Chemotherapy for dogs

Miz Kiz

New member
I was just wondering if anyone has had any experience with giving a dog chemotherapy for cancer. If so, how was it tolerated by the dog and what side effects did it give.

Our GSD will soon start a 15 week regime for it and I'm wondering what to expect. (It's 5 treatments with 3 weeks between each one.) Our vet has said that dogs generally tolerate it much better than humans. However, that doesn't tell me what to expect precisely.

I've read about it online, but I'd like to hear about someone's personal experience with it, if any.
Thanks.
 
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I can sure walk over and chat with our vet about it if you'd like.
As I'm staying in town for a few more days, he's only a block or so away.
 
As a stage IV colon cancer patient undergoing chemo every 14 days, as much as I love dogs, I don't think I would subject my dog to that. There are too many side affects that are actually painful, and adding to that the potential for diarrhea, constipation, vomiting, etc;, I just don't think I would do it.

Losing one is like losing a member of the family, but they ARE animals, not people. I think I would just keep him/her around until it became obviously painful, then say goodbye and have a vet give them a quick trip to wherever dogs go when they die.

Just my sincere, respectful opinion. I am sorry your dog has cancer; it is an ugly, ugly disease.
 
Originally Posted By: DoublessAs a stage IV colon cancer patient undergoing chemo every 14 days, as much as I love dogs, I don't think I would subject my dog to that. ....
Just my sincere, respectful opinion. I am sorry your dog has cancer; it is an ugly, ugly disease.

Doubless, I am so sorry to know that you are experiencing this. I sincerely appreciate your sharing your insight and opinion with me.

I was initially completely against it too, but have learned that the intensity of the treatment for dogs is not nearly that of what it is for humans. For humans, the goal of treatment is 'cure', which means eradication of the disease. For dogs, the goal is much less ambitious, as it is only intended to slow the disease down. Which I suppose is why dogs are deemed to tolerate it 'better than humans'. Her cancer has not yet spread, as far as tests have shown, so the hope is to keep it from doing so, or at least slow down it's process.

In any event, I am saddened to know that you have first hand experience with this, and I pray that your treatment will lead to a complete and total remission of disease.
 
Originally Posted By: RJM AcresI can sure walk over and chat with our vet about it if you'd like.
As I'm staying in town for a few more days, he's only a block or so away.


RJM, I'm sorry I didn't see this sooner. That's a very kind offer and I greatly appreciate it. I really don't want to put you out though.

Our vet is young and that's not a bad thing. He is very approachable, but I get the impression he hasn't had a lot of first hand experience with actually witnessing the effects of the treatment. He is consulting with a vet oncologist on the case, who obviously does have the experience, but I am still curious as to real world realities vs vet school perception.
 
Miz Kiz, I got to come back home to the farm yesterday afternoon but I'm going
to be back up there a couple of times next week. I'll check with the vet then.
 
Sorry to hear what your going through with your dog.

My better half is a Veterinarian and I asked her about the chemotherapy treatment that you spoke of. I wasn't even aware that they did this kind of treatment to dogs.

She reiterated what you said about the dogs generally taking it better than humans do because they don't get the side effects that humans do like the loss of appetite, and the hair loss.

If you have any specific questions on the treatment I could ask her for you.
 
NYyotekiller: Thank you so much for asking your wife, and replying. It is reassuring to hear the same information from another source. I can't think of any specific questions at this point, but your offer is greatly appreciated.

This option is new to us as well and one we passed up 6 months ago. However, she's just had her second surgery to remove the growths that popped up in the same location as before. Our plan had been local control, but when it popped up so quickly in the same place we felt it warranted a different approach. She has no visible mets. on her lungs or liver, according to x-ray and ultra-sound, so she is a good candidate according to all concerned. Yet, there are obviously no guarantees, other than we'll do our best by her.

RJM Acres: You are too kind. I know you've got other things to do, but if you find yourself talking to the vet and wish to ask, I am definitely all ears.
 
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Sorry I didn't get back to you on this.
I haven't learned anything on it yet even [beeep] I was at the vets for hours on Sunday.
I just kind of forgot to ask him.

How's your pooch doing ?
Chemo started yet ?
 
Miz Kiz, I am assuming from your last post that your GSD has cutaneous hemangiosarcoma. You are correct in that the treatment regimen that we use in dogs is far less intense than chemotherapy in humans. In humans we aim for a cure, which can be thought of as trying to get another 15-30 years of life. In dogs, due to their shorter lifespan, we aim for maybe 1-2 more years, 3 if we are lucky. That all results in chemotherapy that is far less intense, and thus far easier for the dog to handle.

That being said, these drugs are still pretty harsh. Most commonly you'll see GI signs: decreased appetite, diarrhea, vomiting, etc. These drugs also suppress the immune system and can cause neutropenia (decreased white blood cells), which makes dogs more susceptible to infection. That is one of the reasons your veterinarian will likely recommend frequent recheck bloodwork, to monitor white blood cell counts, among other things (kidney values, liver values, etc). Like all medicines, there are other possible side effects, but GI and neutropenia are the most common.

Now, I am not a veterinary oncologist, but I am recently out of school and saw a LOT of cancer while I was there. I also don't know what treatment protocol your vet will be using, so there may be other side effects depending on the drug or drugs used.
 
This is obviously not "just a dog" but a member of yours and Kizmo's family... Sorry I don't have any info on chemo but I hope it all comes out for the best... My household does not have dogs.. Just 4 legged family members... IMO they are worth fighting for...
 
