coyotekillerNE
New member
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!
Need a quick answer please
- Thread starter coyotekillerNE
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coyotekillerNE
New member
Thanks Greg!
coyotekillerNE
New member
I was kind of wondering why it was less than the 55gr. Vmax? I thought the 53 was a longer bullet, which of course doesn't necessarily have to translate into longer c.o.l, but kind of makes sense. Idk?
coyotekillerNE
New member
I should not say longer, but equal to the 55 gr. Vmax.
White Smoke
New member
I'm shooting 24.0 grains of H335 with a CCI 450 magnum primer and a COAL of 2.25" and shooting groups of 0.55" out of mine. Absolutely LOVE that bullet! [beeep] lead ban!
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White Smoke
New member
What you really need to do is to get an OAL gauge to measure the exact distance to the lands for each bullet and then back them off per the manufacturers recommendations. For example, I am just now working up a load for the Barnes 50-grain TSX FB (because of the bleepin' lead ban). With that bullet in my OAL gauge, the distance to the lands measured 2.23". Barnes recommends setting their bullets 0.05" off the lands. Therefore 2.23" minus 0.05" equals 2.18" as a COAL for that particular bullet. Each bullet is different so you need to measure each weight/style of bullet to get the length to the lands FOR THAT PARTICULAR BULLET and go from there.
coyotekillerNE
New member
Originally Posted By: White SmokeWhat you really need to do is to get an OAL gauge to measure the exact distance to the lands for each bullet and then back them off per the manufacturers recommendations. For example, I am just now working up a load for the Barnes 50-grain TSX FB (because of the bleepin' lead ban). With that bullet in my OAL gauge, the distance to the lands measured 2.23". Barnes recommends setting their bullets 0.05" off the lands. Therefore 2.23" minus 0.05" equals 2.18" as a COAL for that particular bullet. Each bullet is different so you need to measure each weight/style of bullet to get the length to the lands FOR THAT PARTICULAR BULLET and go from there.
Meh, I just needed a starting point. I'll move the bullets closer or further away from the lands depending on accuracy. I'm not competing in bench matches, so I'm not going to take the time to measure every bullet. I find a good load that functions well and go shoot. I'd rather be shooting than over analyzing for a 1/10" more accuracy. Different strokes for different folks.
Meh, I just needed a starting point. I'll move the bullets closer or further away from the lands depending on accuracy. I'm not competing in bench matches, so I'm not going to take the time to measure every bullet. I find a good load that functions well and go shoot. I'd rather be shooting than over analyzing for a 1/10" more accuracy. Different strokes for different folks.
White Smoke
New member
You don't need to measure EACH bullet. You need to measure each different bullet ONCE. A good starting point is to put the bullet you want to use in the gauge, measure the OAL distance to where the bullet JUST touches the lands. Once you have the distance to the lands, just subtract 0.05" and that's the OAL to load. That's it! Then just load all your ammo to that length.
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CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
Originally Posted By: CatShooter
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
Originally Posted By: GLShooterOriginally Posted By: CatShooter
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
i think some have missed the point. the length suggested in the first response is fine if the rounds need to fit in an ar15 magazine. but, i did not see magazine constraints listed in the OP. to determine best length without magazine considerations is what some have alluded to in their posts. however, i doubt that you really want to seat the bullets to .05" off the lands, i believe .005" is what would be intended. and for that, no one can tell you without having your gun in hand.
if you are just loading generic ammo to fit in all guns or you are not trying to optimize accuracy, or you are loading for an AR, then stick with the 2.24" length.
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
i think some have missed the point. the length suggested in the first response is fine if the rounds need to fit in an ar15 magazine. but, i did not see magazine constraints listed in the OP. to determine best length without magazine considerations is what some have alluded to in their posts. however, i doubt that you really want to seat the bullets to .05" off the lands, i believe .005" is what would be intended. and for that, no one can tell you without having your gun in hand.
if you are just loading generic ammo to fit in all guns or you are not trying to optimize accuracy, or you are loading for an AR, then stick with the 2.24" length.
