.223 40 grain bullets. Good for Coyotes?

sleddogg

sleddogg

New member
I have a real accurate .223 Remington handload that my gun shoots better than all my other loads. 40 grain Nosler ballistic tip, 27.5 gr. of H335, CCI mag primers. Shoots nice groups, and it is very fast and flat. Its great on varmints (feral cats, ground hog, and crows), and would like to use one load for both varmints and coyotes if its possible. Has anyone used this lighter weight bullet on large coyotes? Most of my coyote shots will be under 125 yards. Varmint shots can be alot farther. Thanks
 
Sleddog

Hit them good and they are DRT (Dead Right There). Shot placement is the most important thing and if you can hit them with 40 grns, go for it. 40 grainers might not be as forgiving as something heavier but I shoot a 17 Rem and I don't feel under gunned.

Reeper
 
Sleddog, I use 40 grain Nosler BT's using Win 748.

I have no complaints with that load. Puts the yotes down in my neck of the woods. If your accuracy is that good, then your ready for the yotes.

I to shoot a .17 and don't feel outguned. But if I go to some of my areas where the range is out around 300 plus, then I take the .223. Most of my shots have been under 150 yards.
 
Where your Nikes, son. Your MA coyotes pull a bit more gravity than those CA dogs, and the Oregon purebreds as well. I finally got rid of my .223 this year after failing to anchor a single coyote well this past season using 40-grainers in the VMax rounds. And I whacked several at less than thirty yards after hitting center mass. My new gun is the 25'06 and I plan on wearing heavy boots from here on out. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
I don't really care for the performance of the 40's on coyotes. Without a doubt they will work like "the hammer of Thor" at times or even most of the time, but I've had blow ups that bothered m from time to time. I've moved up to the 50's and am very happy.
 
You know what? I am about to contradict what I have said in the past about the performance of the 40 grain Ballistic tip bullet in the 223- reguarding dog sized animals.

I have shot over 2 cases of them at different varmints up to coyotes with no problems whatsoever.

I was down at Randy Watson's when I got a chance at a second cat. It was bigger than the first one I had taken. The shot was about 110 yards. I had the crosshairs on his shoulder, but when I pulled the trigger, I watched the shot hit back into the ribcage. He took off like a rocket, even though you could hear "the whack" of the bullet really hard. He was too fast to get off a second shot in the chair but I thought he would die quickly anyway.

We spent a lot of time looking for him, but never found him. After we got back in the truck- Mike, Randy's partner said that they had had some problems before with the 40 grainers and that he and Randy were using 50 or 55 grain bullets on all animals they were killing.

My DPMS loves that bullet, and it is a killer 99% of the time. But I'm wondering what would have happened if I would have taken my 22-250 down there and loaded it down to a moderate load with 50 grain BT's?

All I know is that it hurt to see that cat get away and die somewhere where I couldn't find him.

Just my .02 worth as always.... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif -MP
 
Mr. McCasland, can you tell me what a "blow up" is, as I've not heard that term before.

Just for a little extra info, the terrain I hunt in ranges from heavily wooded with alot of mountain laurel to wide open cut cornfields. But most of the time I am not afforded a perfect broadside or straight on shot. And yes, the coyotes do get large.

I usually hunt with a larger caliber, but was hoping to try a smaller round, and minimize pelt damage. But not at the cost of alot of runners. Thanks
 
Sleddog, a blow up as I know it, is when the bullet expands "blows up" on the surface of the animal.

Say you hit the shoulder where there's alot of bone and the bullet fragments without much penetration. Bullet enters 1-2 inches. Causes a nasty wound, but no real effect and your critter runs off.

With the lighter ballistic tip, v-max style bullets this has happened and been reported in this forum in the past.

I can't argue with the posts from the other fellas about their experiences with 40 grain bullets, I've not had any problems.

Like any caliber or weapon if the shot isn't in place, things will happen. Don't care what anyone says, if you don't hit vitals your target isn't going down right now, its not the bullets fault. Show me pictures of a bullet that penetrated the heart blew it up and the critter ran off some distance.....

The critter will run off and your going to have to track it even if its a short distance. Had that happen a couple of times. As I said my shot was off alittle and it took a few seconds or minutes before the yote bled out, allowing him to run as they will, there tuff critters.

Of course if your shootin a heavy bullet, your wound channel will be bigger and your bullet will penetrate more causing the desired effects. Over penetration will cause nasty exit holes sometimes.

Even if your off the vitals an inch or two, you believe your shot was on the money you might not get that instant kill.

Just my experience and two cents. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
I don't have the magazine to quote verbatim but I recently read an article about the differences in toughness between the Ballistic Tip, The VMax and the Sierra Plastic tipped bullet (Blitzking, maybe?) The author shot 40 grainers into ballistic gelatin and found that the Ballistic Tip was much tougher (less explosive) than the Vmax and Sierra product. His conclusion was that the Ballistic Tip would be his choice for coyotes but for "blow-up" on P dogs and the like he liked the Sierra and the Vmax better. Sorry I can't tell you where the article appeared.
 
It is well known to those of us who have shot a lot of coyotes, that a bullet with good heavy jacket is your best bet. A .223 or .22-.250 with a 55 grain Sierra "Gameking" is ideal for coyotes or bobcats MOST of the time. There is too much bullet "blowup" with the light and frangible SX and blitzking type of bullets which were designed for prairie dogs and other little varmints that you want to blow to smithereens.
 
