What is a Decoy dog?

Mickey is the reason I started using dogs to hunt coyotes.

When I saw that coyote challange howl in front of her, I knew that this was a whole nother level, and I was going to train a dog to do it.

Stay after them
Kelly.

PS I like small white colored dogs. They are easy for old eyes to see when it is getting dark. Don't realy know if it makes any differance to the coyotes.
 
Kelly,
Mickey was the reason for me as well. I've seen coyotes do the same and its something to see. They do it in the fall as well. A GOOD dog can really make the difference. But it takes time and coyotes to make a good dog.
Brent
 
Why I went with decoy/tolling dogs and the training ...

Despite the fact that I had always grown up around hunting dogs of some form or fashion ,I had zero knowledge of using an interactive dog when coyote hunting. Turning out trail or sight hounds sure...but never a dog that merged the interaction of directing a dog as in bird hunting with the unique situations involved in calling coyotes .

At first, like you Devin, I some what questioned the need as ,like you said, there are lots of decoys on the market that don't require feed or shots. Very true....but then I learned several years ago that I was missing alot of coyotes that were coming in close but I wasn't seeing them. Time and again, I would see a coyote 400+ yards out sitting there and looking in my direction and not coming in. I always thought that was weird, a coyote responds to the call but then doesn't come in. Why ? Eventually, I learned by process of seeing alot of fuzzy butts headed out in a hurry that they were waiting out the other coyotes already there. Or I'd glance up just in time to see a coyote with-in 30 yards who had also figured out the jig was up. I decided I needed to change something. I needed a "bobber" .
At first I brought my trusty Lab along with me. He was already used to sitting next to me while I made funny sounds with my mouth. And it worked great !! As soon as he winded an in-coming coyote , he made no secret that we were about to be boarded . I shot the coyote and things were great...until we had to follow up one that had been wounded . Labs are great dogs,however, they lack the genetic technique of fighting that many breeds have. Sight hounds and many of the working terrier breeds are straight up ninjas in a fight...they have the speed,power,"fire in the belly" and innate knowledge how to fight. One good tussle with a wounded coyote and Fisher decided he would rather tangle with geese and ducks in frozen lakes than fight coyotes.
 
(cont.) Enter the Airedale...


Last winter , a friend of mine ( Andy Laughlin) called and told me had pups on the ground out of his Kate dog who was out of one of Matt Thom's dogs. I told him I wanted two boys...that's how Poncho and Willie came to the House of Proffitt last March. I chose the Airedale for a multitude of reasons. Being as how breed choice is so subjective,I'll just say they have the 'fire in the belly' I like. And ours have been no disappointment. Working members of the family.

Training...or at least how I've done it.

Biggest problem with how to train a toller involves the game involved. It's not like working pointers or retrievers where some planted pigeons or dummies suffices. Whole different game.Eventually I hit upon a plan.
From the get-go I demanded obedience ,specifically sit-stay. Over and over, and still do daily many times through out the day. Same with 'here'. Once they were good to go...we moved on to coons.
I chose coons for two reasons...1. They respond readily to calls. I wanted my dogs to associate odd noises coming from the boss with excitement and anticipation. I wanted them to begin scanning and searching the area trying to find the critter that was no doubt either coming or already there.
2. Even if the odd chance that my 8 month old pups had caught one, the likely hood of it being fatal were slim. A good chase and then up a tree goes the coon,sure. A possible fight requiring some staples ? Sure. But hey...that's life with a hunting dog. And it worked .Poncho and Willie soon learned that calling sequences mean 'fun' and stay alert, and (very importantly) that the tone from the caller means return to the boss.
So now,here we are at 10 months old getting ready to actually start putting fur on the ground and in the fur shed. I'm pretty optimistic.First season and they still have alot to learn, but school's in session.
 
Aaron, Thanks for chiming in. All this info helps alot. So are you using your dogs as "Decoy dogs" or "Toll dogs"? It has been an eye opener to me and many others. What I thought people were callin a all around dog to do it all, from tracking a cripple to tolling a coyote back within shooting distance.
I still fail to see what is so special about a decoy dog.
I have taken puppies out with me to do that job and it didn't take a special breed or any special training. It seems to me any idiot(like myself) can take a dog and make him sit beside him ( or tie him beside him) while calling.

Now if we are talking about a dog that has been taught to hunt for his master and not for itself, one that can go to a howling coyote and bringing it back, to engage and disengage a coyote back to a gun.
One that has enough nose to track up some pretty old tracks back to a den or fresh enough to track down a cripple I just shot.
One that has enough grit to fight 6 coyotes, but smart enough to know this is a game and not to over power a single coyote just because it can.
A dog that can leave a coyote along if I tell him to. One that I don't have to fight back to the truck just because there is a dead coyote close.
Many of us have said what kind of dogs we want now tell me what kind of dogs you all have.
 
Both potlickers, but they be mine. They will not hold a three legged coyote.
They will find a dead one if they want to, then maybe give it a sniff or two. If the coyote had put a bite on them they might shake it a bit.
If I turn them out on a coyote that was shot without them there they will find it most of the time.

They will go to howls sometimes.
They range alittle and are looking hard for coyotes to come to the call. Will engage and return most times without me having to tone them or que them with a whistle.
They know how to work a timid coyote sometimes. I have seen the pup jump up and down on her hind legs begging a coyote that I was looking at in the brush to come out and play, which it finally did after she made a hard run at it and broke off and returned to the open field. Got it on film also. I we can figure out this editing software, might post a clip or three.
Look forward to others post.