Originally Posted By: 6724Originally Posted By: GLShooterOriginally Posted By: CatShooter
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
i think some have missed the point. the length suggested in the first response is fine if the rounds need to fit in an ar15 magazine. but, i did not see magazine constraints listed in the OP. to determine best length without magazine considerations is what some have alluded to in their posts. however, i doubt that you really want to seat the bullets to .05" off the lands, i believe .005" is what would be intended. and for that, no one can tell you without having your gun in hand.
if you are just loading generic ammo to fit in all guns or you are not trying to optimize accuracy, or you are loading for an AR, then stick with the 2.24" length.
Right you are but the question was for recommended COL. That would imnply to me that the OP wanted a verifiable source. Obviously every rilfe we shoot has variations regardless if they are chambered side by side. The books don't differentiate, normaly, between an AR15 magazine and a 700 Remington Varmint set up. Recomendations are just that. One size fits all for starters.
Hornady says 2.240. They probably know their product and give a number thatthey know, historically, is safe to use in modern MASS produced firearms/. A custom reamer can be all over the place but that number wil be GTG in 99.99% of the cases. Safe is, as we know, not always the most accurate. We can have both and still be safe.
I, for one, have NEVER loaded anything in that weight range to 2.240 in my 223's. I have the tools to measure the distance to lands and know that I am limited, in most cases, to 2.260 so I have my AO defined for me. Given a single load scenario I've loaded some cartidges in teh 223 way past 2.320. The bullets performed better with less jump, of no jump, and adn sure wouldn't fit in even the storied DPMS High Power magazines.
We have to start some where and the book is alweays a good place to go. Fine tuning for the task at hand determines where we go from X to get to Z.
Greg
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
i think some have missed the point. the length suggested in the first response is fine if the rounds need to fit in an ar15 magazine. but, i did not see magazine constraints listed in the OP. to determine best length without magazine considerations is what some have alluded to in their posts. however, i doubt that you really want to seat the bullets to .05" off the lands, i believe .005" is what would be intended. and for that, no one can tell you without having your gun in hand.
if you are just loading generic ammo to fit in all guns or you are not trying to optimize accuracy, or you are loading for an AR, then stick with the 2.24" length.
Right you are but the question was for recommended COL. That would imnply to me that the OP wanted a verifiable source. Obviously every rilfe we shoot has variations regardless if they are chambered side by side. The books don't differentiate, normaly, between an AR15 magazine and a 700 Remington Varmint set up. Recomendations are just that. One size fits all for starters.
Hornady says 2.240. They probably know their product and give a number thatthey know, historically, is safe to use in modern MASS produced firearms/. A custom reamer can be all over the place but that number wil be GTG in 99.99% of the cases. Safe is, as we know, not always the most accurate. We can have both and still be safe.
I, for one, have NEVER loaded anything in that weight range to 2.240 in my 223's. I have the tools to measure the distance to lands and know that I am limited, in most cases, to 2.260 so I have my AO defined for me. Given a single load scenario I've loaded some cartidges in teh 223 way past 2.320. The bullets performed better with less jump, of no jump, and adn sure wouldn't fit in even the storied DPMS High Power magazines.
We have to start some where and the book is alweays a good place to go. Fine tuning for the task at hand determines where we go from X to get to Z.
Greg
CatShooter
New member
Originally Posted By: GLShooterOriginally Posted By: CatShooter
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
Sorry... I missed that when I read further down.
Originally Posted By: coyotekillerNE
"Need a quick answer please
Can somebody please tell me the recommended C.O.L. of Hornady 53 grain vmax in .223. Thanks guys!"
A simple question, to which you have not gotten an answer yet... in spite of a lengthy reply suggesting that you buy measuring tools to measure WHAT??
The SAAMI recommended COL is from 2.125" to 2.260"
That is the "recommended" range - but many shooters load to the leade.
If you are loading for AR magazines, loading to 2.240" will make sure that they will feed, but not stick in beat-up magazines.
That's funny. I seem to recall answering with the recomendation from Hornady of 2.240 in less than 10 minutes of the intial posting.
Also the OP thanked me for the response apparently meeting his needs at the time.
I guess you are to wound up to read responses from other experienced shooters and handloaders.
Greg
Sorry... I missed that when I read further down.
