Tactical Night Vision

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#2535671 - 08/24/13 12:09 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
6mm06 Offline
PM senior

Registered: 07/31/05
Posts: 8120
Loc: USA

Jeff, no, your eyes deceived you. The scope has two rings mounted into the rear tube section behind the turrents.
I wanted to get the scope far forward on the rifle so the bullet camera wouldn't extend so far rearward into my face
when shooting.










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#2535715 - 08/24/13 03:23 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
Cougar Jim Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 125
Loc: Oregon
Is there anyone here that know's anything about the
Sightmark IR-805 Infrared Illuminator SM19075

[img:center][/img]
_________________________
If I ever offend anyone on this board it will be out of ignorants not malice.

My father always told me A man is only as good as his word and I truly believe that.


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#2535979 - 08/25/13 12:05 PM Re: Baiting [Re: 6mm06]
NYyotekiller Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 11/01/09
Posts: 666
Loc: Van Etten, NY
Originally Posted By: 6mm06
Yotekiller, just jump in and hang on. Can you guys hunt with NV up there?


Yes we can use NV, It's just a little out of my price range right now. I guess I'll have to settle for my red LED setup until I can swing a NV setup like you guys have. I can't wait to see how your season goes with the NV.

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#2536123 - 08/25/13 07:16 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
cozwurth Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/24/13
Posts: 37
Loc: SE Virginia
New guy from SE Virginia here... I've spent the last several days reading through all 119 pages of this thread. Lots of good info here...

David, I like the shed setup you have, and the DIY NV setup. Someone mentioned the Sony night-shot way back in the thread, which got me to thinking about a camera looking through the scope. Then you start testing the bullet camera setup. I'm hoping that this setup works out because a regular NV setup is way out of my price range right now. That, and my old Sony night-shot camera is too big to mount on a rifle. LOL

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#2536143 - 08/25/13 08:26 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
6mm06 Offline
PM senior

Registered: 07/31/05
Posts: 8120
Loc: USA

Cozwurth, a hearty welcome to the forums. Where in Virginia do you live? This is a great place, with lots of information. We are looking forward to your reports and photos.

The home-made night vision is really nice, as far as being able to see well. If I can solve the POI shift, then I will wholeheartedly recommend this home-made version.

UPDATE: I spoke with Roland via e-mail pertaining to the POI problem. He reported that he has not experienced any issues like that, nor has he heard from anyone who has. He also mentioned that his scope has an adjustable objective for parallax, but we both think my zero should hold since I sight in via the LCD screen and not looking through the scope, then attaching the bullet camera later. I do think the Tasco scope is the issue and not the bullet camera / NV setup.

With the Eagle Tac illuminator, the whole deal costs less than $300. But, as I mentioned earlier, if you hunt from a bait site and a stationary position, you don't even need an illuminator. Trail camera IR will illuminate very well and you won't have any problem seeing. You just need a camera that will record video long enough to get a shot off. That why I like the Bushnell. It will do 60-second videos.

The storage building turned into a cabin has been a great retreat for me. I couldn't hunt these coyotes without it. I have stayed the night in it with temps well below 20 degrees and kept warm. Thus far I have taken 7 coyotes from the cabin, all with night vision. Six were taken with the dedicated Gen 1 ATN scope, and this last one of course with this new home-made deal.

Jim, I don't have any personal experience with the illuminator you mentioned, nor any 805nm illuminator, but I have an opinion for what it's worth. Not sure what your intended purpose for it is. I'll share what I have learned about illuminators, lights and wave spectrums. Please forgive me if I'm hashing over stuff you already know, but perhaps this info might help someone else.

I have had quite a bit of experience with 850nm lights, and an illuminator that operates at 850nm as well. Also, most trail cameras operate, to my understanding, at 850nm or thereabouts, and I have learned how animals respond to those wave lengths.

What I have learned is this - coyotes do see the red glow from 850nm IR (I can too), and the 805nm will have even more of a glow than an 850nm (higher the number, the less glow). Coyotes react differently to that glow since they are individuals. Some will tolerate it, or come to tolerate it better, while others never seem to and will jump and run when a trail camera kicks on. I've had coyotes tolerate the IR light one night, only to jump and run another night. Go figure.

My personal thinking is this, if you are searching for an infrared illuminator, get one with a high nm rating as long as your scope / camera will see it.

The 805nm may work well for you, but my thoughts are to go as covert as you can and get a higher number, maybe an 850nm or even higher, depending on what you need.

Just recently I purchased a DC-powered light that operates at 940nm. It's powerful. I have been wanting to test a 940nm light for quite some time, and finally took the plunge and got one. This light, shipped, was just under $100. It is total black out, no visible light at all that I can see. The only thing a coyote might be able to see would be the light housing itself.

Here's the 940nm light.






