Loudmouths,that don't own dk

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bgtme

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Howdy Houndsmen,Just wondering after about 5hrs worth of google searching,what charges can be pressed if a man has shut my coyote hounds Garmin off and then meets me and another coyote hunter,while holding my hound in one hand and a pistol in another,in a threatening way.We turned loose on ground we had permission to be on.We had permission in the whole block and this J.A. who is renting his home,decides to hold my dog while he's sporting about a 10" 44.
I thought we were going to have a dog lead vs handgun fight before he finally let him go.I think he knew I was serious.Anyway,I'm the type that normally takes care of things myself,but have a 13yr old girl to raise.So I need to be available for at least 5 more years.I live in Illinois,but still can't find the actual law.
I think an ag.battery,would come into play here,but really don't know.
I guess the thing is,what should I do if the law does nothing.I know what I can do,but would like to find out what the legal aspects are first.
 
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Call your local game warden! Here in NC it is illegal in some counties to remove/tamper with an electronic dog collar.
He may also be in violation of hunter harassment laws.
 
If you had permission from the J.S.s landlord to hunt I would think he would need to know how is renter is handling things as the landlord could have some liability.

This of course assuming that the Landlord isn't also a J.A.
 
The landlord said no problem,but the renter is her 55yr old son.But,she told him to let us hunt,I'm just thinking about the idiot with the handgun?I think we've decided just to let the law handle it,and forget it.
 
Originally Posted By: bgtme I thought we were going to have a dog lead vs handgun fight before he finally let him go.

Had a situation very similar to this go badly outside Yale, OK in Payne County years ago.
Dog man didn't have permission to hunt the land he was on. (Kind of like you on the renters property. Permission on the rest of the block does not equal permission on his property. Renting assumes property rights. Don't get upset. It's a fact.)
Dog man was killed when, while using a dog lead (chain, as I recall), he started beating a man who had his dog corraled.
Man's son killed him with a .30-30.
Dog man dead.
Son found not guilty by jury of dog man's death.
Dog man had a really bad reputation. Even his own cousin testified he was a bully and had it coming.

Permission is the key, BUT EVEN IF YOU ARE RIGHT, are you really willing to get killed over it?

QUOTE:I think he knew I was serious.Anyway,I'm the type that normally takes care of things myself,but have a 13yr old girl to raise. So I need to be available for at least 5 more years. QUOTE

Don't let your ego get you killed. He was probably serious, too. Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but the tone of your post would really work against you in court if something bad happened. You won't do your daughter any favors either in prison or dead.

Sometimes human nature gets in the way of human reason.(I'm a retired homicide investigator. I know whereof I speak.)

Just something to think about. Let the game warden and county attorney handle it.

Illinois Hunter and Fisherman Interference Act:

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs3.asp?ActID=1881&ChapterID=53
 
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Thanks for the info Airedale,but that wasn't the law that I was really looking for.I knew about the hunter harassment law,but I was told that Ill. put in place a couple years ago,a law that says just because your dog enters someones property,the handler can't get a trespassing ticket unless he willfully turns his dogs loose on said ground.Which was not the case at all.
There's been too many people just pick up a dog on the road and say the dog was on them,and wanted to press trespassing charges.Thats another good thing about using Garmins now.I can plug it in to my computer and show exactly where my hound was and the exact time he was there.
I've had dogs on certain coyotes that ran over 30 miles.Some may stay in the same section,some my straight line for 10 miles.
We're going to go write up a report today at the P.D.and get in touch with our local game warden,who happens to be a pretty straight shooter.BTW,the family are the one's that suggested we let the law handle it.They seem to believe our version of the events,rather than his.That should speak volumes right there.
I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.
 
I would start carrying a pistol with you, regardless of how you handle this. I would never want to have to resort to a leash vs. a gun, you stand a much better chance if you have a gun as well in such a situation.

