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#2203773 - 04/19/12 10:59 PM Difference between MRAD and MOA?
ducati07 Offline
New Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 16
Loc: NOR CAL
Can someone explain the difference between the two? I'm interested in a new scope and I'm trying to figure out which one I'm going to get.

Thanks!

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#2203785 - 04/19/12 11:16 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: ducati07]
BOBTAILS Offline
PM senior

Registered: 03/28/05
Posts: 8903
Loc: behind the crosshairs
As far as I know typical moa's are .25 per click and Mrad is .1 per click. Mrad let's you be a lot more precise. A lot of shooter that compete in tactical matches use these. While moa is more suited for hunting, JMO.
_________________________
Guns have ony 2 emenies- Rust and Politicians.

Wolves don't lose sleep, over the opinion's of sheep.


Carver Predator calls Prostaffer, Made in the USA!!
www.carverpredatorcalls.com





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#2203796 - 04/19/12 11:37 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: BOBTAILS]
venatic Offline
Retired Moderator

Registered: 06/11/03
Posts: 6987
Loc: In the right lane
This is a subject I am trying to learn since I recently acquired two Mrad scopes.
Actually since 1/4 MOA clicks are .261 @100yards which everyone rounds to .25 for easy math and a tenth of a Mradian is .36 @100 yards it not really as precise but one of several reasons its gaining popularity is it takes less clicks to go say from 100 yards to 600 yards than MOA....
I think that is correct anyway.
_________________________
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."

Jack O'Connor 1963


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#2203798 - 04/19/12 11:44 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: BOBTAILS]
skinney Offline
Die Hard Member III

Registered: 12/21/09
Posts: 3248
Loc: South Dakota
1 MOA @ 100yds = 1.047 inches
1 MIL @ 100yds = 3.6 inches

MOA is usually broken down to .25 MOA per click, which = roughly a quarter inch @ 100yds, although there are some 1/8 and even 1MOA per click...
MIL is "usually" 1/10th of a mil per click which would = .36" @ 100yds

many have their preferences,
watch these very carefully...




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#2203806 - 04/19/12 11:56 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: skinney]
venatic Offline
Retired Moderator

Registered: 06/11/03
Posts: 6987
Loc: In the right lane
Good post Skinney.... I have watched these but could not remember where I found them before.

An example of what I was saying above I just checked my .243 load sighted at 100 yards.
It takes 44 clicks on a MOA scope to get to 600yards
It only takes 32 clicks on a Mil scope to get to 600 yards.
_________________________
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."

Jack O'Connor 1963


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#2203904 - 04/20/12 08:24 AM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: ducati07]
knockemdown Offline
suburban redneck

Registered: 02/19/03
Posts: 4744
Loc: NY
MRAD & MOA are both angular measurements.
I could type the mathematical derivation of both, but that just gets jumbled & confusing. So here's brass tacks:

MRAD is a "base 10" system, meaning measurements are in increments of tenths of a whole number. 1.1, 1.2, 1.3, 1.4 etc... very easy to remember, numerically...

MOA uses a fractional system, and there are scopes that can have 1/8 MOA, 1/4MOA, and even 1/2 MOA adjustments.

If you want a correlation between the two, 0.1mrad is roughly equal to 1/3MOA. So a traditional 1/4MOA adjusting scope is only slightly more fine in adjustment than a 0.1mrad adjustment would be.

Since 1 MOA meaures 1.047" @ 100yds, that initially makes the measurement easier for some shooters to get a handle on.
But many others find the base 10 mrad system more intuitively simple when dealing with dialed corrections and interpolating a mil based reticle.

Like everything else, it all boils down to personal preference and how you shoot will determine what might work best for you. A BR shooter might prefer a 1/8MOA adjusting scope to dial his POI in very precisely, where a tactical shooter might run MRAD since it's plenty precise and much easier to employ for engaging somewhat larger targets at a wide range of distances.

Whichever one you decide to try, DON'T COUNT CLICKS and DON'T think about your trajectory in inches! Once you break you mind of that vicious cycle, you'll be way ahead of learning curve.

What type of shooting are you wanting this new scope for?


