16" vs. 20" rifle
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SlickerThanSnot
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Originally Posted By: BigGrizz This may help you understand: www.precisionreflex.com/Content.aspx?PAGE=Mark12+Mod+0+SPR
Yote Perisher
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I've had a 20" Krieger barreled AR for the last 10 years (weighs 12 lbs) and it is very accurate. But I have finally decided to put build a new lightweight upper using a 16" fluted barrel and lightweight upper parts to reduce overall weight. I know its gonna be louder but going to suppress it eventually. Hopefully when it's all said and done I can have the perfect coyote rifle for me that's lightweight, accurate, and relatively quiet. Good luck with whatever choice you make.
steve garrett
Active member
for a calling rifle I think you need to go with a 20" barrel, crowned or threaded with thread protector on. But not a RRA barrel, those barrels are hbar profile which are fairly heavy when they are 20". I put together a upper with a criterion hybrid barrel. its not a pencil barrel but it does have some metal turned off under the handguard. it makes for a decent weight not too heavy. The barrel is pretty accurate MOA or less with some of the factory loads I have tried. in reality as a calling rifle and as a 223, MOA accuracy is all you need or can use. This barrel shoots the same loads over 200 fps faster than my 16" upper. I will take all the speed I can get. I would rather the barrel not be chrome lined, but that is the only way they sell the hybrid. lilja makes something similar as well as black hole.
The 16" IMO should not be used as a coyote rig. you loose too much speed. its not like your hiking in the mountains, the extra portablity of a 16" is not needed when calling. 20" barrel with some metal turned off under the handguard is the ulitmate setup IMO
The 16" IMO should not be used as a coyote rig. you loose too much speed. its not like your hiking in the mountains, the extra portablity of a 16" is not needed when calling. 20" barrel with some metal turned off under the handguard is the ulitmate setup IMO
16" is the longest I have and I don't see any need for anything longer in a .223. Almost all the places I hunt 300 yards would be about the maximum I would have to shoot and that is easily done with a 16" barrel. I will take the shorter length and lighter weight over the extra 120 or so fps. I would even go shorter if I could, but my state doesn't allow SBR's. Also, I hunt with electronic ear muffs, so noise isn't a concern.
Rock Knocker
Active member
I haven't read all three pages of this thread, so if this has already been covered... oh well.
I just put an AR together with a 16" Black Hole Weaponry polygonally rifled barrel. All I've dont so far was get it zerod. I have read on the good ole' internet that these polygonal rifled barrels shoot faster than a land and groove rifle, something about less pressure and allowing more powder to be put behind the bullet. Some people on the interweb were claiming to be getting velocities more typical of a 20" barrel from their 16". Also as good as 1/2"moa(internet measurement.)
It sounded too good for me to pass up, I will be testing loads soon. I don't have a chrono so I wont be able to say much about the speeds unless I measure drops at long range.
I just put an AR together with a 16" Black Hole Weaponry polygonally rifled barrel. All I've dont so far was get it zerod. I have read on the good ole' internet that these polygonal rifled barrels shoot faster than a land and groove rifle, something about less pressure and allowing more powder to be put behind the bullet. Some people on the interweb were claiming to be getting velocities more typical of a 20" barrel from their 16". Also as good as 1/2"moa(internet measurement.)
It sounded too good for me to pass up, I will be testing loads soon. I don't have a chrono so I wont be able to say much about the speeds unless I measure drops at long range.
DiRTY DOG
Well-known member
I'm not a mathematician, but I did run some numbers concerning velocity in 16" and 20" barrels. I compared published/reported muzzle velocities and corresponding impact velocities at given distances.
Seems the PRACTICAL difference in the field between a 20" vs 16" barrel is less than I would have thought. For Example:
A 100 yard shot from a 16" barrel would have the same* terminal ballistics as a 125 yard shot from a 20" barrel. You're basically giving yourself a 25 yard handicap by using a shorter 16" vs 20" barrel with accompanying velocity loss. Big whoopie. In the field at typical hunting distances, the difference is pretty much negligible.
Arguing the advantage of an 18" "SPR" barrel over a 16" barrel is laughable at predator hunting distances. You only gain maybe 10-15 yards advantage with the longer barrel.