PS I still miss my old dog all the time and he wasn't perfect either.

Stay after them
Kelly
 
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Zipper will range out a ways 2-300yards. He will most of the time work like a yo yo with the collar. If I keep him in check with the collar he does good but he does have alot of chase to him and if he is out of sight will run a coyote for miles. I have gotten him to go to howls. I have never seen him with six but handles himself well with two coyotes. He will trail a track hot or cold. He will trail a cripple and either hold it or bay till I get there. Has no problem leaving a dead coyote and heading to the truck. He will blood trail wounded big game. Some days are better than others but he works.

My female Kiya has learned mostly from Zipper. She will range about the same but likes to come back and check in and go back out way more than Zipper. I was getting her to respond to the collar well but some how we lost a reciever and I havent got a new one yet. She is the alpha dog in the house. While calling she will go to a coyote engage it and run it a ways and then come back most of the time without any command to return. It is not that she is that smart or that good but more like she will run it past her safe zone then return. When the coyote gets too close or I tell her to go she will run it a ways then return. While she is chasing a coyote she is bristled up growling and barking the whole time. I have got her to go to a howl a couple of times. She will run a hot track and bay a cripple or dead coyote till I arrive. She will also blood trail big game animals.
 
Originally Posted By: Devin69Aaron, Thanks for chiming in. All this info helps alot. So are you using your dogs as "Decoy dogs" or "Toll dogs"? It has been an eye opener to me and many others. What I thought people were callin a all around dog to do it all, from tracking a cripple to tolling a coyote back within shooting distance.
I still fail to see what is so special about a decoy dog.
I have taken puppies out with me to do that job and it didn't take a special breed or any special training. It seems to me any idiot(like myself) can take a dog and make him sit beside him ( or tie him beside him) while calling.

Now if we are talking about a dog that has been taught to hunt for his master and not for itself, one that can go to a howling coyote and bringing it back, to engage and disengage a coyote back to a gun.
One that has enough nose to track up some pretty old tracks back to a den or fresh enough to track down a cripple I just shot.
One that has enough grit to fight 6 coyotes, but smart enough to know this is a game and not to over power a single coyote just because it can.
A dog that can leave a coyote along if I tell him to. One that I don't have to fight back to the truck just because there is a dead coyote close.
Many of us have said what kind of dogs we want now tell me what kind of dogs you all have.

Mine are being trained to work for me as a toller. To engage and return, follow up and recover. Pretty much the whole gamut, as you described.

Picture577.jpg
 
Good looking Airedales Aaron.
Lets mix this mess up even more.
What is everyone hunting (breed) and what traits do you like, would you improve or just hate about that breed, for coyote hunting,tolling, decoying. What would you change or inprove on?
Does anyone think that there is a certain breed that is better for coyote hunting, decoying, tolling? And WHY?
Remember no right or wrong answer, so everyone join in.
 
Aaron,

Could you elaborate on the coon calling with dogs ? I've seen some video of coon calling during the day but I'm wondering how it would work with the addition of a dog, in particular it seems like the dog would have to be very still and very quiet, which might be hard to expect, especially of a young dog. The idea fascinates me though as I'd rather use a dog for any kind of hunting.
Thanks,
Steve
 
All I can tell you is about my dogs. Zipper who is 1/2 black and tan and 1/2 catahoula, is very smart. I wish he had more grit. I like his stamina but at times he has too much chase. It doesnt happen often but he does forget about the game and is hunting for himself and will run a coyote out of the country he loves to run.

Kiya is full catahoula. She is ok in smarts and in my opinion has the right amount of grit for me. She is lacking in the stamina part.

If I could combine the two I would take Zippers smarts, his athletics, and speed. Out of Kiya I would take her size and her grit.
 
I'll start.
I run Catahoulas, and Catahoula cur crosses,mostly.
I like the brains,grit,and med nose, but would like smaller body size, more voice on a bay, and more range.
 
Originally Posted By: swkAaron,

Could you elaborate on the coon calling with dogs ? I've seen some video of coon calling during the day but I'm wondering how it would work with the addition of a dog, in particular it seems like the dog would have to be very still and very quiet, which might be hard to expect, especially of a young dog. The idea fascinates me though as I'd rather use a dog for any kind of hunting.
Thanks,
Steve

The dog doesn't seem to really make a difference ...kinda. Anytime, I've called 'em in they have been spoiling for a fight anyway. The prescence of the dog seems to excite that.
 
I saw the video at Montanadoggers.com mentioned on another thread. Really liked the video, but saw that both in this video, and on coyote hunting has gone to the dogs that the dogs range in color from white to black and everything in between. Size appears to be between thirty and seventy five pounds for all dogs most of them being in what I think is the 45 to 60 pound range. Is this the only way? No, but in the videos, the folks seem to be very successfull. I know that they do have the power of editing and only show the best cases, but they both still look great. Dont think that I am saying that theirs or my size dogs are any better than anyone elses. Everyone that I have talked to, and others who posted on this thread have made exellent points about smaller dogs. Please watch the video and then chime in not really on color or size, but what do the dogs appear to do well, and what could be improved? Lets speak now about working techniques. When to chase and when to return, things like that. I am looking to learn alot here, so please let me know what you think
DaFUnk
 
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That is a pretty cool video, lots of great dog work and shooting. I didn't see the other thread but thanks for showing this to me Dafunk.
 
Yeah that clip from Montana Doggers is a great example of a " DECOY DOG " .... Bringing your dog along to growl and snap at trapped coyotes or other game does not deserve the title Decoy Dog.
 
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