12 gauge ammo tests...gelatin & patterning

And another

Remington Hypersonic Steel BB:



And that's an excellent question from canislatrans54....my guestimate answer is that with conventional loads it's difficult to get a reasonable amount of pellets in the block (and the block is expensive and heavy!). But with today's fancy wad technology and the much denser patterns they're delivering, I think that I should do a bunch of longer range tests.

So...after I finish editing up what I've already shot, I'll get organized to do some longer range gelatin penetration tests, say at 5 yards, 20 yards, and 40 yards.

Cheers,

Brobee
 
Originally Posted By: BrobeeBiterAnd that's an excellent question from canislatrans54....my guestimate answer is that with conventional loads it's difficult to get a reasonable amount of pellets in the block (and the block is expensive and heavy!). But with today's fancy wad technology and the much denser patterns they're delivering, I think that I should do a bunch of longer range tests.

So...after I finish editing up what I've already shot, I'll get organized to do some longer range gelatin penetration tests, say at 5 yards, 20 yards, and 40 yards.

Cheers,

Brobee

Brobee, I'd not even bother with the 5 and 20 yard tests.

40, 50 maybe even 60 would be way more relevant information for most of us here.

But no matter what you do, Thanks for doing it.
 
Guys, keep in mind that what ever he does, it will be in meters.

Brobee, I hope you know I'm just bustin your chops with all the metric nonsense.


Chupa
 
Originally Posted By: doggin coyotes...Brobee, I'd not even bother with the 5 and 20 yard tests.

40, 50 maybe even 60 would be way more relevant information for most of us here.

But no matter what you do, Thanks for doing it.

+1 to shooting at a more practical distance. More chokes of varying constrictions would be helpful. Be careful about drawing conclusions from the result of a single shot. One shot simply isn't enough statistical data to conclude the result as a fact. As coyote hunters we aren't all that concerned with steel shot loads so lead and tungsten of B size and up to No. Four Buck is where it is at.

Beyond that this is a staggering amount of work, sweat, time and expense that few can really appreciate. I do understand this and I do appreciate your efforts. I think they could be an excellent contribution to all the data at the top of the page in the big shotgun sticky if you were so inclined as to post them there. Derbyacresbob did some very good penetration testing that is contained in that thread and there are numerous choke, load and pattern test in there for a reference.
 
For penetration tests at 40 yards and farther you may be able shoot at the side of the gel so there will be more surface area to hit with the pattern.

What is the length and width of the gel blocks?
 
Originally Posted By: doggin coyotes
Brobee, I'd not even bother with the 5 and 20 yard tests.

40, 50 maybe even 60 would be way more relevant information for most of us here.

But no matter what you do, Thanks for doing it.

The doorkicker crowd is mostly interested in the 5 to 25 yard envelope, so I should include these distances for sure.

But...I am really curious about the velocity/falloff equation. I've been looking for a bunch of velocity curves for various diameters of lead & steel shot, and I have already generated a set of penetration curves for steel & lead spheres based on Duncan McPherson's bullet penetration model. If I can find a good velocity model (or get someone to generate a bunch of tables), I have plans for an entire episode of penetration over range....:)

For sure though I want to do a bunch of actual gelatin tests to reference to the curves....will work it into my plans!

Brobee
 
Originally Posted By: GCOne shot simply isn't enough statistical data to conclude the result as a fact. As coyote hunters we aren't all that concerned with steel shot loads so lead and tungsten of B size and up to No. Four Buck is where it is at.


Appreciate the feedback!

I'm aspiring to keep the videos as short as possible - off camera I've done a TONNE of pattern testing and make sure I use at least 4 rounds for each gun/choke combo I'm considering using.

Coyote hunters are only a small portion of my target audience, however I am also a die-hard coyote hunter (www.coyotecanada.ca is my personal website). I've only used rifle to date, however this year I think I am going to put it away and hunt all my fur with the 12 gauge, so the tests are personally relevant to me too.

I've got 4 episodes of #4 buck filmed already, just waiting on editing. I agree that it is likely the medicine of choice for my coyote endeavours, and I think I'll be starting out this year's coyote expedition with the Hornady Versatite Wadded #4 buck.

Thanks again for all the feedback!

Brobee
 
Originally Posted By: derbyacresbobFor penetration tests at 40 yards and farther you may be able shoot at the side of the gel so there will be more surface area to hit with the pattern.

What is the length and width of the gel blocks?

Good idea. The blocks are 8.5x8.5x18. To get better milage out of my blocks my plan was to cut them in half to make a bunch of squares. This should work great for the BB loads at extended range, and it might also work for the #4 buck at extended range. Not sure it would work for the 00 buck though...

Cheers,

Brobee
 
Got another one edited and uploaded last night:

As requested by a viewer, here's Remington's Express Long Range Lead BB:



Will be leaving the bb world now, next up is Federal's Premium 00 buckshot into gelatin at 5 yards, 20 yards, and 40 yards.

Cheers!