My experiences were early on in the Balistic tip craze. I was shooting PD's at the time and loved the 40 gr BTs but noticed that the bullet seemed to be inconsistent in the performance. One minute they would blow a PD to pieces on the next shot at an almost identical target they would simply punch a 224 hole. I don't know if this was an oddball batch of bullets or not but some bullets seemed MUCH more explosive than others.

Well anyways, I still had some available when Coyote hunting so I used them on coyotes. Most were DOA hits. But I had one come in to about 30 yards, give me a perfect broadside shot, the shot hit between the back of the ribs and the elbow, a perfect hit really, the hit was easy to hear, the dog went right down, popped right back up and started to run in 30 yard circles, I could see the hole, the blood was spraying everywhere. After about 5 lapps it looked like he was not going to stop so I lined up for another shot but he dropped stone cold dead. A close examination of this coyote showed the entrance hole was about 3" in diameter, the ribs were exposed but not broken, there was a small hole entering the body cavity which turned out to be the bullets base and that is what killed him, there was no exit wound (I hate blood and gore pictures but I took a picture of this coyote). By all rights this coyote should never been able to take a single step after the shot. If he had not run in circles I'm sure that he would have been lost, as it was he ran a long ways before dropping dead. This expereince turned me away from using the 40's for coyotes. But I've often wondered if I got a bad batch of bullets some hard and some ready to fragment at the slightest provocation. Like I said this was in the very beginning of the Nosler BT 40's life. I'd read Steve Timm's first article on the 40gr BT and haunted the suppliers until they were generally available and this bullet came from that first batch of bullets.
 
Thanks for all the info. Seems the 40 grainers can be unpredictable. One member thought the Noslers may be less explosive than the Vmax and Blitzkings. Anyone else heard this? I was hoping to use one load all the time, 'cause that would make things real simple.

Sierra Gameking 55 grainers have been suggested by more than one member to me. They have a HP and SP, which one would be the more reliable coyote taker knowing we can't always get the dog to stand just where we want him to.

Anyone have any pet hand loads for the .223 with 55 Grainers? I have ww748, H335, BLC-2, and IMR 4064 powders on hand.

Be interested in any other thoughts on bullet weight and hand loads you have had luck with harvesting coyotes. Thanks you very much
 
Sleddog, I use a Hornady 52 gr. hpbt match, in my .223. Very accurate , kills coyotes dead, and is very fur friendly. Reasonably priced. Mike Granger got me on them , he has shot them since he was a tyke. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Caution: Not fur friendly on gophers. They look like a red mitten flying through the air. :eek: :eek:
 
I think you have the right buillet but the wrong caliber. I shoot the 40gr, out of the 22-250, and I push them as fast as I can. I have killed over 350 coyctes with this combo and it is a killing machine, very little pelt damage and very forgiving on range estimation due to how flat it shoots. I have shot a few coyotes with this bullet out of a 223 and have had to shoot more than once to put them down.
 
I only shoot 40's solely at PD's and run them hot out of my 22BR. I've had a few problems with the 50gr V-Max out of the 223. Shoots great on paper and blows PD's to pieces. On yotes, it is a different story,,,tends to blow up. I lean towards a 55gr soft point when calling.
 
I don't care who you are, how great your marksmanship is, the caliber of gun you shoot or the style of bullet you use, sooner or later if you shoot enough coyotes your going to get a few that are going to be DR's (dead runners). I've seen many coyotes hit with a PERFECT heart shot, that literally turned the old ticker into mashed potatoes, run for up to 150 yards at full bore before losing their legs and coming to a rolling,tumbling end over end skidding stop. It just amazes me every time I see that happen and luckily most of the terrain I hunt is open enough I get to watch the whole thing and find the dog. The 150 yard DR was the furthest I've ever seen one go, and if I hadn't seen it and paced it off I wouldn't of believed it. These coyotes are awesome critters and the will to live IMO is unmatched by anything else in North America. L.T.
 
Doggin Coytes, I wouldn't argue with your observations, but you didn't say what you shoot..Just curious though???

Your right though they don't run far usually, but there are runners, and wouldn't you agree if your marksmanship skills are poor and your bullet type is questionable, "you'll have more DR's"?? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Agree 100% Dogboy. Poor hits + poor bullet choice are recipies for lost coyotes. I shoot a 22-250 with mostly Nosler 55 grain pills sailing at about 3700 fps. I also reload 52 grain Seirra HPBT's. I like em both for accuracy and killing power, but at times their both pretty hard on fur. Other times a quarter sized entrance and no exit.

Alot has to do with where you hit em, what the bullet path takes afer it penetrates, male or female, when their last meal was, if they've had a bowel movement in the last hour and how big it was, the bloodlines of their parents, if they have cactus in their feet, how many fleas have taken up residence on em, how the moon and stars are lined up and the list goes on and on. :eek:

Sometimes we gotta take the shots we are presented with and their not always the ideal ones. That's where we usually run into problems. Somebody forgot to tell the coyotes how we're supposed to play this game. Take care, L.T.
 
40 gr noslers are a little light . you must place the hit in the boiler room or you will have runners . the v max is way to explosive in my oppinion . I prefer 52 to 55 gr. bullets for coyotes 69 to 70 gr. for longer shots . even the 55 gr. bullets run out of a// past 400 yrds , it will knock them down , just wont anchor them .just my oppinion . jerry .
 
Doggin Coyotes, it's fun to hear everyone and their personal choices of medicine for their local yotes.

I was shootin 55 Nosler BT's the first couple of years I started, I was punchin big holes in these dogs around here.

I love the accuracy of the Noslers even though their a little expensive compared to other brands, which I have no complaints about accuracy either.

Thanks for the reply. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
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