Edited by knockemdown (04/20/12 01:36 PM)
Edit Reason: sp & clarity

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#2203915 - 04/20/12 08:40 AM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: venatic]
knockemdown Offline
suburban redneck

Registered: 02/19/03
Posts: 4744
Loc: NY
Dave, allow me to translate what a single 0.1mrad "click" and a 1/4moa "click" will correct for @ 1,000yds

1/4moa @ 1,000yds = 2.6"

0.1mrad @ 1,000yds = 3.6"

The tiny 1" anomaly between those two systems at such a great distance is easily "lost" in the white noise of headwind, tailwind, muzzle velocity variance, shooting form, etc. that there really isn't a valid argument for choosing MOA because it has "finer adjustments".

Just some food for thought...

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#2203964 - 04/20/12 10:04 AM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: knockemdown]
BOBTAILS Offline
PM senior

Registered: 03/28/05
Posts: 8903
Loc: behind the crosshairs
Very well explained Fred.
_________________________
Guns have ony 2 emenies- Rust and Politicians.

Wolves don't lose sleep, over the opinion's of sheep.


Carver Predator calls Prostaffer, Made in the USA!!
www.carverpredatorcalls.com





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#2203975 - 04/20/12 10:33 AM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: BOBTAILS]
Chupathingy Offline
PM senior

Registered: 12/01/07
Posts: 6827
Loc: not here
Great post Fredo!

Chupa

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#2204070 - 04/20/12 03:29 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: Chupathingy]
ducati07 Offline
New Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 16
Loc: NOR CAL
I'm starting to understand. I'm going to have to read and watch these a few times over to get a clue on which scope to choose.

The intended use for the scope is going on a 22-250 for squirrels/varmints in the 200-400 yard range.

I'm looking closely at the Vortex VIPER PST 6-24X50 FFP RIFLESCOPE.

Thanks for the posts!

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#2204108 - 04/20/12 04:48 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: ducati07]
ARCOREY Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 12/27/05
Posts: 4839
Loc: USA
Are you going to be ranging with the reticle? FFP may not be necessary for what you're doing if you aren't ranging on the fly. It's about $250 difference in the Vortex between that scope in FFP and SFP. I have the SFP model 6x-24x-50mm in MOA and use it for varmint hunting. It works great for holds and for spotting my hits and adjusting. I usually shoot anything 100yds+ at max power anyway if the mirage isn't too bad, so FFP is kind of useless for me since the SFP's are calibrated at 24x. The reticle will "appear" larger at max power in the FFP as well. Not sure I'd want that on a varmint rifle for use on squirrels. With a rifle that fast shooting at those ranges, you won't be using much of the reticle or turrets anyways. I'm sure others may have different opinions on this, but I was glad I was talked out of the FFP for my similar application. Spend the money on a good set of 30mm Seekins rings or something similar wink.

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#2204149 - 04/20/12 06:47 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: ARCOREY]
ducati07 Offline
New Member

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 16
Loc: NOR CAL
Good point ARCOREY, at those ranges maybe a FFP wouldn't be necessary. Yes, I will be ranging with the reticle.

I was wrong by just saying that I'd be hunting at those yardages. Often times, those pests pop up only 50 yards in front of me so I'd like to be able to tone it down and still hit them in the eye ball. I should have said, I'd be using it from close, to as far as the gun will shoot. I also have a short 25-50 yard range on my property that will see a little target action.

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#2204221 - 04/20/12 09:10 PM Re: Difference between MRAD and MOA? [Re: ducati07]
ARCOREY Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 12/27/05
Posts: 4839
Loc: USA
With the tremendous amount of elevation adjustment available in that scope, I have a 100yds zero and can run it to the high 900's without maxing out the turrets with a zero MOA base. That is on a 243 with 87gr. V-max in the high 3200fps area. You are likely shooting flatter and will have no problem getting beyond the 600's with the turrets. With a 100yds zero, I can easily take varmints closer with mine. I have video of taking a groundhog off the shooting sticks at 72 yds with mine. Remember a close hold is the same as a distant holdover so in my case I'm at +1 MOA at 50yds as I am at 210yds. I tried ranging with the reticle and am glad I have a good rangefinder. It is much harder than it looks. At distances that really matter, a 50yd error in judgement can be a miss on a small varmint. If you're playing the tactical game, then it's a different story since your target size is much bigger and more of a known consistent size.

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