Neighbor's lab had cancer and he had surgery to remove a tumor, then treatments - don't know exact details, but he was a bit under the weather for while, and there were some sort of peeing issues - i think they had to leave him out like hourly so he didn't pee on the floor. It's a couple years later now and the dog seems good as ever. That dog is now maybe 7 yrs old? Good luck.
 
I apologize for not responding sooner to these posts. With the pleasant temps, good weather, and a tournament next weekend, it's been a busy archery week here at the house for the homeschool team of 34! (Actually 2 teams of about 17, but they all practice together thus it's a small invasion of teens and pre-teens. All are great kids, and responsible, but.... kids.
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Our GSD started chemo Wednesday morning, and now at 2 days out she is showing no major adverse symptoms. She is sleeping a bit, but no more than usual. Her appetite has actually increased, which I find interesting, and her "output" to put it politely is about the same, although she was quite gassy the night of her treatment. (
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) She has a terribly sensitive stomach, and curls her lips and starts to heave whenever food of strong aroma is cooked, so for her to not have any stomach upset yet is a blessing. It may be coming, but I won't beg trouble.

Her only problem, is the one Mike B. mentioned his neighbor's dog having, which is her urine output is GREATLY increased. (Considering this is a nearly 100 lb dog, it's not a trivial matter, but now that we're aware we are taking her out about every 30 minutes.) I talked to our vet about it yesterday and we're both of the belief that this is due to the fluids she was given, but we're watching it. In 24 hours it has improved, though not completely abated.

RJM Acres:No worries about not talking to your vet about it. I heard you had your hands full with your own pooch. I hope he/she is doing a lot better!

Chris K. I'm embarrassed to say that when I hear medical terms my brain freezes. (This annoys Kizmo no end, given he's a doc and all, but it's an innately emotional response that is rather hard-wired for me, but I do my best.) It is indeed hemangiosarcoma, first found at the skin, and so far no where else as far as we know, so I'm guessing it would indeed be cutaneous hemangiosarcoma. I don't recall which drug he is using, but I will ask when I talk with him next. I did know, but brain-freeze also amounts to loss of info, as well.

Thank you so much for the information on this (and congratulations on recently graduating form vet school too!) It's quite helpful to see this info in writing, and explained so well. (In writing it doesn't freeze my brain, as I can read it slowly and wait for the emotional response to pass.:)) Yes, our vet did do more blood work and said he would repeat it probably after her 3rd dose, etc. He does know he has free reign to test what he feels is appropriate, so if it's needed earlier I told him to do so. He is a very approachable and responsive vet and I appreciate that very much. I wish my ability to absorb what he says was as reliable.

Infidel 762: I try to keep perspective. I know she's not human, but she is ABSOLUTELY family. She is smarter than some people, and has a better heart than many. She was purchased as Kiz,Jr's companion/protector when he was 9, which was 7.5 years ago. She has always taken her responsibility with him very seriously. Obviously now, the nature of their relationship is different, but she still adores him. Needing a 'job', and being an inside dog, she has become my constant companion. She stays no more than 3 feet from me wherever I am, so she moves from the laundry room to the kitchen to the family room, out to the yard and back as many times a day as I do.

As an aside to share how she's treated, she rides shotgun in my car, window and sunroof open to keep her from getting sick. Her song is Pharrell's "Happy", because that's what she looks like when she's riding; she LOVES it, and smiles broadly! So, we always leave the house with that song on if she's in the car. I accidentally had John Denver's "Lady" playing one day (which for those who don't know is a slow, mellow song that starts with "Lady, are you crying?") She turned to look at me, head tucked down into her neck, as she looked up through her eye lids, as if to say "NOT my song Mom!" LOL I quickly changed it!

Mike B. Your neighbor's experience is exactly the type of personal insight I was hoping to find. If I had checked back here sooner I would have been better prepared. Also, your neighbor's dogs' result is very encouraging! Thank you so much for the info.
 
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Miz Kiz,

First and foremost, I know I'm coming a bit late to this post, but I'm so sorry to hear about you and Kiz's ailing pooch! I've really come to enjoy "chats" with Kiz over the last couple years, so I hope your early catch here pays off for your pup!

My wife is a 14yr career veterinary technician (basically an animal nurse), and the clinic where she has worked for the last 10yrs offers a lot more specialty medicine than the average small animal practice.

Nothing really new based on what you've mentioned, but maybe a bit of confirmation might help.

My wife said that hemangiosarcoma and lymphoma are the two most common types that they see at her clinic, but she doesn't personally have experience with chemotherapy for hemangiosarcoma because usually by the time it presents symptoms - usually lack of appetite - it has already metastasized to the liver, spleen, heart, or lungs, and it's too late for surgical solutions or chemo to do much more than add an extra year of feeling like crap. SO IT'S GREAT NEWS THAT YOU CAUGHT IT EARLY!!!

We also had a lab/retriever cross that had hemangiosarcoma of our own. His never manifested on his skin, at least not appreciably, so the ONE DAY my wife noticed that he didn't want to eat breakfast, she took him to work and found it had advanced to his spleen and lungs - already too late for us. It escalated quickly from there, and Titus was a part of our family, so it was very difficult losing him. Thankfully, as odd as it seems to say it this way, it acted quickly, so he didn't have much time being ill before his hemorrhagic tumors pulled the plug - we got about a week.

She says it's great that they've been able to remove it from the skin, and hopes that the chemo will help prevent it from spreading. You're a long way ahead of the curve.

Like Chris K. mentioned, my wife said that dogs tend to get much less aggressive treatment than humans and tend to respond very well if the cancer is caught early - again, even though she hasn't personally experienced chemo application for hemangiosarcoma - but the GI side effects mentioned so far are pretty standard fare.

Good luck, keep us posted, and God bless!
 
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