Anyone who says today's pot is stronger than Colombian gold and such don't remember back when. Pot is just like I said it was regardless of what some paid determined out come you get from research. Vietnam,Korean,WWII. Pot has been around a long time.Those guys knew what it did for PTSD back then. Yes there are functioning pot heads but they will function less and less as the years go by. You watch and see . True medical pot I believe in but just smoking pot is a losers choice any way you cut it.Most medicines have unwanted side problems and so does medical pot. I do not think someone who is toasted should have a weapon in their possession because while they are high they may do stupid stuff. There are a lot of things that own their own don't cause much trouble but mixed wrong and the odds of something un planned taking place greatly increase.It just is what it is.And hard drugs? Most addicts do not plan or chose to be addicts. That is the true tragedy of it.It don't matter after so long how you got there,all addicts hit bottom. A very few will draw up courage and quit on their own. Some can quit with treatment. Time in a well run jail will allow for a dry out and choices to be made if nothing else works. People run through all they have and spend their old age in ruins because of drugs but you will quit someday one way or the other. A man is not meant to do drugs and that life just won't hold up.I have seen it to many times.

Edit:Anyone who does opiates of any kind more than once is about to become an addict if they are not very lucky. I am not talking about 5mg Tylenol. The reason pot is a gateway mostly is because people would not run into cocaine or opiates dealers if they were not buying pot. Speaking in general.
 
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If you think drugs are all bad, and you aren't calling for a ban on alcohol, you're not being sincere. Some people are just lazy. Go look and watch a group of kids for a day. You can easily pick out the ones that are lazy. Same with adults. Prescription drugs are a huge problem now. Where do we even begin? It sounds like a lot of personal feelings being worked into unscientific thoughts. The gun grabbers do this all the time. I won't blame a drug.... I'm pretty sure that of these 6000 released, most will be back. It would be interesting to see if they study this group.
 
The definition of addiction changes pretty regularly, and more because of political pressure than anything else.

Most cig addicts aren't drug addicts but I don't think I've ever met a drug or alcohol addict that wasn't a smoker. I've never met a drug addict that didn't drink pretty heavy. And they ALL drink coffee (so do I
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but I don't go crying if I don't have any for a week)

So ya, there are addictive personalities and it seems to me that the amount of their addiction depends on the depth they have allowed themselves to sink. So a tabacco addict won't be addicted to anything worse than tabacco as long as they don't go into weed, and it won't get worse than weed if they don't allow themselves to sink deeper. But once they hit a depth it sure seems like everything above that level is completely fair game to them and they'll hit it all as often as they can.

Medical marijuna may help some, but seeing that most people with a weed card only have it so they can get high kind of undermines in my mind everyone that has it.
 
Good points, and a good discussion..
However, I would point out that since the 30s (when Dr. would give a script for it) then it was outlawed, then the war on drugs, and so on..
It is proven that the potency of it now is higher than the average then. There are new strains of Sativa that are in the 30% range for THC, which is much more than even the best of the 70s weeds.

Ndindy you do make a good point about addictive personalities, but that also comes back to, that is someone that should be careful. But, because of that one person each of you have in mind does that mean that Charlotte should have to die? Do I think that it's good for kids to get it, no, but i also think the same about drinking too. There are cases where in measured doses its a good thing, but for the most no.. But, ask any teen or DEA agent and they will tell you that it's harder to get things that are legal than illegal.. The black market doesn't card.
But, do we do a good job of keeping drinking out of kids hands, no, and it could be better with that and drugs.
Most of us know a teen that is abusing medical drugs. We just don't know it yet. most kids are dying from RX drugs, and parents should be held accountable, and responsible.

I have been to the medical dispensaries, yes i would agree that at first glance it appears to be a shell game. Pay $140 for a card and now, boom, you are free to smoke at home or in private and not have to worry..
But, just think about that.. It's so bad.. But if you give us $140 now it's legal for just you, and now you can have all the puffing fun you want.. So the Government doesn't want it, tells you it's bad, you know someone that was a dead beat, but to Eugene's point i bet they were less than stellar as a kid too. But, hey now you are legal..
Sounds like a suppressor.. You can't have one, it's bad, it's for criminals that want to shoot up towns and hide, it's illegal and it's a federal law... No it doesn't touch the bullet, no it doesn't put marks on the bullet, and no it doesn't silence it, just tunes it down. Pay the government $200 and fill out a form, and now just you are good to go.. SHoot all you want, and have fun.. Make all the puff sounds out of your gun, don't share it, don't forget your paperwork or you go to jail.. But, now you and you alone are good..

Sounds like it's illegal unless you pay them.. Then it's legal.. Does that really sound like the kind of government you learned about growing up?

Oh, and remember George Washington and Jefferson, and many other founders grew pot on their farms with tobacco, and moonshine.. Guess it's only since the 70's that it's now dangerous and we need to nanny state you morons.. (tongue in cheek, sarcasm about how gov. knows best)
 
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