I tested this 940nm light from my shooting bench in my back yard, shinning it down the path to the target in the woods at 60 yards. I could barely see, not well enough to shoot. That was with the little home-made NV outfit. BUT, when I moved the light closer to the target, maybe 10 yards away from it, I could see extremely well from the bench to the 60-yard target. Most NV scopes do not see well (distances) with 940nm to my understanding. This little camera deal saw good light, but the light had to be closer to the target (bait site area) since it won't project a useable beam of light any great distance. Mounted on a tree or post near the bait site, this light should work like a charm.

By the way, lights like the 940nm one are also available in 850nm and are much cheaper, about half the cost of the 940, but they do give off a red glow. Also, both lights (940 & 850) have their own photo cells, so they will automatically turn on and off at dusk and dawn if you want to hook them up to a large DC battery, or they also operate at 110 volt AC with an adapter.

Not sure what your purpose is for the 805nm illuminator, but I will say this. "If" you are hunting over bait from a stationary position, then you might want to consider getting an IR light instead of illuminator, placing the light nearer the bait, and use a remote control switch (cheap on Ebay) to turn it on and off from your hunting blind / house when the alarm goes off. Believe me, the little remote control device works like a charm. I now have 5 of them. I'm in the process of mounting the 940nm light near the bait site and wiring in a newly purchased remote switch, though I may not even need it after seeing how well the Bushnell trail camera IR worked the other night.

But, if you want an illuminator for "out and about" hunting, or don't want to go to the trouble of setting up IR lights at the bait site, remote switches and stuff, then take a look at the Eagle Tac T100C2 IR that operates at 850nm. It sells for something like $70. You can find it at Illumination Gear.com. Tod is a good guy to work with.

That illuminator will generally allow you to see very well, while not producing a brighter light that an 805nm would. As well, the Eagle Tac is not so expensive.

Here's the Eagle Tac. It will fit inside a 1" scope ring.







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#2536242 - 08/26/13 01:38 AM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
Cougar Jim Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 125
Loc: Oregon
David
Thanks for the the reply.They advertise this IR 805 infrared as being invisible to the human and animal both but you have to use it with a night vision camera. I have a red led light that works very good.
(C4P Striker). It's about the same size as the T100c2 just a little longer. That is what I shot the Fox with at 45 yds and it was turned to the lowest setting. I was going to use the IR for some night calling but I think I will just stick with my red led light.


Edited by Cougar Jim (08/26/13 01:41 AM)
_________________________
If I ever offend anyone on this board it will be out of ignorants not malice.

My father always told me A man is only as good as his word and I truly believe that.


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#2536294 - 08/26/13 09:18 AM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
6mm06 Offline
PM senior

Registered: 07/31/05
Posts: 8120
Loc: USA

Jim, yea, for night calling you would need some sort of an illuminator.

It would indeed be nice if the 805nm were invisible to both human and animal eyes. Somehow I doubt the company's claim. If 850nm can be seen, then surely 805nm would.

I noticed the illuminator you referred to is similar in price to the Eagle Tac.

Good luck with whatever you choose.


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#2536340 - 08/26/13 12:20 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
Mr Benelli Offline
Die Hard Member

Registered: 03/22/10
Posts: 863
Loc: Parris Island
6mm06, FYI ...sometimes when you put scope rings too close and too tight near the adjustment knobs that can change poi...or make it difficult to focus or zoom. I try to keep them a finger width away.

On the smart coyotes...i keep the eagletac ir covered until im ready to use it...sometimes i get busted with the shinny inside part...

Great posts!
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#2536506 - 08/26/13 07:49 PM Re: Baiting [Re: 6mm06]
cozwurth Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/24/13
Posts: 37
Loc: SE Virginia
Originally Posted By: 6mm06

Cozwurth, a hearty welcome to the forums. Where in Virginia do you live? This is a great place, with lots of information. We are looking forward to your reports and photos.

The home-made night vision is really nice, as far as being able to see well. If I can solve the POI shift, then I will wholeheartedly recommend this home-made version.


David,
Thanks for the welcome. My name is David, too, BTW. I'm in SE Virginia, just outside of Franklin. I'm mainly interested in thinning out a few fox from around my chickens right now, but I won't pass up a good shot on a yote if I get the chance. I have a neighbor who is really into trapping and calling coyotes. He and his son brought over a Foxpro caller, decoy, and his weapons of choice. He operated the caller and the light, and his son and I were the shooters. I used his son's Savage .223 to drop a fox that night, within the first few minutes of calling. He was DRT. That .223 put a surprisingly large hole in the side of that fox, but nothing on the other side.



I know there are more out there, and I want to thin their ranks a little. I like to let my birds out to range in the yard...it cuts down on the feed bill at least.

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#2536547 - 08/26/13 09:13 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
6mm06 Offline
PM senior

Registered: 07/31/05
Posts: 8120
Loc: USA

Mr. Benelli, thanks for the info on the scope rings. If that's the problem, then I can correct it easily enough. The only problem is that the bullet camera would extend back pretty far and make putting my cheek on the stock a bit cumbersome, if at all. As to finger width apart, I had to set them to accommodate the picatinny mount on the rifle, so had little choice with that.