I would much rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

Before everyone gets all silly, I am in no way saying to carry a gun to kill people, I am merely suggesting you be prepared to protect yourself.

Best of luck to you.
 
Thanks Vargy,I was hoping you would see this post and knew that you probably had more info about the subject at hand,and was sure that you probably know the Illinois laws better than I do.I know that you've had some trouble in the past as well.I'm getting tired of feeling like a second class hunter,and coyote hunters always get the worse end.If there is a rut in the field,automatically coyote hunters are blamed,even though it would be obvious the tracks were probably made by some kids the night before.We have more people happy to see us hunting coyotes than the anti's,but it seems like the anti's want to throw their weight around more than the major landowners,who want us there.When would be a good time to call you?I want to press charges to the fullest extent,because I know it will plead out to basically a slap on the wrist.After talking to the law last night,they basically really didn't care.We filed reports today.The cop that taking care of it works 11pm to 7am,so I should have a little more info for you tomorrow.Thanks again,Vargy


Catdog,I did have guns with me but thought if I was to get them out would only escalate the situation.He was obviously looking for a confrontation or he would have given me a call on my cell ph. which has the number on the tag,which he did admit to reading,or let the hound go.No call,just sitting there waiting with his big bore revolver,trying to be someone.Typical coward,I've seen several.
 
bgtme,

Hope you understood the spirit of my post. I tried to provide info and not sound like I was chastising you for your obvious indignance.

Lots of facts that could help with a logical, legal opinion from a prosecutor were not posted in your original post.

I was just trying to make sure that you recognized that you were in a losing situation at the confrontation point. Even if we're right, sometimes it costs us.

Does this link help?:

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs4.asp?DocName=072000050HArt%2E+12&ActID=1876&ChapterID=53&SeqStart=20825000&SeqEnd=29375000

It is Illinois definitions and statutes for crimes against persons.


Good luck and raise that little girl up hunting!
 
No problem Airedale,I took it as good advice and really appreciated your post.I am trying to click on the new link you've posted but it won't open.I don't know what the problem is.My first guess,it's probably me.But we did go down and make out reports at the P.D. yesterday,we'll see what happens from here.
Vargy,I'll try to get in touch tomorrow.Today kinda started out wild and then just got crazier from there.It feels like I still have a phone stuck in my ear.I'm sure you now how it is,everyone calling wondering what the status is while trying to stomp out the B.S. that everyone seems like they want to add to a story.If it keeps going like it is,in another week the gossip will be either he's killed me or I've killed him.Wow,bad news seems to travel at the speed of sound,where good news,the speed of a turtle!
 
Im not a lawyer or even close but i dont think ag battery could be charged. Battery is an escaladed (sp) form of assault. So if he assaulted you or such maybe. Im not sure. Good luck and be safe. I do know that with the courts any evidence you have either the computer docs that show where the dogs were let loose to an eyewitness statement will help you out tons.
 
Thanks for teaching me how to 'copy and paste',that worked.I'm definitely not the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to computers.
Airedale,that link was what I was after,I really appreciate you taking the time to find that for me.
As it stands right now,the deputy that's handling the case hasn't called.I'll give him a couple more days and if I haven't heard from him,I'll give him a call.
Vargy,I did get in touch with the guy you told me to call,and he said to see what the Jefferson County cops do first,and we will go from there.
Thanks again for everyone's help and will try to keep you folks updated.
 
I actually waited a few days before starting this post,but it's been 2 weeks since this happened,even though no reports were filed until the following Monday.
Does it normally take that long,or do you think if he ignores us,we'll just simply lose interest and it will magically go away.
I'm just getting tired of being on the bottom of the list as a houndsmen.Bird hunters seem to get by with everything,and go where ever they want.Well,not really,just checking to see if they checked out this forum.
If by chance you did,please pm me on how high your b.p. was before you could tell I was joking.As well as how long it took to come down!
I'll try to keep you fellers updated.Thanks
 
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