Best made AR-15 ?

Originally Posted By: BrandonU.Seriously just do some research and BUILD YOUR OWN AR. What will happen is you will buy and AR that is stock and more than likely you will pull half of the crap off and change. So instead save you some money build the guy from ground up and save some money. Buy a stipped blem lower for about $40 and I get mine a fatboytactical.net, buy yourself just the standarded upper with BCG, firing pin etc. If you want it for accuracy spend the money on a good barrel. Black hole Weaponry etc. Most of the high price AR-15 I guarantee you their lowers are made by Anderson MFG. Which you can get for $40. Take the time build your rifle then you will also know your own rifle unlike a lot of people that go out and just buy one plus you will save yourself some money. Don't fall for the whole name crap. My friend has a $2000.00 Wilson Combat and I built my AR for $775 and the look exactly the same. The funny thing is he had 3 failure to eject but wait he spent $2000.00 for this Ar it shouldn't do that. Anyways I hope you get my point save yourself the money and just build it.


The cost savings of building your own isn't really there. I've built a couple and when I looked at pricing to build a different variant about 6 months ago I noticed 2 things....many parts weren't available due to back orders and the ones that were available were very expensive.

Where are you finding blem lowers for $40?
 
Originally Posted By: Dixiedog1The cost savings of building your own isn't really there. I've built a couple and when I looked at pricing to build a different variant about 6 months ago I noticed 2 things....many parts weren't available due to back orders and the ones that were available were very expensive.

I'll be your huckleberry on this. I've built around a hundred AR's in the last 15yrs, and am currently building 3 complete rifles + one complete upper. You CAN INDEED save money by building your own.

Nobody can argue that it's hard to beat the price point on the cheap carbines out there in the $700 mark, but it's REALLY easy to build an equivalent carbine for $600 (savings gets soaked up by the tool cost to build it, as you need about $100 in specific tools). BUT, the second you add anything to that cheap carbine, you're losing money. The differential on any upgrades to that factory model is just added cost, whereas you could have bought a slightly more expensive part - the same part you upgraded to for the cheap carbine - and saved money.

When you compare enhanced rifles, then building your own blows the factory models out of the water, especially the super tricked out models like Black Rain with ridiculous price points.

Best way to save money on anything: Be patient and wait for sales For example: Brownells just had a sale on Bushmaster Stripped Uppers and Lowers for $50 each, NOT BLEMS. Bushy BCG assy's were on sale for $80 (bolt included). Normal list price for these puts the receivers + BCG at $400, but on sale they could be had for $180, saves you $220 on your home brew. Cabelas just had an online sale for Nikon M-223 1" scope mounts for $40, normal list of $80+, saves you another $40. Cabelas had a sale on stainless steel Blackhawk Mags last month (or month before) for $5.99 each, which is cheaper even than poly mags normally, and about 1/2 price for what you'd normally expect to pay for 30rnd stainless steel mags - buy 5 mags, you're $30 saved. Black Hole Weaponry has a deal that if you're a member of their online forum, you get 10% off on their barrels - saved me ~$30 each on the 3 barrels I just ordered.

Rem R-15's, Bushmaster Predators/Varminters, Rock River Coyotes/Predators, etc etc, most all of these models run somewhere in the $1000-1200 mark.

So let's look at what those are: heavy match barrel rifles with slick/round float tubes, and good triggers. Comparatively, for $1050 each, I have 2 rifles on my bench right now, with heavy match barrels, good triggers, customizable float tubes, oversized mag releases, forward assists, and bolt stops, and adjustable gas blocks. If I were to upgrade an R-15, Coyote, or Varminter to an adjustable gas block, enhanced mag release, trigger guard, and bolt stops, and add the two short rails that I want to the forend, I would have almost $1350 into them, but mine were $1050. If I would have used White Oak Barrels, I could have gotten them done for about $50 less, and if I'd have gone with something like a DPMS barrel, $100+ less.

It's not a lot of savings, but it's a REAL savings.

EDIT: Now, I WILL concede that when you build your own, it's really easy to get carried away and "spend a little more" on every part of the rifle, then end up with $2500-3000 sunk into it. It's really easy to justify spending an extra $30 on a gas block, just like it'd be really easy to justify spending an extra $100 on a complete rifle, but when you spend an extra $50 for a nickel boron bcg, an extra $10 on a dust cover with your cartridge stamped on it, an extra $50 for an adjustable gas block, an extra $15 for a CS buffer spring, an extra $40 for a captured spring buffer, an extra $80 for a carbon fiber float tube, an extra $100 to get a fluted barrel, an extra $50 for a better trigger, add a brake for $50-100, heck, maybe just throw a piston drive on it too for $180-250... Before you know it, you're an extra thousand bucks into your build!
 
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I have seen a lot of AR's, factory rifles like Bushmaster, and custom built like JP and Dtech. I don't see much comparison at all. The JP and Dtechs are built much better and function perfectly. If you are one of the lucky guys who can build your own with comparable quality at less cost, you'd be nuts not to go for it. But don't entertain any fairy tales that you are going to equal custom built.
 
Originally Posted By: possumalI have seen a lot of AR's, factory rifles like Bushmaster, and custom built like JP and Dtech. I don't see much comparison at all. The JP and Dtechs are built much better and function perfectly. If you are one of the lucky guys who can build your own with comparable quality at less cost, you'd be nuts not to go for it. But don't entertain any fairy tales that you are going to equal custom built.

I can agree with that, to SOME extent, but with two caveats:

1) Much of what makes up "perceived quality" isn't actually related to function. By nature, when we see something that LOOKS good, we tend to think that it IS good. But a better finish doesn't make a better AR. Sure, it looks better, but external finish rarely means anything in terms of function or durability for AR's.

2) The majority of the gap between a custom builder and a factory built or DIY built rifle is not about parts. The vast majority of their parts are from the same exact supply chain that the rest of us have access to. For example, Mike uses Oly uppers, Shilen barrels, hogue and magpul furniture, etc etc. His gas blocks and his custom float tube are his, but any of us can buy those as component parts. What makes the difference is the expertise of the folks putting them together. If a guy spends the time to fit and tune his own build, or even his own factory rifle, he can make huge improvements in its functional performance. None of us have the expertise that these custom builders have, nor do most of us have machining capabilities (and expertise), so we can't deliver on the same quality that they do, but we can close a lot of the gap between a bone stock factory rifle and a custom job.

So with a custom builder rifle, you're not really buying better PARTS than you could get elsewhere, you're buying a better builder!
 
I am speaking more of function and performance. Some are more appealing to the eye, but that is not part of my statement. A custom builder can use his machining expertise to make improvements, and he does that. I have seen 5 or 6 JP AR's, all in 223 caliber, and they all shot factory Hornady ammo in sub moa groups, consistently. TR of Colorado has a Dtech in 204 that is a one hole grouper, and awesome in the field. I suppose the DIY guy can judge his build's performance by those standards. If he is satisfied, with less money involved, he should be happy.
 
Building or "bolting together" AR's is simple and easy. Accuracy has a lot to do with the pipe thats on it. Iv seen cheap guns with good barrels shoot really dam good. Some parts are nicer but dont improve function. Like billet stuff, they are so bulky because billet alum. is actually weaker than 7075-T6.
 
The Cerro key hole on the upper just means that the aluminum was forged there. But in the case of Daniel Defense and Ambush Firearms they actually machine the uppers themselves using their own machinery and tool cutters. Just like the buy the metal for their barrels and then cold forge hammer then into shape. They also do the magnetic particle testing and such on all the critical metal parts.
 
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