FFL Transfer question

P

pyscodog

Active member
Just been wondering. Alot of people sell firearms and say "Your FFL must accept from a non FFL (or individual)". What "IF", theres a problem like the firearm is stolen or had been stolen a long time ago? I'm not sure what I'm trying to ask. Does the buyer just end up SOL and lose his money or the seller arrested, recieving FFL get into trouble. I know the reason most use this way, its so they don't have to pay an FFL to ship their firearm. I'm just curious of the end results.
 
Never had a dealer check serial #'s to see if a gun was stolen or not.That is usually done on request only, when they call in your info to NICS they do not include any serial #'s or even make and model of gun you are buying. All they ask for is long gun or handgun.
 
In Tn at all the places I know about you must give the NICS the serial number of the gun and if it is stolen and in their data base the police will come to the dealer and pick up the gun.Whoever owns it is out what they paid.Also if when the check is run and anything shows up in the background the dealer can not transfer the gun to that person till cleared up.I don't know if it is law or not but most dealers wont transfer to someone else for you because they consider that a straw purchase.Also if you pawn your gun they do the check when you go to pick it up.Bad check,you don't get the gun back.I am not 100% sure all this is law,some dealers are just really carefull,and I don't blame them.I would not want to lose my FFL on a deal I was making 10 or 20 bucks on.Some things are gray areas I recon because even ATF Agents may give different answers to the same question.
 
I figure if a guy isn't willing to ship through an FFL ... then he shouldn't be disappointed when he can't find a buyer.

Why not just do things so that the buyer and seller can both have a sense of security?

JMO!
 
The dealer I go though only wants them from another FFL. He did tell me he can accept from non FFL, but the reason he wants them from another FFL is that he's covered in the event the ATF shows up asking questions. When I ship or receive firearms through my FFL I figure it's cheap insurance in case ATF shows up at my door.
 
There is no 'requirement', nor is it a normal practice, for FFLs to call in the serial number to the Federal Government on a purchase or sale of a firearm...

However, even a private individual, buying on a face to face basis, is entitled to call their local law enforcement agency to have a description and serial number checked prior to a transfer...The agency has access to the national data base and for peace of mind it's a good practice to do..

Most pawn shops, are required to submit to their local agencies the description of every item that is brought in...Most of the time this is through a computerized data base that LEOs check when a loss or theft is reported...and it that case, if an item turns up, the dealer is out the money paid and the item is recovered, to be returned to the proper owner after the investigation is completed..

We have three gun shops in town and two will accept firearms from out of state individuals with only a copy of a driver's license and one requires receipt from another FFL...It's a personal/professional choice on their parts...
 
Originally Posted By: bigbird243Never had a dealer check serial #'s to see if a gun was stolen or not.That is usually done on request only, when they call in your info to NICS they do not include any serial #'s or even make and model of gun you are buying. All they ask for is long gun or handgun.

Same here. The serial number doesn't even go on the form until the NICS comes back clear.
 
I guess it must be done different from state.I worked in a gun shop and ran several guns and always was asked for the serial number.As far as if they was supposed to ask,maybe not,but they did.How would they know if it was stolen or not.I know personaly of stolen guns turning up at the time of sale and had to be turned over to the police.There was even one case I know of that a fellow had pawned his gun. When he went to pick it up it showed up stolen from years ago and he lost it.I don't know if thats the law or not but thats the way it is here.
 
I prefer not to ship from my FFL when selling, because of the time and cost. If my buyer requests it, I am willing to at their cost and my time.

I have only had one buyer that didn't want to find another dealer, and paid for my FFL to ship it out.

I am not a business, just my experience with selling from my private collection from time to time.

The reason I understand more and more dealers want a firearm shipped from another FFL, is to make sure the letter of the law is followed in the transfer and has nothing to do with the legality/background of the weapon.
 
Yes I think that is why they do thing the way they do here.I guess federal law should be the same everywhere but it seems to be interpreted different by the state at general slightly so dealers go the extra mile just to be safe.I don't know of a dealer searching to try and find out if the weapon it stolen or anything,it always just turned up in the process of the transfer.Most pawn shops don.t run the weapon.They run the buyer and anything that comes out of that is not their fault.They don't run the weapon till they sell it.They won't buy a weapon to start with if they think anything could be wrong.It has been practice to make a fellow do a background check any time he pawns or consigns a gun then picked it up .However an ATF agent told us the other day that that did not need to be done so It's hard to tell.I have a couple of friends that sold out because they said it was so bad they could not be sure if they were legal or not.
 
In discussion with local FFL down here in Florida after a long gun transfer on my out of state ID. He was explaining why he had to cover his backside in every respect. Told me numerous stories of attempted ATF stings he had been confronted with. Some of the things they had tried to pull on him were crazy. I did not blame him one bit for the care he took in making sure he was abiding by the law, nor would I blame any FFL for refusing to accept from a non-licensed private party. ATF does play them from every angle at times.
 
There is absolutely no federal reason for a firearm to be shipped from an FFL.

If somebody requires it, they are just trying to generate revenue for other FFLs.

Jack
 
Originally Posted By: Jack RobertsThere is absolutely no federal reason for a firearm to be shipped from an FFL.

If somebody requires it, they are just trying to generate revenue for other FFLs.

Jack


Around here it used to be a flat $10-$20 for a transfer. Now, at $60-$80 a pop + tax on the sale price of the firearm, me thinks Admin Jack is on to something! To boot, those that are collecting tax on the sale price aren't necessarily turning it in either.
 
To give an idea about different dealers.I bought a gun on line,the dealer cost was 60 dollars.The next time I bought a gun on line the cost with a different dealer was 20 dollars.Some feel they should make some money,some do it as a favor to their customers now and then.
 
It has nothing (in our case anyway) to do with generating revenue for other FFLs. I'm not here to make money for other shops. It has everything to do with covering all our legal bases. As far as transfer fees. The firearm recieved has to be entered in the shops log books, the customer notified it has arrived, background check filled out and called in, then logged out of shops books. If the charge is $20 the shop may or may not be breaking even.
 
Originally Posted By: Ricky BobbyI figure if a guy isn't willing to ship through an FFL ... then he shouldn't be disappointed when he can't find a buyer.

Why not just do things so that the buyer and seller can both have a sense of security?

JMO!

Well put!
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Jack RobertsThere is absolutely no federal reason for a firearm to be shipped from an FFL.

If somebody requires it, they are just trying to generate revenue for other FFLs.

Jack

Not trying to be argumentative. I thought there was something about interstate commerce in firearms that required the involvement of FFLs.

I know a person can ship to the manufacturer of the firearm for repair and the manny can ship back to the owner.

Edit - http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/ATF_I_5300%2023A.pdf
 
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Originally Posted By: im4flightDOA, can you educate us as to what kind of leagal issues you have seen accepting firearms directly from private citizens?

I'd be interested in hearing of those issues also.
 
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