Brobee
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: GCOriginally Posted By: doggin coyotes...Brobee, I'd not even bother with the 5 and 20 yard tests.

40, 50 maybe even 60 would be way more relevant information for most of us here.

But no matter what you do, Thanks for doing it.

+1 to shooting at a more practical distance. More chokes of varying constrictions would be helpful. Be careful about drawing conclusions from the result of a single shot. One shot simply isn't enough statistical data to conclude the result as a fact. As coyote hunters we aren't all that concerned with steel shot loads so lead and tungsten of B size and up to No. Four Buck is where it is at.

Beyond that this is a staggering amount of work, sweat, time and expense that few can really appreciate. I do understand this and I do appreciate your efforts. I think they could be an excellent contribution to all the data at the top of the page in the big shotgun sticky if you were so inclined as to post them there. Derbyacresbob did some very good penetration testing that is contained in that thread and there are numerous choke, load and pattern test in there for a reference.

+2
 
Very interesting. I'll look forward to your future tests.

BTW I like your presentation. Stright and to the point.

Thanks!!
 
Hi again!

As suggested by you folks, here's my first attempt at a longer range format. I made some mistakes (ie: not enough gelatin for the 20 and 40 yard blocks, and not enough rounds in the 20 yard test) - I'll fix these in future episodes though!

Federal Premium Copper Plated Lead 00 Buckshot with FliteControl Wad:



Thoughts about the test format?

Next to edit - same format for #4 buckshot.

Cheers,

Brobee
 
Got another one edited up this weekend...and I've been using it to deadly effect on coyotes this past month out of my new versamax! 6 and counting so far...:)

Hornady's Varmint Express Lead #4 Buckshot:



I got out this past weekend and filmed a bunch of different slug reviews...will get to editing them pronto!

Cheers, and thanks for watching.

Brobee
 
Last edited:
I have been doing some pattern testing with black cloud steel BBB, all i can say is i am going to use these for yotes this winter, i know it goes aganist all wisdom here but i got to try em. Of the loads i have tried nothing patterns like black cloud. I hope you get to testing the BBB BC loads because i want to see how your guns do.
 
Originally Posted By: dennydI have been doing some pattern testing with black cloud steel BBB, all i can say is i am going to use these for yotes this winter, i know it goes aganist all wisdom here but i got to try em. Of the loads i have tried nothing patterns like black cloud. I hope you get to testing the BBB BC loads because i want to see how your guns do.

As luck would have it, I long-range-tested the Black Cloud BBB load just this past weekend. I'm working on editing the long range test episode for Hornady's 3 inch BB load first, but then I'll edit the steel BBB episode.

The steel BBB patterns super-tight in all my cylinder bored and improved cylinder guns, but the long range gelatin test with it was eye-opening in the disappointment department. I've been out hunting coyote with all three, and the #4 lead buckshot is definitely the most effective.

As soon as I get the bb episode uploaded, (and maybe a couple coyote hunting episodes I've also got filmed) my plan is to approach hornady and see if I can pitch to them a 3 inch versatile wadded T or F swaged lead load...I think it would be awesome for coyote! I'll also ask for a high density tungsten BBB load. When I go to do this though, it would sure help for hornady to see there is a big market for them....having a mega high view count on my videos would sure help in this department, so please pass the links out to your friends and help me get my hit count up!

Cheers, and thanks for your help!

Brobee
 
Last edited:
Thanx for all your effort - I feel like we oughta be contributing to all you guys that work on this stuff and take all the time to post it all - gotta be expensive and very time-consuming.

Question - I didn't catch it even reviewing it again, but what choke were you using this time with the Hornady round?
 
Originally Posted By: dennydi know it goes aganist all wisdom here but i got to try em.

I had to touch the electric fence too. He11, I didn't believe em when they said it would shock me.
lol.gif


Originally Posted By: dennydOf the loads i have tried nothing patterns like black cloud.

Even good patterns don't mean much if the shot won't do the damage needed to incapacitate. I'm sure the BC will do the job if the coyote is close enough though. So will a #8 dove load. Good luck.
 
Originally Posted By: Mike BThanx for all your effort - I feel like we oughta be contributing to all you guys that work on this stuff and take all the time to post it all - gotta be expensive and very time-consuming.

Question - I didn't catch it even reviewing it again, but what choke were you using this time with the Hornady round?

My 870 police mags have improved cylinder for choke.

For now, I think the best way for anyone to contribute is to simply spread the word around their social networks...if I can build a healthy audience it will greatly enable me to do more next spring/summer/fall. I managed to film about another dozen or so episodes on top of what I've posted so far; I'll be editing them together over the next few months and posting them as I get them done, tut after that I'm likely going to gauge interest to decide if I'm going to keep going.

Cheers, and thanks for watching!

Brobee
 
My best black cloud BBB's patterns come from improved cyl choke, i want to say they start out at 1450fps, i can't imagine a coyote running away to join it's mates after getting a facefull of these.
 
Back
Top