White Smoke
New member
This is direct from Hornady...
The recommended seating depth for that bullet is 2.240”, primarily so the cartridge can be loaded in a standard AR style magazine. We recommend that you start .010” to .020” off of the lands as you are working up your loads but this will depend on the type of firearm you are using and what the throat dimensions of the gun are as well. As referred to earlier it will also make a difference depending on the action type as you will, generally, be able to seat the bullet longer in a bolt action or single shot rifle. Make sure you keep at least a caliber equivalent length of the bullet in the case neck for support.
The recommended seating depth for that bullet is 2.240”, primarily so the cartridge can be loaded in a standard AR style magazine. We recommend that you start .010” to .020” off of the lands as you are working up your loads but this will depend on the type of firearm you are using and what the throat dimensions of the gun are as well. As referred to earlier it will also make a difference depending on the action type as you will, generally, be able to seat the bullet longer in a bolt action or single shot rifle. Make sure you keep at least a caliber equivalent length of the bullet in the case neck for support.
White Smoke
New member
As he said, Greg answered the basic question in less than 10 minutes...2.240" OAL. However, since there is a lot more to reloading that just seating to recommended OAL, I recommended seating to a distance off the lands as recommended by the manufacturer. Hornady recommends 0.010" to 0.020" off the lands FOR THAT PARTICULAR BULLET. My example was with a Barnes bullet, and their recommendation was to seat the bullet 0.050", again FOR THAT BULLET.
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Originally Posted By: White SmokeAs he said, Greg answered the basic question in less than 10 minutes...2.240" OAL. However, since there is a lot more to reloading that just seating to recommended OAL, I recommended seating to a distance off the lands as recommended by the manufacturer. Hornady recommends 0.010" to 0.020" off the lands FOR THAT PARTICULAR BULLET. My example was with a Barnes bullet, and their recommendation was to seat the bullet 0.050", again FOR THAT BULLET.
I think with the advent of the new genre of bullets that it is a very interesting learning curve. The use of VLD, Hybrid and monolithic bullets bring nuances to the game. Not for the faint of heart. The guys stuck with factory barrels in the AR are often stuck with a no go with them thanks to the magazine length restrictions. They truly are a marvel in a custom chamber or in a bolt gun. Kind of like loving Ben & Jerry's but all the Safeway carries is Blue Bunny and you are lactose intolerant.
I have been using the Sinclair tool for the lands/distance chore. I found it easier to use and more repeatable than the Hornady rig. I like using fired cases as soon as I get back from the range with a pair of fired cases as opposed to digging out the drill and having to drill and tap me a new one for the Hornady. Plus I get to use a specific fired case vs a "generic" case. I have four 6X6.8 rifles. The chambers are almost identical but the throats are wearing at a different rate thanks to having my favorites. Go figure. I do prefer the Hornady set up for shoulder setting over the RCBS Precision Case Mic's. though they are a super tool for checking an ogive measurement quickly.
Lots of fun to be had by all. Thank goodness we have a starting point for the most common pills
Greg
I think with the advent of the new genre of bullets that it is a very interesting learning curve. The use of VLD, Hybrid and monolithic bullets bring nuances to the game. Not for the faint of heart. The guys stuck with factory barrels in the AR are often stuck with a no go with them thanks to the magazine length restrictions. They truly are a marvel in a custom chamber or in a bolt gun. Kind of like loving Ben & Jerry's but all the Safeway carries is Blue Bunny and you are lactose intolerant.
I have been using the Sinclair tool for the lands/distance chore. I found it easier to use and more repeatable than the Hornady rig. I like using fired cases as soon as I get back from the range with a pair of fired cases as opposed to digging out the drill and having to drill and tap me a new one for the Hornady. Plus I get to use a specific fired case vs a "generic" case. I have four 6X6.8 rifles. The chambers are almost identical but the throats are wearing at a different rate thanks to having my favorites. Go figure. I do prefer the Hornady set up for shoulder setting over the RCBS Precision Case Mic's. though they are a super tool for checking an ogive measurement quickly.
Lots of fun to be had by all. Thank goodness we have a starting point for the most common pills
Greg