Cozwurth (David), I have hunted before near Franklin, many years ago while in the military, stationed at Norfolk. I did some squirrel hunting over there on a pheasant / game bird preserve. Small world.

You will find in most cases, that the .223 is just too much gun for fox, that is if you are saving the skins. Otherwise it's perfect.

Do you have a lot of coyotes in that area?



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#2536620 - 08/26/13 11:50 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
DoubleUp Online
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 12/18/10
Posts: 2895
Loc: USA
Cougar Jim, I think the confusion on the light wave lengths and visibility below 940 nm comes in because the actual light coming from from the IR device is invisible, but when looking into the face of the IR device itself the glow of the led's is visible to humans and canids as well. So in that sense a company can claim the light is invisible while not mentioning that the source of the light is visible. A 940 nm is totally invisible even when looking at the source.
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#2536651 - 08/27/13 01:56 AM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
Cougar Jim Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 125
Loc: Oregon
Thank you Doubleup for clearing that up for me. I think I will look for a 940 nm.
_________________________
If I ever offend anyone on this board it will be out of ignorants not malice.

My father always told me A man is only as good as his word and I truly believe that.


Top
#2536833 - 08/27/13 04:41 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
6mm06 Offline
PM senior

Registered: 07/31/05
Posts: 8120
Loc: USA

Jim, just be aware that a 940nm will not throw a beam very far, maybe 25-30 yards if that, so if you are out and about calling, then that high a nm might not work well. But, for setting a 940nm up near a bait site, the little bullet camera is peachy keen and sees very well.

The reason I wanted to try the 940nm is due to stealth. I don't want coyotes to see the red glow that comes from an 850nm and below.

I have read that someone said a 940nm gives off a very faint purple glow. But, my light doesn't give off any detectable light all that my eye can see. I didn't stare it, just quickly glanced to see if there was light emitted. There was nothing but dark that I could see. Amazing, and I was standing within a few yards of the light. Under similar conditions, I can see the red glow of an 850nm.



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#2536897 - 08/27/13 06:31 PM Re: Baiting [Re: Cougar Jim]
Cougar Jim Offline
Seasoned Member

Registered: 11/20/10
Posts: 125
Loc: Oregon
Thanks David.
I am looking for some kind of night vision I can use on my bait pile and still do some calling by roaming around. The Coyotes around here are kinda jumpy with a light. My red led works good for most animals but not with yots. I am keeping an eye on your rig but I don't know about roaming around with all that on my gun? I would like to see something a little smaller and cheap LOL. What would be a good scanning light that is good for about a 100 yds and oh yes CHEAP.
_________________________
If I ever offend anyone on this board it will be out of ignorants not malice.

My father always told me A man is only as good as his word and I truly believe that.


Top
#2536940 - 08/27/13 08:37 PM Re: Baiting [Re: 6mm06]
cozwurth Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/24/13
Posts: 37
Loc: SE Virginia
Originally Posted By: 6mm06

Cozwurth (David), I have hunted before near Franklin, many years ago while in the military, stationed at Norfolk. I did some squirrel hunting over there on a pheasant / game bird preserve. Small world.

You will find in most cases, that the .223 is just too much gun for fox, that is if you are saving the skins. Otherwise it's perfect.

Do you have a lot of coyotes in that area?


Yep, small world. I don't know how many coyotes are around, but I know we have them. I've heard two howling from different areas behind my property on several occasions. One of my neighbors hunts/calls on a regular basis and has taken quite a few locally. I'm mainly concerned with the fox raiding my chickens. I've never lost one to a predator while they were contained in their run, but I like to have them loose in the yard doing chicken things and eating bugs during the day. Lower feed bills are nice, too. Happy chickens make for tasty eggs. thumbup

I've been debating on whether to get another gun or not. I have a .22 LR bolt action rifle, and a 9mm carbine. I know that neither are good for very long range, but I really won't have any shots on my property longer than 100 yards. I'm trying to find some ballistics info on some 9mm +P and +P+ to see if there is any possibility of adequate accuracy and energy left at 100 yards. The COR-BON 90GR hollow point +P looks promising with 1750 FPS from a 16.5 inch barrel, according to ballistics by the inch website. Looking at ballistics for the rifles, it seems that a lighter/faster bullet is the way to go. I know that my carbine will never see the same velocities as a .223, so the COR-BON or Buffalo Bore with a light (for a 9mm anyway) bullet in +P or +P+ will be about the best I'll ever achieve. I'll probably end up getting a box or two for testing anyway. I'm also looking into the possibility of a Remington 700 in .270 that my bro-in-law has, but that would be even harder on the fur than the .223. My shot with the .223 left a fist-sized hole on the hit side with no exit as it was. Blew the whole shoulder out, too. Any advice on this note?

Back to baiting... Once the weather shifts I'll be clearing a shooting lane out into the woods behind one of my sheds to set up a bait pile. The range will probably be about 50 yards or so. I have a window that I can install in the shed, and I can build the rest.

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