With a 24" barrel you've got about a 50 yard advantage over a 16" barrel. Still not really a big deal. Ballisticaly, a 100 yard shot with a 16" carbine barrel is like a 150 yard shot with a 24" rifle when comparing terminal ballistics. A 50 yard handicap. Still plenty lethal. At worst it reduces the "effective" range of your 223 from 300 yards down to 250/275 yards, but most of us rarely shoot that far and certainly not often while hunting predators.
Or is my math wrong?
Seems the PRACTICAL difference in the field between a 20" vs 16" barrel is less than I would have thought. For Example:
A 100 yard shot from a 16" barrel would have the same* terminal ballistics as a 125 yard shot from a 20" barrel. You're basically giving yourself a 25 yard handicap by using a shorter 16" vs 20" barrel with accompanying velocity loss. Big whoopie. In the field at typical hunting distances, the difference is pretty much negligible.
Arguing the advantage of an 18" "SPR" barrel over a 16" barrel is laughable at predator hunting distances. You only gain maybe 10-15 yards advantage with the longer barrel.
With a 24" barrel you've got about a 50 yard advantage over a 16" barrel. Still not really a big deal. Ballisticaly, a 100 yard shot with a 16" carbine barrel is like a 150 yard shot with a 24" rifle when comparing terminal ballistics. A 50 yard handicap. Still plenty lethal. At worst it reduces the "effective" range of your 223 from 300 yards down to 250/275 yards, but most of us rarely shoot that far and certainly not often while hunting predators.
Or is my math wrong?
DiRTY DOG
Well-known member
Originally Posted By: Chalky47So if there is no advantage over the longer barrel why are people building rifles with 18"-24" barrels? I am considering an 18" rifle but if no advantage is to be had why not go shorter? Thanks for any feedback.
Chalky, My opinion: The whole 18" "SPR" movement is a tactical fad. As if somehow a 16" carbine is just ok, but an extra 2" on the barrel suddenly turns it into an "accurate" special rifle. But a 20" barrel is not special at all, it's "too heavy" or "too long". So you need to buy a special non-typical length expensive 18" barrel so you can be just like the video game. Also with an 18" barrel you can now add a huge tactical scope, before that the rifle was only worthy of an ACOG. Make sure you have lots of sharp rails on every surface of your forearm so you can cover them up with rail covers. Modular is tactical. Notice how all the super tactical quad rails are on their way "out" because folks are finally realizing they're kinda pointless. Fad.
You get more velocity with a longer barrel. True. Varmint hunters and target shooters who shoot out past 300-500 yards will benefit from higher velocities and less drop. If that's your deal then you'd be better off with a 24" barrel.
For hunters, the performance difference between a 16" vs a 20" barrel is pretty small. The 20" barrel does have a very slight advantage, if you want it then get it. But there really isn't much difference. The shorter 16" barrel will be easier to carry for sure.
Chalky, My opinion: The whole 18" "SPR" movement is a tactical fad. As if somehow a 16" carbine is just ok, but an extra 2" on the barrel suddenly turns it into an "accurate" special rifle. But a 20" barrel is not special at all, it's "too heavy" or "too long". So you need to buy a special non-typical length expensive 18" barrel so you can be just like the video game. Also with an 18" barrel you can now add a huge tactical scope, before that the rifle was only worthy of an ACOG. Make sure you have lots of sharp rails on every surface of your forearm so you can cover them up with rail covers. Modular is tactical. Notice how all the super tactical quad rails are on their way "out" because folks are finally realizing they're kinda pointless. Fad.
You get more velocity with a longer barrel. True. Varmint hunters and target shooters who shoot out past 300-500 yards will benefit from higher velocities and less drop. If that's your deal then you'd be better off with a 24" barrel.
For hunters, the performance difference between a 16" vs a 20" barrel is pretty small. The 20" barrel does have a very slight advantage, if you want it then get it. But there really isn't much difference. The shorter 16" barrel will be easier to carry for sure.
Chalky47
New member
Awesome and thanks for the reply. I do agree that it does seem to be a fad going through involving SPR type rifles. It all comes down to the environment you hunt and what you use the rifle for. For me I just want a rifle that won't break and make me wish I picked up a bolt gun instead.
Chalky,
Chalky,